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Thread: CCT discussion

  1. #1
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default CCT discussion

    Okay so I had a nice proposal written up and then one of those damn errors struck me.

    In April the 6 months trial period for the CCT (CAT) and the Product Reviews will end, thus I have two proposals I'd like to put forth as one "act" or "motion"... one involves the CCT, and the other the Product Reviews forum.

    The CCT hasn't been hugely successful, and that is a bit of an understatement (me putting my hand up here) so I'd like to propose its abolishment whether as soon after this passes (if it does) or after the end of the full trial period, a detail I guess up to the Curator. With the opening up of the FM to normal members as well it I now think the FM suits what the CCT's aim was (to run Curia projects) better than the CCT does itself. People can come together and go for their own ideas with people they want to help them, and as they come and go so do their ideas - which I think is better than having the structure of something like CCT which frankly seems to be a bit of headless chicken. I know some people have wondered the point of the CCT since the start, to you I say well it was just a trail...

    However moving on to the Product Reviews forum, I'd like to propose that we "ratify" it for when the trial period ends so it can continue to carry on. Whilst it hasn't taken off as quickly as I'm sure we all imagined we are now entering the fourth Review of the Month competition, which have been quite successful and after 3 or 4 more I'll be back with medal proposals (if this passes of course) most likely. In regards to running and management Content are willing for it to become an official part of Content Staff, and have it run under them. However if you guys would like to keep it going, but change how it is run in a different way please post them.

    So yeah, pack up shop with the CCT but extend the lease for the Product Reviews forum.

    What do you think?


    Supporters:
    General Brewster, Robin de Bodemloze, Navajo Joe
    Last edited by Shankbot de Bodemloze; March 03, 2013 at 10:32 AM.
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  2. #2
    Legio's Avatar EMPRESS OF ALL THINGS
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    I'm willing to extend Content Staff to include the Product Reviews forum. Content Staff already help the Product Reviews forum in the Game Reviews section and are about to branch into the Arts; thus, we already cover a good deal of what goes into the actual competition itself. We also give FrontPage announcements to the competition, but can do so much more.

    You will receive official status and all the benefits that go along with being recognized as a Content competition, and the continuity and good standing of the Reviews Competition and its subforum will be ensured.

    Thus, I am offering this competition a slot in Content Staff.

  3. #3
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    I'd be happy with that. I'd be in safe hands.

    I'll edit it in the OP.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    This seems reasonable, it was a noble experiment, however I would suggest for now we simply transfer the Product Review forum and keep the CAT, as with the new expected activity in the Forum Magnum, we could still be very useful.

    Otherwise I support you and Legio's proposal. Although is he saying that the current CAT members will continue to staff the forum?

  5. #5
    Legio's Avatar EMPRESS OF ALL THINGS
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    A regular (more or less permanent, i.e. not having to worry about elections) group of Staff will be assigned to the Product Reviews, yes. It's entirely possible that CAT members will be conscripted to serve on the SS Legio () but there will also be some slots available for members who show an active interest in helping things out.

  6. #6
    General Brewster's Avatar The Flying Dutchman
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Full support shank as said earlier.

  7. #7

    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Legio View Post
    A regular (more or less permanent, i.e. not having to worry about elections) group of Staff will be assigned to the Product Reviews, yes. It's entirely possible that CAT members will be conscripted to serve on the SS Legio () but there will also be some slots available for members who show an active interest in helping things out.
    Good idea captain

    EDIT: Could this proposal not be done by Hex Decision? That way the CAT remains intact to help in other parts of the Capitol

  8. #8
    Derpy Hooves's Avatar Bombs for Muffins
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    I oppose Content taking over the Product Reviews. I prefer to leave it as a CVRIAL thing.



  9. #9
    Acco's Avatar Дијана
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by ☩Lord Inquisitor Derpy Hooves☩ View Post
    I oppose Content taking over the Product Reviews. I prefer to leave it as a CVRIAL thing.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shankbot de Bodemloze
    With the opening up of the FM to normal members as well it I now think the FM suits what the CCT's aim was (to run Curia projects) better than the CCT does itself.
    The FM and CAT/CCT have identical goals. The main difference is that participation in the FM is voluntary whereas the CCT has more of an official drive to it. Even though the CCT was rather inactive, it did get more done than the FM in the same amount of time. I'd recommend moving the CCT into the FM and making it the 'management' of the forum or something to that effect. If the CCT is firing on all cylinders, I think it can be very effective.
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  10. #10

    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Support on both counts.
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  11. #11
    Navajo Joe's Avatar SS Forum Moderator
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Support on both





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  12. #12
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Darling View Post
    EDIT: Could this proposal not be done by Hex Decision? That way the CAT remains intact to help in other parts of the Capitol
    Didn't realise there was such a method of doing things...

    However as this started in the Curia I wouldn't want to upset people by not doing things properly.

    Quote Originally Posted by ☩Lord Inquisitor Derpy Hooves☩ View Post
    I oppose Content taking over the Product Reviews. I prefer to leave it as a CVRIAL thing.
    Why?

    How would we decide who ran it? It is all members, hence is it really now a Curial think? I had one member ask me if he was allowed the ROTM because he thought it was a Citizen only thing... would keeping it such just reinforce that image? All things to think about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Acco View Post
    I agree.

    The FM and CAT/CCT have identical goals. The main difference is that participation in the FM is voluntary whereas the CCT has more of an official drive to it. Even though the CCT was rather inactive, it did get more done than the FM in the same amount of time. I'd recommend moving the CCT into the FM and making it the 'management' of the forum or something to that effect. If the CCT is firing on all cylinders, I think it can be very effective.
    Okay but besides managing the FM what else would they do? Would people have to take ideas to them first before starting them? Would they be there to get people who have ideas in touch with higher authority? etc. It would be great to keep the CCT going but I'd like to see it have a purpose before it starts instead of finding one afterwards, I now feel last time we might have rushed things (partly my blame) so if it was to stay maybe a longer discussion on it is needed?

    Maybe two separate proposals would be a better idea? One for having the Product Reviews becoming Content and one for what to do with the CCT.
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  13. #13
    Aikanįr's Avatar no vaseline
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    What would be the difference when Content would manage product reviews in comparison to CAT/CCT? Besides that the then to be content director of product reviews could actually hire and fire his staff according to whether they perform or not?

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not in principle against content. I just am a little bewildered and perplexed about the reasoning, which basically comes down to: 'We elected people did not perform that well, therefore the entire idea behind the system is a failure, lets abolish it.'
    Last edited by Aikanįr; March 03, 2013 at 11:23 AM.


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  14. #14
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Simply the other review forums (Art and Gaming) are already run by Content and as the ROTM allows for those entries, as well as reviews that have been written for Content publications, it just seems a logical step. Becoming part of Content would a Staff representation to the PR, much like what has happened in the RPG section with Gaming Staff.

    I'm not saying the CCT is a failure, I'm just saying the FM now accomplishes what it does - although what Acco suggest could work (in which case a separate discussion might be needed), in which case the PR isn't to do with the FM so wouldn't fit under the CCT anyway. Lets be frank, it hasn't does much has it? A sad truth, but a true one.
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  15. #15
    Aikanįr's Avatar no vaseline
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    The entry of your reasoning was:
    Quote Originally Posted by Shankbot de Bodemloze View Post
    In April the 6 months trial period for the CCT (CAT) and the Product Reviews will end, thus I have two proposals I'd like to put forth as one "act" or "motion"... one involves the CCT, and the other the Product Reviews forum.

    The CCT hasn't been hugely successful, and that is a bit of an understatement (me putting my hand up here) so I'd like to propose its abolishment whether as soon after this passes (if it does) or after the end of the full trial period, a detail I guess up to the Curator.
    Which basically means: we, the people who wanted to do the job and got elected to do the job, failed. Because we failed, the system is not working. Therefore abolish the System.

    ________________________________

    Also, just because the CCT got expanded and the Forum Magnum main opened does not explain the activity of the elected CAT members and the lack thereof of the elected CCT members.

    ________________________________

    However. The original idea was to expressis verbis not give it to content in the first place, but to give it to the curia because we were supposed to be better with things related to the community. Now, it is always possible that this was a misconception, meaning that the curia is not better suited to do community related things than content (the original thread is still around where all that what I'm paraphrasing can be re-read).

    That being said, I'm not in opposition to making product reviews a department of the content branch. But the reasoning behind this idea does not hold any water according to my opinion. The stringent thing to do would be: those elected failed, therefore don't elect them again and give others a chance. If we tryed for some time with different people and all have failed, then there would be way more reason to argue that we, as curia, are not capable and/or interested in doing it.

    However, I agree that people who are not interested in actually doing something should not be placed in a position to do a job in the first place. That would be the reason why I would support placing product reviews under content scrutiny.


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  16. #16

    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    I'd rather not. The Curia came up with what was in my opinion a good idea, and a lot of work went into it by the Curia. Now the current team owes it to themselves to do it properly. Why can Content do it better? What would Content do differently? I don't see the differences as a reason to just hand it over, I see it as a reason for the Curia to get better.

    I'll tell you why the CAT has failed. Because many of the people involved have shown no organization, no initiative, and no activity. I'm not willing to call the CAT dead because it got handed to people who are probably some of the worst suited for the job. We elected Badge Sharks, no if ands or buts about it. Get the people in there out of there, and actually put in people who care about what they're doing and show some competence. I'm surprised I actually have to say it this bluntly, but no one in it has done jack **** with the exception of yourself, Shankbot.
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  17. #17
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Yes we failed. Yes we should be blamed for that. However I don't think there is much the CCT can do, and it seems neither does the rest of the Curia. There is the feedback thread for people to post ideas, nothing was posted which seems what it can do is something that no Citizen has yet been able to think of.
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  18. #18
    Aikanįr's Avatar no vaseline
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    @Bolk:
    Precisely! I don't get why somebody runs for a job in the first place when all he does is nothing. And before the argument is risen, that the last election barely have seen enough applicants to make them win their seats by default. So what? If there are not enough applicants, then some seats will remain vacant. Who cares?

    I'd rather see only one elected member who actually shows that he wants to do something, than people being elected who don't do a bloody thing in an entire month.

    @Shank:
    I don't think that CAT has failed with regards to Product Reviews. Sure it has started slow, but the competition is taking off and we see some new reviews every once in a while. Of course, you can say that the forum could be more busy. But that is also up to the officers, who is preventing them from writing reviews of their own? That is the only reason, as I've said, why I would support putting it under content scrutiny, because then you either have people who want to write in the first place, or who get fired.

    You can easily do that here, too. You can always amend the TWCC and introduce a hire and fire right for people who obviously don't want to do something.

    When you face the situation that people just run for the sake of having another office, not because they have an idea or want to do something, then you need the right to fire those people in order to make sure that such things don't happen again.
    Last edited by Aikanįr; March 03, 2013 at 12:03 PM.


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  19. #19

    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    The most activity that half the team has had is posting in this thread to abolish the CAT. That's not an excuse. If someone's reaction to inactivity is just to give up, they're the wrong people for the job. It's not fair to the entire Curia to just do that because of some people's incompetence. I go through the forum and I read it and see a few good ideas in a quick skimming of it, but they all end with simple inaction. No one does anything about it. They just kind of give up once they have the idea.

    I'm not an optimist, I'm a realist. I understand not everything will work out, but this hasn't been given a fair shot yet.
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  20. #20
    Shankbot de Bodemloze's Avatar From the Writers Study!
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    Default Re: CCT and Product Reviews Forum

    Okay so we'll work with the CCT, build it back up from its foundations, do it right this time. But things need to change. Oh and Bolk, there weren't any badges for joining the CAT so we can't excatly be badge sharks as you so kindly put?

    However I think the ROTM competition will benefit greatly from becoming part of Content, and as that is hosted in the PR forum, and all the other review forums are already part of Content it can only be a good thing to consolidate them into one place?
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