Formation attack - is it actually good for anything?

[deadly21]

As the title says...

From all the videos and testing it seems that there is no advantege in keeping your unit in formation attack. If it doesn't keep its formation during battle it envelope the enemy from sides and gets more kills.

So the question - is there any situation where the formation attack actually helps somehow?

[GRANTO]

no

[deadly21]

Pretty simple answer, thanks

[JaM]

Its good for getting your formation into a blob... AI very often ends up with several units attacking single enemy, which causes them to all move to occupy same spot.. it practically makes flanking impossible wiht "formed Attack" units, as they will always shuffle to attack enemy frontally.. more on this in videos below


I reported this in official forum, support section, but so far its practically ignored by CA, and it will be like that, until community wont demand this to be fixed! (thread i opened at official forum: http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...t-Combat-issue )

I know some of you might think there are more pressing issues, but i think this one is the biggest problem of all Rome 2 has, as it completely prevent any faction using such units to use them properly in lines, or using them as flanking force. All you will get is one massive blob with all your units standing on top of each other.




(link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKWMjoFxr8s)



(link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cxc6MRMsWdQ)

[Butan]

I'm still trying to figure it out... But I would have to do test matchs and I hate that. I prefer the reality of campaign battles.


Anyway whats supposed to happen (if I remember correctly what I read left and right), is that :

1/ when formation attack is on : they dont "push" for kills as much, but they keep the integrity of the formation as best they can => best for "pinning" ennemy units and losing men slowly
2/ when formation attack is off : they will "push" for kills much more, possibly disintegrating the original position of the formation => best for attacking where you dont have to hold a line



A more knowledgeable member could confirm if true or not.

[deadly21]

Yeah, so far there is no advantage to keep your formation.
Only one thing came to my mind. If your unit is in melee and gets attacked from another enemy while keeping its formation, they could brace against the charge maybe? Or atleast receive a morale bonus.

Basicaly (not forget any formation attack button) when you attack enemy who is scattered or their formation is broken is there a difference in comparison with attacking an enemy who holds its composure and formation?

[JaM]

1/ when formation attack is on : they dont "push" for kills as much, but they keep the integrity of the formation as best they can => best for "pinning" ennemy units and losing men slowly
2/ when formation attack is off : they will "push" for kills much more, possibly disintegrating the original position of the formation => best for attacking where you dont have to hold a line

yes, that is correct, but also when "formed attack" is active, they rotate the ranks to always face enemy from the front. So if you use units in line, and enemy attacks you in the middle, your units that are facing enemy will move up together occupying same space. Even if you tray to do some flanking, your flanker unit will slide and move so it can attack from the front, again, standing on top of unit already attacking from front..

Plus, any unit that doesnt use formed attack, is able to expand and go around flanks, which means they reduce morale of enemy due to "attacked in flanks or rear" penalties, so practically, all "disciplined" units are at disadvantage against any barbarian unit. This is the main reason why Oathsworns are able to win fights against Roman Elite units...

So practically, there are no benefits in having this activated.. only negatives.

[Huberto]

Its good for getting your formation into a blob... AI very often ends up with several units attacking single enemy, which causes them to all move to occupy same spot.. it practically makes flanking impossible wiht "formed Attack" units, as they will always shuffle to attack enemy frontally.. more on this in videos below


I reported this in official forum, support section, but so far its practically ignored by CA, and it will be like that, until community wont demand this to be fixed! (thread i opened at official forum: http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...t-Combat-issue )

I know some of you might think there are more pressing issues, but i think this one is the biggest problem of all Rome 2 has, as it completely prevent any faction using such units to use them properly in lines, or using them as flanking force. All you will get is one massive blob with all your units standing on top of each other.

Wow - that's ing stupid. Explains a lot.

[Humble Warrior]

Its good for getting your formation into a blob... AI very often ends up with several units attacking single enemy, which causes them to all move to occupy same spot.. it practically makes flanking impossible wiht "formed Attack" units, as they will always shuffle to attack enemy frontally.. more on this in videos below


I reported this in official forum, support section, but so far its practically ignored by CA, and it will be like that, until community wont demand this to be fixed! (thread i opened at official forum: http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...t-Combat-issue )

I know some of you might think there are more pressing issues, but i think this one is the biggest problem of all Rome 2 has, as it completely prevent any faction using such units to use them properly in lines, or using them as flanking force. All you will get is one massive blob with all your units standing on top of each other.

Man, It is a serious issue and CA are ignoring it? it just gets worse the more I hear. I`m wondering if it`s possible to save the game at all if they just don`t care and instead work on releasing more pay for DLCS. It is pure common-sense LOGIC to FIX the base first before anything else. Just common sense! If you have a strong foundation, the house will stand.

Thanks for the update.

[GoTW Kubee]

Formation attack is indeed useless when engaging in melee against other inf and cav. However, it makes the units fare better against cav, ele and chariot charges. Overall, it performs much like guard mode did in previous TWs except a lot more bugged and poorly balanced, and for some reason not all units even have it.

[JaM]

Its not just for attacks.. it is active even if your unit is defending, and enemy attacks your line, and just few men of the second unit come in contact with the enemy. At that point entire unit shuffles sideways, entering the formation of your attacked unit..

Formed behavior needs to be adjusted. Unit should not realign to attack enemy frontally. (Right now, they shuffle to attack them into central point in their formation). If you order two units to attack single enemy, these two should behave as one formation, and should try to flank the enemy where their line overlaps, not to stack units on top of each other just to be able to attack with both against central point..

[deadly21]

Well logically the "disciplined" units which have the option to "attack in formation" should behave with better fighting stats as they are trained for that. Atleast some morale or stamina bonuses...
Right now, it is only disadvantage

[JaM]

not just a disadvantage, but Bugged Disadvantage..

[Sherm]

They added the formation button, but not should exist, the 80% of units should be ever in formation.

[Slaists]

Well, now that we have that button, we have the option to DEACTIVATE the formation button. Before the button it was on by default so units that used it were at a disadvantage.

[Whistler118]

Its really good at breaking up you well placed defensive lines and generally causing havoc to your own units.

[Durnaug]

Its good for getting your formation into a blob... AI very often ends up with several units attacking single enemy, which causes them to all move to occupy same spot.. it practically makes flanking impossible wiht "formed Attack" units, as they will always shuffle to attack enemy frontally.. more on this in videos below


I reported this in official forum, support section, but so far its practically ignored by CA, and it will be like that, until community wont demand this to be fixed! (thread i opened at official forum: http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...t-Combat-issue )

I know some of you might think there are more pressing issues, but i think this one is the biggest problem of all Rome 2 has, as it completely prevent any faction using such units to use them properly in lines, or using them as flanking force. All you will get is one massive blob with all your units standing on top of each other.




(link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKWMjoFxr8s)



(link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cxc6MRMsWdQ)

I think it breaks battlefield gameplay but there are some who will defend such gameplay to the death. They even defended the pre-patch battlefield gameplay! Anyway, I'm glad the issue is starting to gain recognition.

[Mithridates VI]

Is it good for phalanx?

[JaM]

Phalanx does use different mechanism, at least when pikes are deployed. anyway if you turn them off, they behave the same as other "formed Attack" positive units..

[crzyrndm]

"Officially" (for w/e weight that still has ) there has been acknowledgment that formation attack is currently not working as intended (LINK) RE: units using formed attack are less effective in combat. How far it extends, we'll have to see when they eventually fix it.