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Thread: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

  1. #141
    Apani's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    We've been having this headscratcher for quite a long time...
    What kind of swords does Hylian Infantry use?



    I suggest not to take into account their description pics, as they might be outdated or inaccurate, but rather their in-game models. (Also, do Hylian Knights have slightly longer swords or is it just me?)
    A theory is that they're just One-Handed Swords wielded with two hands (apparently it's a tecnique to pierce throught armour, but it's not like Hyrule has many armoured opponents).
    Or they might be Bastard Swords, which is a sort of in-between for One and Two-handed swords.
    Or Longswords, or Claymores (the latter has an hilt slightly inclined forward like theirs).
    Greatswords are an unlikely theory, as HI's swords are not much wide.

    I'd support a Bastard Sword or Claymore.

  2. #142

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    If I had to venture a guess, it would be a longsword. To venture another guess, I would assume they would be imported from Ordona by the looks of the blade, but I would like confirmation on that from Neph.

  3. #143

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    most swords in hyrule should come from death mountain so they be smaller versions of the goron sword.
    Din25:17. "The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the
    tyranny of evil men. Blessed is she who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through
    the maw of majora, for she is truly her sisters's keeper and the finder of lost kin. And I will strike
    down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my sisters. And you will know my name is DIN when I lay my vengeance upon you.

  4. #144
    Apani's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    I don't think Gorons even use swords in this lore, let alone trade them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Overmind5000 View Post
    If I had to venture a guess, it would be a longsword. To venture another guess, I would assume they would be imported from Ordona by the looks of the blade, but I would like confirmation on that from Neph.
    A claymore is basically a longsword with a curved hilt, if I got that right. As for Ordona craftmanship, I see a triforce on the hilt, which makes me think it was made in Hyrule.

  5. #145

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Ah. Thank you for correcting me. Didn't see the Triforce emblem there until you mentioned it.

  6. #146

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    I hope, Apani, that you are not suggesting greatswords to be overly wide. They are supposed to be swords after all, and extra metal is not a bonus at all. Unless I have understood your original intention wrong, in which case I sincerely apologize. However, some of the biggest greatswords were made in Germany around 1500s.Called Zweihänder or Biedenhänder, they are never very wide as they don't need to be. Here is one example, and you can see that no significant widening between the handle and the blade can be observed.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    That said, I myself consider the swords Hylian Infantry uses to be longswords. While not terribly long and with relatively short handle, they still seem to be bigger than swords used by knights or recruits, and big enough to seem uncomfortable to be used with only one hand.

  7. #147
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    what kind of swords do the knights wield? it seems to long for me. I would change their sword with the sword of hylian infantry and then see what would it look like. I would vote for bastard sword (or larger) for the hylian infantry because with less defense they need to have more reach. Maybe we should ask to whom are the hylian infantry intended to fight; I don´t know with sword they have advantage to both basic swords and spears. If they would become "expensive" because of that, I think the necessity of being "superior" in the region would be enough to justify it (In case they would be claymores or longer).

  8. #148
    Apani's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Only because a weapon is long it doesn't mean it's heavy; just think of rapiers. Anyways, Hylian infantry is supposed to be a generic frontline unit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Teknokraatti View Post
    I hope, Apani, that you are not suggesting greatswords to be overly wide. They are supposed to be swords after all, and extra metal is not a bonus at all. Unless I have understood your original intention wrong, in which case I sincerely apologize. However, some of the biggest greatswords were made in Germany around 1500s.Called Zweihänder or Biedenhänder, they are never very wide as they don't need to be. Here is one example, and you can see that no significant widening between the handle and the blade can be observed.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    That said, I myself consider the swords Hylian Infantry uses to be longswords. While not terribly long and with relatively short handle, they still seem to be bigger than swords used by knights or recruits, and big enough to seem uncomfortable to be used with only one hand.
    Well, in a world where an entire army can be outfitted with Gold, you probably don't mind expenses much; but I get your point, I misjudged them.

  9. #149

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    You thought I meant the price of the metal? Well, probably I should have been clearer. Any extra metal in weapon, especially in sword, imbalances it and makes it more cumbersome, exhausting and slower to use. Sword is not a heavy weapon and it should not try to achieve that rule, as it would then lose the swiftness and agility so important for the sword. There already are weapons better fitted to that task, such as maces, flails, hammers and axes. Extra metal is thus not a bonus in sword but a hindrance.

  10. #150
    Apani's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Ah, got it. But I still don't know how to label them; since I'm going to use Real Combat for their stats and that system only accounts for four types of two-handed swords, which one of these you think would be most likely?
    Estoc (Impossible, doesn't have a cutting edge)
    Claymore
    Greatsword used for Cutting and Thrusting
    Greatsword used for Cutting

  11. #151

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    I suspect that claymore is closest to bastard sword, and I would classify HI:s swords as such. They definitely are not estocs and they quite clearly lack the reach of a true greatsword. So, my vote goes for Claymore.

  12. #152
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    That was my pick as well. Anyways, I could compile the stats for a bastard sword as well just altering those of a Claymore, I just need to know how differently they perform.

  13. #153

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Compared to the claymore, I would say, that bastard sword (Supposing we use typical german or italian bastard sword) would be significantly lighter and emphasis on stabbing would be greater. Bastard sword, in fact, is supposed to be the forefather of rapier. Bastard sword is fast and capable of delivering both stabs and cuts, but because it is usually somewhat shorter and lighter, with balance point near to the guard, I would say that it would not be as powerful in cuts and blows as the claymore.

    And some more ideas: While german Biedenhänder is a great defending weapon, I would not say the same of claymore. Biedenhänder is designed for advanced half-swording techniques, for example the guarded ricasso is extremely useful for that. With claymore, half-swording is an option, but not one the weapon eases or encourages to use, making it significantly less effective in defence. Bastard sword, on the other hand, is a good defending weapon. Keep in mind, though, that bastard sword is not a true 2-handed sword, which may be why it is not on the list. While it may sound cryptic, it is important to remember.

    The part that could be useful to you.
    Bastard sword: Faster, lighter and thus allowing for more elongated fighting, very good stab, pretty good cut, easier to use because of shorter length ad lesser weight
    Claymore: Longer reach, more powerful cut, limited concussive capabilities due to greater weight and longer reach (Such strikes are prone to damage the blade however), looks more intimidating
    Common: Both need good training to actually be useful, as shield is not here an option. Claymore, though, needs larger physical stature than bastard sword to allow some of the more challenging techniques.

    Claymore is a true shock troop weapon, and good at that undoubtedly, but bastard sword is more versatile.

    That is my 5 cents. I hope this post is useful.

  14. #154
    Apani's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Many thanks. Too bad I can't rep you again yet. May I ask, where does this knowledge come from?
    Last edited by Apani; March 29, 2014 at 03:33 PM.

  15. #155

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    For those who do not want to watch/haven't watched Overthrowing Majora for any reason, watch the video before opening spoiler. Otherwise, read with caution.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    When Majora destroys the Triforce, is it truely destroyed, or merely broken into fragments?


    WRAP YOUR HEAD AROUND THAT!!!


  16. #156
    mcloud's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    @Overmind5000 and whoever else read the spoiler
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    I believe that it is destroyed since majora is the only one who is an actual threat to the Golden Goddesses. (not sure so don't hold me to it)
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    "You had thought you won, but your mind failed to realize that everything that happened was my plan to begin with. I had let you win all those inconsequential battles since they never affected the outcome. The servants that fell to your blade were nothing but pawns, and now that you life is about to end by my blade you will realize how hopeless the cause you fought for was and how meaningless your life and your comrade's lives were." --mcloud

  17. #157

    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    that's not a spoiler guys that video has been up for a while now. what really get's me is why the goddesses didn't come or the first sages. in fact where are the first sages and the oracles and the light spirits.
    Din25:17. "The path of the righteous man is beset on all sides by the inequities of the selfish and the
    tyranny of evil men. Blessed is she who, in the name of charity and good will, shepherds the weak through
    the maw of majora, for she is truly her sisters's keeper and the finder of lost kin. And I will strike
    down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my sisters. And you will know my name is DIN when I lay my vengeance upon you.

  18. #158
    mcloud's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Don't sages die after (not right after but later) they name a new sage or one is picked. Also weren't some sages stuck with a seal to uphold? As for why the goddesses didn't show up, it's possible that after creating the world they had to use what power was left to keep the demonic world (the world where the druthuldi were at first, don't know what else to call it) and the other druthuldi from coming into hyrule. This would mean that the 1st sages are incapacitated and the goddesses are busy trying to keep the world from an encroaching druthuldi invasion, which I'm sure none of the races of hyrule can begin to prepare or even fight against, since it does take an army to kill Majora the Goddess Mocker.

    This is all speculation; however, so there is a high probability of this being wrong, especially since I don't know a whole lot of information on Neph's lore.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    "You had thought you won, but your mind failed to realize that everything that happened was my plan to begin with. I had let you win all those inconsequential battles since they never affected the outcome. The servants that fell to your blade were nothing but pawns, and now that you life is about to end by my blade you will realize how hopeless the cause you fought for was and how meaningless your life and your comrade's lives were." --mcloud

  19. #159
    Jakeford's Avatar Ducenarius
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Quote Originally Posted by mcloud View Post
    Don't sages die after (not right after but later) they name a new sage or one is picked. Also weren't some sages stuck with a seal to uphold? As for why the goddesses didn't show up, it's possible that after creating the world they had to use what power was left to keep the demonic world (the world where the druthuldi were at first, don't know what else to call it) and the other druthuldi from coming into hyrule. This would mean that the 1st sages are incapacitated and the goddesses are busy trying to keep the world from an encroaching druthuldi invasion, which I'm sure none of the races of hyrule can begin to prepare or even fight against, since it does take an army to kill Majora the Goddess Mocker.

    This is all speculation; however, so there is a high probability of this being wrong, especially since I don't know a whole lot of information on Neph's lore.

    Sages began aging normally after they give up there power. The first ages were created as immortal, spiritual beings to began with so they don't age or die. Also Druthuduli don't team up ever and they are power beings that are few in number. There is no mention of a single world or planet where the Druthuduli live either, they probably each have their own home planets that they used as a retreat or base (or in Bellum's case many planets)
    https://www.battleforthenet.com/
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  20. #160
    mcloud's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Ask questions on HTW's Lore

    Wasn't sure if the 1st sages were immortal to begin with or not, so on account of this they may have been killed by druthuduli in the beginning (assuming immortality means time doesn't affect them instead of them being unkillable) or stuck with upholding a seal on something. As for the druthuduli, I was not meaning for them to be teamed up with each other or specifically referring to one planet/world/realm but the druthuduli as a whole. I do not believe it was ever stated by Neph that Demise, Dethl, Vaati, Bellum, and Majora were the last of their kind alive, so the goddesses may have a barrier around the solar system (if all of the worlds(hyrule and the others that are inhabitable by hyrule's races) are close enough to be counted in the same solar system).


    On a side note, and this may be confusing so bear with me, are the druthuduli actually few in number or are there more that weren't able to make it to hyrule. They may have been sealed by an even higher power than the Golden Goddesses. Here is a link to who I'm referring to. ??????? With the exception of a few that were more cunning or powerful than others that could escape. Thus why the Goddesses are unable to help.


    Now I know Neph said near the bottom that he doesn't have plans to add this deity in any of his works but this would explain why the Goddesses didn't show up when the Triforce was destroyed by Majora.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    "You had thought you won, but your mind failed to realize that everything that happened was my plan to begin with. I had let you win all those inconsequential battles since they never affected the outcome. The servants that fell to your blade were nothing but pawns, and now that you life is about to end by my blade you will realize how hopeless the cause you fought for was and how meaningless your life and your comrade's lives were." --mcloud

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