View Poll Results: Which Dark Lord Was Worse: Mellkor or Sauron

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  • Mellkor/Morgoth

    22 64.71%
  • Sauron

    12 35.29%
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Thread: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

  1. #21
    Krieglord's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by knight of meh View Post
    political correctness gone mad here your not even allowed to despise the bad guys who (alone or together) destroyed the entwives, killed thousands of men , dwarfs and elves enslaved people and that's not forget tried to take over the world multiple times
    It wasn't me trying to be politically correct its just I dont despise either of them :p

    If I was living in middle earth I think yes I may despise Sauron or Morgoth depending on the age I lived in.
    Me playing most strategy game's.. "I have 7 kingdoms to look after and 3 of them are in open rebellion so..."

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    It could be counter argued who achieved more in which case the victor turned ou to be morgoth in another poll, so in a way melker should be more despised though both are guilty of a lot..

  3. #23
    Elven Warrior's Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    i can understand morogoth. he wanted to create and and rule i can understand that. sauron had a chance to turn from evil during the judgement of the valar and chose to hide. that is unforgivable to me and the continuation of his masters evil also strikes against him for me. he conquered for evil sake not for any ideal

  4. #24
    Krieglord's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Elven Warrior View Post
    i can understand morogoth. he wanted to create and and rule i can understand that. sauron had a chance to turn from evil during the judgement of the valar and chose to hide. that is unforgivable to me and the continuation of his masters evil also strikes against him for me. he conquered for evil sake not for any ideal
    Morgoth was (certainly by the end of the First Age) a nihilist whose ultimate goal was to destroy the world. Sauron didn't want to destroy it, he wanted to rule it and order it for his own satisfaction. Morgoth's defeat actually made Sauron's desire for rule and order (which he'd had from the start, but which Morgoth only shared until his descent into nihilism) more achievable than it was when Morgoth was around.
    Me playing most strategy game's.. "I have 7 kingdoms to look after and 3 of them are in open rebellion so..."

  5. #25
    jinjo's Avatar Princeps Prior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    morgoth was stronger than sauron in my opinion, but morgoth's goal was much more unachievable than sauron's wishes.

  6. #26
    Ngugi's Avatar TATW Local Moderator
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Krieglord View Post
    Morgoth was (certainly by the end of the First Age) a nihilist whose ultimate goal was to destroy the world. Sauron didn't want to destroy it, he wanted to rule it and order it for his own satisfaction. Morgoth's defeat actually made Sauron's desire for rule and order (which he'd had from the start, but which Morgoth only shared until his descent into nihilism) more achievable than it was when Morgoth was around.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ngugi View Post
    Neither would it under Melkor/Morgoth actually.
    By some reason most are just informed about Myths Transformed; VII; i where Tolkien discuss the destructive nihilistic side of Melkor, but Tolkien developed this and gave Morgoth a much more complex and less mad, destructive character than so (my red and underlining)

    Morgoth though locally triumphant had neglected most of Middle-earth during the war; and by it he had in fact been weakened: in power and prestige (he had lost and failed to recover one of the Silmarils), and above all in mind. He had become absorbed in ’kingship’, and though a tyrant of ogre-size and monstrous power, this was a vast fall even from his former wickedness of hate, and his terrible nihilism. He had fallen to like being a tyrant-king with conquered slaves, and vast obedient armies.
    - Morgoth’s Ring; Myths Transformed; VII; ii


    Which for the keen eyed obviously is from the same book and sub book, only a few pages later hehe, but as a rule a sadly ignored insight in what Morgoth was up to.
    Last edited by Ngugi; February 24, 2013 at 03:46 PM.



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  7. #27
    Mhaedros's Avatar Reverse the Polarity!
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Truth be told, I respect them both more than I despise them. Accomplishing what they did is no easy thing, even by a Vala or a Maia.

  8. #28
    Mikail Mengsk's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Morgoth started all and his goal was total destruction. So i choose him for the "evilest of evil".
    It's only after you have lost everything, that you are free to do anything.

  9. #29
    Ngugi's Avatar TATW Local Moderator
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikail Mengsk View Post
    Morgoth started all and his goal was total destruction. So i choose him for the "evilest of evil".
    Quote Originally Posted by Ngugi View Post
    By some reason most are just informed about Myths Transformed; VII; i where Tolkien discuss the destructive nihilistic side of Melkor, but Tolkien developed this and gave Morgoth a much more complex and less mad, destructive character than so (my red and underlining)

    Morgoth though locally triumphant had neglected most of Middle-earth during the war; and by it he had in fact been weakened: in power and prestige (he had lost and failed to recover one of the Silmarils), and above all in mind. He had become absorbed in ’kingship’, and though a tyrant of ogre-size and monstrous power, this was a vast fall even from his former wickedness of hate, and his terrible nihilism. He had fallen to like being a tyrant-king with conquered slaves, and vast obedient armies.
    - Morgoth’s Ring; Myths Transformed; VII; ii


    Which for the keen eyed obviously is from the same book and sub book, only a few pages later hehe, but as a rule a sadly ignored insight in what Morgoth was up to.
    (Neat, I've turned into a defence lawyer of Morgoth... )



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  10. #30
    knight of meh's Avatar roghnaithe sciathŠn bŠn
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ngugi View Post
    (Neat, I've turned into a defence lawyer of Morgoth... )
    For shame ...

    beginning to think who moderates the moderators was a little more than a story

  11. #31
    Feanaro Curufinwe's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ngugi View Post
    (Neat, I've turned into a defence lawyer of Morgoth... )
    There are stranger things. Like Sauron fangirls.

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  12. #32
    megells's Avatar Vexillifer
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by Feanaro Curufinwe View Post
    There are stranger things. Like Sauron fangirls.
    How does that exist

  13. #33
    Ngugi's Avatar TATW Local Moderator
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    It's all about the eyes.
    Ehm, eye.
    Eye.



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  14. #34
    Flinn's Avatar A Modern Man of Old
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Gotta go for Sauron, as I think a deceiver is worse than a tyrant, IMO

    of course Sauron tried to copy is master in the end, but he actually did his best as a deceiver (The forging of the one ring, the corruption of Numenor) more than as a warlord (he succeded in destroing Eregion and Arnor, but utterly failed against Gondor and practically lost all the major battles his armies were involved in)
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  15. #35
    Feanaro Curufinwe's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Quote Originally Posted by megells View Post
    How does that exist
    It does.And techincally he is hot.He incinerated Gil Galad after all!Of course they are less prevalent than Maedhros fangirls.
    Last edited by Feanaro Curufinwe; February 26, 2013 at 05:42 AM.

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  16. #36
    glassakias's Avatar Hastatas Prior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    well, before the destruction of numenor he could take any form he wished and one of these was fair enough to deceive the elves, so i understand why fangirls would go bersek with him. maybe the fortifications of mordor were just a sophisticated security system to keep them out after all
    Last edited by glassakias; February 28, 2013 at 06:25 PM.

  17. #37
    ThorÔn II Oakenshield's Avatar Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    I like both .
    Sorry for my bad English ; I'm Belgian.

  18. #38
    ΔriŽl's Avatar Princeps Prior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    While I Voted for Morgoth I don't hate them. But I really think that Melkor/Morgoth deserves his fate at the end he only wanted destruction. He tried to corrupt the Music of the Ainur, destroyed the Two Lamps, the Two Trees, Stole the Silmarils , Destroyed many eleven cities including the Mighty Gondolin and Wage War in Beleriand leading to its eventual destruction in the War of Wrath. Indirectly cause the deaths of many elven heroes like Ecthelion, Glorfindel, Fearnor and many more.

    He did a lot more!!

  19. #39
    Lortano's Avatar Hastatas Posterior
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    Despise is definitely a strong word. I despise Hitler and the Nazis, because they killed 11 million real life people in camps. I do not feel hate for two fictional characters, whom I find to be infinitely more interesting than the good guys. Plus, I write about them, so i can't really despise that which i would write about.
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    The Hobbit: An Unexpected Fail: A story of true friendship, a quest to destroy a dragon, and references all around! http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=584031
    And see where it all began in: Three Jewels, One Valar. http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=555203

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  20. #40
    Maiden_Ante's Avatar Centurio
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    Default Re: Whom Do You Despise More: Morgoth or Sauron?

    As I see it, Sauron is the most evil of the two. Melkor was the... 'founder' of evil, if I dare say, and quite the evil type in his own way. However, seeing as he set out on his own path, being a god-like creature and all, when there was no history of evil to take experience from, he strikes me more of a force of nature rather than some type that deserves despise. Sauron on the other hand, being a second level-player, had more space and time to see the effects of Melkor's decisions and the fact that he not only stayed with Melkor but also continued his evil - taking over the 'Dark Lord numero uno' spot - shows a calculated, power-hungry type that I think deserves the credit of being truly 'evil' more than our dear Morgoth.

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