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Thread: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

  1. #1
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    I've been trying to reenact the battle for minas tirith but it's kinda hard. First of all the ai never seems to use battering rams or siege towers, they just blow holes in the walls and leave all the other siege equipment behind and mass charge through these two little holes in the wall. And this is hard difficulty I'm talking about here.
    Is there some sort of trick to make them use siege equipment? Other then taking away their catapults and ballistas I mean.

    Also one other question, is there a collection of historical battles that I can download that use the new settlements? That would be great.

    cheers


    P.S. I'm more a custom battle guy then a campaign guy, I almost never touch the campaign in Total War games.

  2. #2
    k/t's Avatar Auxiliarius
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    "Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?"

    Because the AI is stupid.

    That's all there is to it.

    "they just blow holes in the walls and leave all the other siege equipment behind and mass charge through these two little holes in the wall"

    That's what it does in all mods.

    Maybe Germanicu5 was able to change that in his Battle AI.

  3. #3
    Krieglord's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    I don't know about for Minas Tirith but in AOR 2.3 Ive seen the enemy use siege towers although since its usually me on the attack I dont see it very often.
    Me playing most strategy game's.. "I have 7 kingdoms to look after and 3 of them are in open rebellion so..."

  4. #4
    Honors Bastion's Avatar CRPG Staff Member
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    I have seen the ai use siege towers before but that only occurred when the siege lasted more than one turn. Usually the ai will attack me immediately one turn after the siege has begun, and ladders are the quickest to build and may have been the only engines to be built. That could partially explain why no siege towers were used.

    As for the rams, I have no clue.

  5. #5
    Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    the only solution I have for you would be to tweak the attack of the catas to do little to no damage to buildings. that way they'll be forced to fire at you until they run out of ammo, and then use their actual siege machines.

  6. #6
    Gallus's Avatar Equites
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Or, you know, don't give them catapults...



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  7. #7
    Krieglord's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gallus View Post
    Or, you know, don't give them catapults...
    orks without catapults?

    Pish posh sir... Pish posh of the highest order
    Me playing most strategy game's.. "I have 7 kingdoms to look after and 3 of them are in open rebellion so..."

  8. #8
    Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Heh... When i get attacked, the Orcs is blasting my walls with catapults. Then they storm to holes and use ladders/towers to storm the other walls. I was quite surprissed when it did that the first time, but it gave me a challenge
    //ThaDoews

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  9. #9
    Hastatas Posterior
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    They do use siege weapon, my problem is that THEY never go into siege battle, they just wait until the town surrenders (if they attack my settlement at all). If you try and counter attack them while they are sieging you, they just run away on the battlemap to the outer part of the map and just stands there so my ranged unit easily can pick them down.

    AI is stupid, always have been in the TW series This "feature" is making the game very very easy :-/

  10. #10
    ash874's Avatar Princeps Posterior
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pilgore View Post
    I've been trying to reenact the battle for minas tirith but it's kinda hard. First of all the ai never seems to use battering rams or siege towers, they just blow holes in the walls and leave all the other siege equipment behind and mass charge through these two little holes in the wall. And this is hard difficulty I'm talking about here.
    Is there some sort of trick to make them use siege equipment? Other then taking away their catapults and ballistas I mean.

    Also one other question, is there a collection of historical battles that I can download that use the new settlements? That would be great.

    cheers


    P.S. I'm more a custom battle guy then a campaign guy, I almost never touch the campaign in Total War games.


    first of all to answer the question asked in the op: why would the AI use siege towers and rams if he already punched holes in your walls...? nothing stupid about that

    Quote Originally Posted by SandraDevilGirl View Post
    They do use siege weapon, my problem is that THEY never go into siege battle, they just wait until the town surrenders (if they attack my settlement at all). If you try and counter attack them while they are sieging you, they just run away on the battlemap to the outer part of the map and just stands there so my ranged unit easily can pick them down.

    AI is stupid, always have been in the TW series This "feature" is making the game very very easy :-/
    as for what you describe in this post that i quoted: never happened to me
    you have a bug. possibly from conflicting AI submods or something
    i repeat, i play this game extensively and it never ever happened

    and last point: the AI of third age is not stupid and has never been at least when compared to any other mod out there
    i recently started using the "very bad AI" submod and i can say i have no complaints about any AI issues there too

    im almost sure you have a bug

  11. #11
    Flinn's Avatar A Modern Man of Old
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by SandraDevilGirl View Post
    They do use siege weapon, my problem is that THEY never go into siege battle, they just wait until the town surrenders (if they attack my settlement at all). If you try and counter attack them while they are sieging you, they just run away on the battlemap to the outer part of the map and just stands there so my ranged unit easily can pick them down.

    AI is stupid, always have been in the TW series This "feature" is making the game very very easy :-/
    it only happened to me with the original M2TW, normally what they did was to remain within a shot range from my walls, so that I could slay many before actually salling out.

  12. #12
    AbrahamLincoln's Avatar Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Th AI do use siege weapons when I play Third Age (MOS). Like when once the Silvan Elves attacked Dol Guldur (Mordor), they used every piece of Siege Equipment to breach my walls. This also happened when I was playing Isengard and Rohan besieged Helm's Deep after I captured it.

  13. #13
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    It IS stupid because what basically happens every siege battle, is the ai focuses entirely on the catapults shooting holes through walls and then mass charging the ENTIRE army through those holes. What do I do? What happens is every siege battle is essentially a mosh pit of two giant army's standing on either side of the hole one trying to keep the other out, the other trying to get in. And I always win when it comes to that, because it's THEM trying to get in the city and I can just stand there with my spear men and they just run into it. What Mordor did in Return of the King is basically virtually impossible in TA. Which sucks but I understand that ai is just not versatile enough to that.

    Anyway, are there some historical battles I can download that set up the battles for me? I remember there being a Battle for Middle Earth HB someone made but I can't find it.

  14. #14
    knight of meh's Avatar roghnaithe sciathán bán
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    the AI doesn't understand choke points that's for sure , but before that if i had catapults the only reason i would use siege towers is to get rid of archers because you are at quite the disadvantage if you scale the walls were there infantry is located

  15. #15
    Hastatas Posterior
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    I also play with MOS and have noted the tendency too either extend the siege, or too come in a rush using the bulk of their siege equipment. I rarely await assault though and sally often. A real surprise for me is when they turned and assaulted the city while I was attacking them. I was completely unprepared for this, and suffered for it.

  16. #16
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Ive seen the enemy use siege towers although since its usually me on the attack I dont see it very often.

  17. #17
    Miles
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by SandraDevilGirl View Post
    They do use siege weapon, my problem is that THEY never go into siege battle, they just wait until the town surrenders (if they attack my settlement at all). If you try and counter attack them while they are sieging you, they just run away on the battlemap to the outer part of the map and just stands there so my ranged unit easily can pick them down.

    AI is stupid, always have been in the TW series This "feature" is making the game very very easy :-/
    This only happens me when i play TA
    Works well in other mods

  18. #18
    Krieglord's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by affpvzta View Post
    Ive seen the enemy use siege towers although since its usually me on the attack I dont see it very often.
    Its like you ctrl + v 'd the words right out of my mouth
    Me playing most strategy game's.. "I have 7 kingdoms to look after and 3 of them are in open rebellion so..."

  19. #19
    Korgoth's Avatar Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    I find the AI is really ********* up in attacking seiges. Lots of wasted seige equipment. And the AI never ever retreats, when the AI route they just stand there...

  20. #20
    Jmonstra's Avatar Hastatas Posterior
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    Default Re: Why does the attacker ai in siege battles never use siege towers/battering rams?

    Quote Originally Posted by ash874 View Post

    im almost sure you have a bug
    I'm sure he doesn't. This has happened to me every time I've counter attacked a besieging force, Very bad AI or no Very Bad AI.

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