Tolkien General Discussion II

[Greymane]

From what I know all peoples of the East are just evil and from the East , that's as much Info I could find from Tolkien's works ,and some of them had(have) Chairots and Mumakils .

Honestly I never liked the fact that in Tolkien works major "Evil" humans are all pretty much middle eastern people .

That is not exactly true, is it?
If you read the Silmarillion, you will find that all Elves and Men came from the East and were fleeing from the Shadow that dwelt there.
Those who stayed (the Men anyway), got under the influence of said Shadow.
That said, information on those who became Easterlings and Haradrim is very scarce. From what we do know, off course, the conclusion that they are very much alike people in the Middle East during Medieval times is easy to make. When it comes to Bor and Ulfang and their peoples, however, I am always much more reminded of Slavs then of Arabians. Still to the East, from here anyway, but whatever
When still in doubt, just realize that men in Gondor (those who were not of the blood of Numenor), were sometimes described as having dark skins.

[martoto]

From what I know all peoples of the East are just evil and from the East , that's as much Info I could find from Tolkien's works ,and some of them had(have) Chairots and Mumakils .

Honestly I never liked the fact that in Tolkien works major "Evil" humans are all pretty much middle eastern people .

Yep, Tolkien is pretty much a racist. The Haradrim are based on the Arabs and the Easterlings are based on Turks, Persians, and Mongols. What are you gonna do? But what I really don't like is that Tolkien describes them as inherently evil men. I think that neither the Haradrim nor the Easterlings are evil in nature. They're just choosing the stronger side as a means to further their own political goals. Harad and Rhûn have waged war on the "west" for centuries. They would rather be allied to Sauron than to Gondor or Rohan.

[Ngugi]

@ martoto

The movie replaced Haradrim soldiers to show Easterlings Frodo & C/O hide from at the Black Gate (even if Easterlings indeed were seen in the distance in the chapter), and took [big liberties with] haradrims apperence to create a Rhûn look;

'More Men going to Mordor,' he said in a low voice. `Dark faces. We have not seen Men like these before, no, Sméagol has not. They are fierce. They have black eyes, and long black hair, and gold rings in their ears; yes, lots of beautiful gold. And some have red paint on their cheeks, and red cloaks; and their flags are red, and the tips of their spears; '
- Gollum, TTT; The Black Gate is Closed

He came to rest in the fern a few feet away, face downward, green arrow-feathers sticking from his neck below a golden collar. His scarlet robes were tattered, his corslet of overlapping brazen plates was rent and hewn, his black plaits of hair braided with gold were drenched with blood.
- TTT; Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit

It's proper that the mvies contain Easterlings since they are depicted in the books, but what we have is limited and not suggesting what we at end got got:

... out of the East Men were moving endlessly: swordsmen, spearmen, bowmen upon horses, chariots of chieftains and laden wains.
- FotR; The Breaking of the Fellowship

But here and there he caught the gleam of spears and helmets; and over the levels beside the roads horsemen could be seen riding in many companies.
- TTT; The Black Gate is Closed

They are strong: battalions of Orcs of the Eye, and countless companies of Men of a new sort that we have not met before. Not tall, but broad and grim, bearded like dwarves, wielding great axes. Out of some savage land in the wide East they come, we deem.
- Ingold, RotK; The Siege of Gondor

To bad, would liked to see those axemen or war chariots [who I picture to been inspired by Assyrian, Babylonian and Egyptian examples]

Well the "why" is obvious.

No actually it isn't TATW could had used the movie look without inventing the whole Loke-rim background story; but it's in their artistic freedom to chose a made up reason for the aesthetics non the less.


@ Despondent Mind
It's an easy impression, but if one dig into it Tolkien is far more complicated in his legendarium than to go with simple racism, and he considered racism a folly himself:

I do not regard the (probable) absence of all Jewish blood as necessarily honourable; and I have many Jewish friends, and should regret giving any colour to the notion that I subscribed to the wholly pernicious and unscientific race-doctrine.
-letter from 1938 to a German publisher

In the First Age Morogth had put his effort into corrupting Men, but it's not an easy matter of "hites are good and coloured got corrupted".
The people of Bëor, one of the Edain houses who joined the Elves in the wars against Morgoth, were mingled with Easterlings, and the Easterlings who came were only to a part aligned to Morgoth:

It is told that at this time the Swarthy Men came first into Beleriand. Some were already secretly under the dominion of Morgoth, and came at his call; but not all, for the rumour of Beleriand, of its lands and waters, of its wars and riches, went now far and wide, and the wandering feet of Men were ever set westward in those days.
-Silmarillion

Many who did help Morgoth to victories did not do so out of evil of heart, but trough lies and terror which is the constant tools by which Men are made to not oppose:

Yet neither by wolf, nor by Balrog, nor by Dragon, would Morgoth have achieved his end, but for the treachery of Men. In this hour the plots of Ulfang were revealed. Many of the Easterlings turned and fled, their hearts being filled with lies and fear;
-Silmarillion

And the people of Bór were faithful to the Elves and fought till their end against the allies of Morgoth.

In the Second Age

And in the south and in the further east Men multiplied; and most of them turned to evil, for Sauron was at work."
-Of the Third Age...

but its trough the manipulations of Sauron, in areas where the Elves and Dúnedain have not spread the 'evangelium' of Erú and the Valar, by indoctrination and not related to race, just as the kinfolk of Haladin (another of the Edain, forefathers to the Dúnedain) in the west were influenced by and sometimes worshipped Sauron before the Dúnedian returned - and still it should be underlined that most, not all, in the East and South turned to evil.
Again it's much trough terror and fear as tool:

In the east and south well nigh all Men were under his dominion, and they grew strong in those days and built many towns and walls of stone, and they were numerous and fierce in war and aimed with iron. To them Sauron was both king and god; and they feared him exceedingly, for he surrounded his abode with fire.
-Of the Third Age...

(and yet he, at his greatest point of power, was not lord of all, as seen)


And so it goes on, where the actually most evil and wicked among Men are not the Easterlings or Southrons but the Numenoreans/Duendain, who long before Sauron made them completly fallen made war upon the Men of Middle-earth to make them slaves and plunder their lands for their own gain, and at end committed human sacrafices etc.
Gondor may represent good but they were also imperalists who expanded for their own power and glory, and faced civil war when racist among them under Castamir opposed marriages to other races; racists who commited treason, terror and dictatorship - while it proved that mingling with other folks did not reduce the southern Dúnedains features, which the Castamirians feared.
It should at this time be stressed that the Numenoreans/Dunedain is a race apart not based on evolution, but because God gave features to them as had not been granted other mortals, and the losses of such features were unavoiadble in Middle-earth by default but increased by acting evil, a.k.a in opposition to Erú's will.


We shall further not forget that those Easterlings and Haradrim who came to the west and thus enter the stories that are intended to represent remaining chronicles written by peoples in the West, were those who were in the service of Sauron, willingly or forced, while we do not meet the others; it was not the nice chaps who came west.
In the end of the Third Age:

[Sam] wondered what the [Haradrim] man's name was and where he came from; and if he was really evil of heart, or what lies or threats had led him on the long march from his home; and if he would not really rather have stayed there in peace ...
- TTT

... [Aragorn went] far into the East and deep into the South exploring the heart of men, both good and evil, and uncovering the plots and devices of the servants of Sauron.
-Appendix A

Their task was to circumvent Sauron: to bring help to the few tribes of Men that had rebelled from Melkor-worship, to stir up rebellion ... and after his first fall to search out his hiding (in which they failed) and to cause [?dissension and disarray] among the dark East ... They must have had very great influence on the history of the Second Age and Third Age in weakening and disarraying the forces of East ... who would both in the Second Age and Third Age otherwise have ... outnumbered the West.
-about the Blue Wizards, HoME 12

If Tolkien was a racist by simply talking about races, fine, then he is, yet if what is meant is to value persons based on biological race and belive that some races are better than others, then he is not [Orcs is a side matter, as its a theological issue]. And the lack of moral superiority and value as a human being given to someone because of their mortal shell (even Elves, who is a race of the same species as Man, fall to evil) is what I care about.

Personally what concern Easterlings I just as much percive Tolkien had vikings in mind as mongol people etc., because the only described easterlings in LotR had large beards and big axes, while the only named easterling people are the Variags, which is another name for the varangian guard in Constantinople, that were Norsemen (while later often anglo-saxons). And it make sense, because prior to an European JRR was an Englishman, and from a British perspective the vikings (especially Danes) came from the east

[Veteraan]

@Ngugi: I greatly admire the gusto with which you keep on fighting this (probably losing) battle.
It is a worthy cause though, so do keep it up.

[Þiudreiks]

Well stated Ngugi you are a true scholar of Tolkien's Work.

[martoto]

@ martoto

The movie replaced Haradrim soldiers to show Easterlings Frodo & C/O hide from at the Black Gate (even if Easterlings indeed were seen in the distance in the chapter), and took [big liberties with] haradrims apperence to create a Rhûn look;
It's proper that the mvies contain Easterlings since they are depicted in the books, but what we have is limited and not suggesting what we at end got got:To bad, would liked to see those axemen or war chariots [who I picture to been inspired by Assyrian, Babylonian and Egyptian examples]

No actually it isn't TATW could had used the movie look without inventing the whole Loke-rim background story; but it's in their artistic freedom to chose a made up reason for the aesthetics non the less.


@ Despondent Mind
It's an easy impression, but if one dig into it Tolkien is far more complicated in his legendarium than to go with simple racism, and he considered racism a folly himself:


In the First Age Morogth had put his effort into corrupting Men, but it's not an easy matter of "hites are good and coloured got corrupted".
The people of Bëor, one of the Edain houses who joined the Elves in the wars against Morgoth, were mingled with Easterlings, and the Easterlings who came were only to a part aligned to Morgoth:
Many who did help Morgoth to victories did not do so out of evil of heart, but trough lies and terror which is the constant tools by which Men are made to not oppose:

And the people of Bór were faithful to the Elves and fought till their end against the allies of Morgoth.

In the Second Age
but its trough the manipulations of Sauron, in areas where the Elves and Dúnedain have not spread the 'evangelium' of Erú and the Valar, by indoctrination and not related to race, just as the kinfolk of Haladin (another of the Edain, forefathers to the Dúnedain) in the west were influenced by and sometimes worshipped Sauron before the Dúnedian returned - and still it should be underlined that most, not all, in the East and South turned to evil.
Again it's much trough terror and fear as tool:
(and yet he, at his greatest point of power, was not lord of all, as seen)


And so it goes on, where the actually most evil and wicked among Men are not the Easterlings or Southrons but the Numenoreans/Duendain, who long before Sauron made them completly fallen made war upon the Men of Middle-earth to make them slaves and plunder their lands for their own gain, and at end committed human sacrafices etc.
Gondor may represent good but they were also imperalists who expanded for their own power and glory, and faced civil war when racist among them under Castamir opposed marriages to other races; racists who commited treason, terror and dictatorship - while it proved that mingling with other folks did not reduce the southern Dúnedains features, which the Castamirians feared.
It should at this time be stressed that the Numenoreans/Dunedain is a race apart not based on evolution, but because God gave features to them as had not been granted other mortals, and the losses of such features were unavoiadble in Middle-earth by default but increased by acting evil, a.k.a in opposition to Erú's will.


We shall further not forget that those Easterlings and Haradrim who came to the west and thus enter the stories that are intended to represent remaining chronicles written by peoples in the West, were those who were in the service of Sauron, willingly or forced, while we do not meet the others; it was not the nice chaps who came west.
In the end of the Third Age:


If Tolkien was a racist by simply talking about races, fine, then he is, yet if what is meant is to value persons based on biological race and belive that some races are better than others, then he is not [Orcs is a side matter, as its a theological issue]. And the lack of moral superiority and value as a human being given to someone because of their mortal shell (even Elves, who is a race of the same species as Man, fall to evil) is what I care about.

Personally what concern Easterlings I just as much percive Tolkien had vikings in mind as mongol people etc., because the only described easterlings in LotR had large beards and big axes, while the only named easterling people are the Variags, which is another name for the varangian guard in Constantinople, that were Norsemen (while later often anglo-saxons). And it make sense, because prior to an European JRR was an Englishman, and from a British perspective the vikings (especially Danes) came from the east

I agree with most of what you're saying bro. But didn't Tolkien describe the Easterlings as swarthy? But anyway, I really like how the creators of the mod expanded on the Easterlings and created their own lore. I really like the idea of a strong eastern empire ruled by Dragon-Kings and wielding powerful armies of men clad in golden steel armor. But I remember one thing I saw in the movie about the Easterlings was that they were carrying banners with serpents (not dragons) depicted on them. Of course Jackson most likely pulled this one straight out of his arse and it has no basis in any of Tolkien's works. But anyways, I like the Dragon cult thing that the mod-creators came up with. Really makes Rhûn seem like a very bad-ass faction.

[Infidel144]

I agree with most of what you're saying bro. But didn't Tolkien describe the Easterlings as swarthy?

Yes, he did. So what?

[Ngugi]

Swarthy is an often used word, but that is (or at least was, perhaps it's used otherwise in places nowdays) not a negative word, it simply describe darker skin complexion, and can be used for Italians or a sunburned Swede like me (not that we get much sun but anyhow ) too, and the term is used for groups of Gondorians, Hobbits and of Bëor's folk.

Well, the serpent is a symbol used by the Haradrim, so may been an additional feature borrowed simply enough.

[Veteraan]

Yes, he did. So what?

Not that I'm the slightest convinced or concerned about Tolkien being a racist, but :

Personally what concern Easterlings I just as much percive Tolkien had vikings in mind as mongol people etc., because the only described easterlings in LotR had large beards and big axes, while the only named easterling people are the Variags, which is another name for the varangian guard in Constantinople, that were Norsemen (while later often anglo-saxons). And it make sense, because prior to an European JRR was an Englishman, and from a British perspective the vikings (especially Danes) came from the east

These guys probably weren't very "swarthy". edit: Especially the Anglo -Saxons , they tend to be either very white or (after enjoying some Spanish sun) very red.

On another note: I didn't know until now that a Germanic word for black that originally meant black survived in the English language.

[athanaric]

Honestly I never liked the fact that in Tolkien works major "Evil" humans are all pretty much middle eastern people .

Regarding that:
http://pjmedia.com/lifestyle/2014/02...inglepage=true

what I really don't like is that Tolkien describes them as inherently evil men.

The excerpts quoted by Ngugi prove that Tolkien did not describe these peoples as inherently evil.

On another note: I didn't know until now that a Germanic word for black that originally meant black survived in the English language.

For a German or a Dutchman it is perhaps easier to understand that "swarthy" is fairly neutral register, especially in this context.
Tolkien intentionally used a lot of old, "antiquated" words and expressions in his prose to correspond with the epic style.

[Cyclops]

Look Tolkien was a) writing in the early 20th century which was not a PC time and b) writing in a number of different styles (William Morris epic, Lord Dunsany ironic, actually norse saga style etc) all of which have conventions about colour where black is bad and white is good (in general) and also where light-skinned people are usually good and dark-skinned people usually inferior.

I think he himself was probably less racist than most but when questioned about Jewish people he's a little evasive and in other places he says dwarves are like Jews, and dwarves are greedy.

Khamul the Black, swarthy "half trolls" (or "like half trolls"), squint-eyed half orcs, orcs speaking lower class english, there are sort-of racist and classist elements here. Elsewhere Tolkien backpedals "oh we're all a bit orcish at times, even me" but thats in the letters, in the books its a bit simpler. Generally black things (and people) are bad, and white things (and people) are good.

There are exceptions of course: the White Wizard is corrupted (although he stops being white), Grima is described as pale, and the dead Hardrim is spoken of sympathetically by Faramir.

I accept the argument Tolkien was not a deliberate overt racist but he did live in racist times and write in racist ouevres, and those attitudes permeate his work.

[Ngugi]

Won't oppose the possibility, though I personally belive he was at least mainly thinking as a linguistic as this is what he spoke about when he compaired them;

The dwarves of course are quite obviously - wouldn't you say that in many ways they remind you of the Jews? Their words are Semitic obviously, constructed to be Semitic.
- interview from 1971

I do think of the 'Dwarves' like Jews: at once native and alien in their habitations, speaking the languages of the country, but with an accent due to their own private tongue.....
- letter 176

The greed is taken from their Norse inspiration.



On another (though not completly) topic I found this delightful language lecture and wanted to share it:

[athanaric]

Look Tolkien was a) writing in the early 20th century which was not a PC time and b) writing in a number of different styles (William Morris epic, Lord Dunsany ironic, actually norse saga style etc) all of which have conventions about colour where black is bad and white is good (in general) and also where light-skinned people are usually good and dark-skinned people usually inferior.

I think he himself was probably less racist than most but when questioned about Jewish people he's a little evasive and in other places he says dwarves are like Jews, and dwarves are greedy.

Khamul the Black, swarthy "half trolls" (or "like half trolls"), squint-eyed half orcs, orcs speaking lower class english, there are sort-of racist and classist elements here. Elsewhere Tolkien backpedals "oh we're all a bit orcish at times, even me" but thats in the letters, in the books its a bit simpler. Generally black things (and people) are bad, and white things (and people) are good.

There are exceptions of course: the White Wizard is corrupted (although he stops being white), Grima is described as pale, and the dead Hardrim is spoken of sympathetically by Faramir.

I accept the argument Tolkien was not a deliberate overt racist but he did live in racist times and write in racist ouevres, and those attitudes permeate his work.

I think people are just getting tired of Tolkien and other fantasy authors being accused of "racism" and "[enter current political buzzword here]".
Authors tend to write about what they know, or believe to know. Male authors usually write from a male perspective and female authors from a female one. Most authors typically write about stuff that happens in their own social, geographical, ethnic, and yes, temporal, environment. Thus we are treated to a myriad of Hollywood movies about WWII and various American issues, and practically none about most other aspects of world history.
Similarly, most fantasy authors nowadays happen to be people from Europe and North America. This means that their protagonists most likely reflect that in terms of race and culture, regardless of genre. Tolkien was a native Englishman writing about a fictional world centered around a fantasy equivalent of 18th/early 19th century England.
If anyone has a problem with that, quit whining and write your own fantasy novels, instead of unfunny and badly researched blog posts or "Cracked" articles complaining about how there are too few black people in Game of Thrones or Harry Potter.

[Cyclops]

...
The greed is taken from their Norse inspiration....

Yeah thats a good point, the legend of Fafnir is a clear influence on the Hobbit, right down to the ring. All thats missing is Sigurd/Sigfried, replaced by an archer. Who's the inspiration for that? Apollo? I think a bit of Greek mythology snuck in there lol.

I think people are just getting tired of Tolkien and other fantasy authors being accused of "racism" and "[enter current political buzzword here]".....

Yep its boring, its quite clear the author was not an evil person. He probably went to boarding school and spent time with a lot of white men, which is probably why there's not a lot of dark skinned people or women in the stories. Its not a big deal.

[Carl Jung was right]

Pardon me but I really get riled up when people accuse JRR Tolkien of racism. Not because I'm such a Tolkien fanboy, but because it's a false view made from the lens of a modern viewpoint that fails to take into account the cultural environment of the era. By such logic, all British people who lived in that era were racist, because their world view was shaped by certain cultural attitudes that would be seen outmoded by now.

Tolkien was heavily influenced by Romanticist literature. In fact, his stories reflect themes and cliches from Romantic fantasy popular in post-Victorian England. Elves, dwarves, fairies, dervishes, devious "orientals" and "asiatic" stereotypes, noble but simplistic negroes, et al, were all mythical creatures which filled the pages of popular literature of the period. Among these, was the commonly accepted view of things and people of an "Eastern" mold being treated as mysterious, mystical, rife with danger and exoticism. Which is arguably, what Rhun and Harad in their entirety were meant to be, dangerous and hostile as they were alluring. Tolkien did not even give a second thought about how his works may have depicted actual Oriental peoples negatively, it was probably not his conscious intention to do so, as he said many times that his works were not meant to be taken as simple allegories. Things which would be seen as obscene today were fashionable back then, just as things which are "normal" today (such as sexual themes) would be seen as obscene back then. The fact that people wrote, read and enjoyed these kinds of works without giving a second thought to their racial implications, does not make them racialist ideologues ala Alfred Rosenberg. It's just that prior to global TV and internet, there was little way for people in one side of the planet to learn about cultures on another, so they tended to form an overly fantastic view of them. Moreover Aragorn himself was said to have traveled all over in these "strange" lands, and his recollections of them, whatever they may have been, were clearly not the disgust and horror that would have elicited from a truly evil place, such as Mordor.


Think about it this way. In the 1930's and 1940's Hitler was very popular in Britain. Especially among the upper class. Victorian cultural attitudes also sympathized with Nazi racial ideologies. He was seen as a defender of traditionalist European values against the rising tide of Bolshevism. It was very fashionable among the higher cultural circles to which Tolkien belonged, to be pro-Nazi, right up until the war. Most of the intellectual elite who did strongly voice their opposition towards Nazism, did so from a left wing perspective, and were often Soviet sympathizers to boot.

Tolkien came from neither direction. He condemned both forms of totalitarianism from the start, not during the Second World War, when it was safe and socially acceptable to do so, but all throughout the 1930's, when fascism was in vogue. His view of the orc society was probably loosely shaped by his experience with military structures he faced in the trenches in World War I, which combined the worst aspects of totalitarian collectivism of both systems. Unbounded brutality, bestial ruthlessness and cruel corporal punishments for the slightest deviations are conditions which soldiers face in the extremity of war, and which were at the time, actively put into practice by political systems in many countries. When asked to provide proof of his "Aryan-ness" by a German publisher, he replied, mockingly, that he regretted not having Jewish ancestry. He didn't care, or delve deeply about whatever moral or political justifications these ideologies made for themselves. All he knew was that the brutal coercion of human beings to serve the political aims of the few was wrong and evil, no matter the excuse. The concept of unbounded power over conscious will having an all corrupting nature, was the key theme of his works. It was highly likely that Tolkien's awareness of the cruel reality under totalitarian political systems, served as an inspiration for Sauron and Melkor's vision of the world they wanted to reign over.

The only thing that Tolkien can be legitimately accused of, is intellectual laziness in regards to his treatment of the "Eastern races" of his mythos, a failure to go beyond "Eastern" stereotypes of contemporary popular culture. He simply didn't flesh them out, or give their back-story nearly as much depth and plausibility as he did for the other races present in his works. Whether it was due to lack of time or lack of concern doesn't matter. It is definitely something that stands out and is viewed rather offensive or at the very least inappropriate by modern readers. But not by any means, should it be called racist, because that belies a complete ignorance of its genuine definition.

[MicCal]

But I remember one thing I saw in the movie about the Easterlings was that they were carrying banners with serpents (not dragons) depicted on them. Of course Jackson most likely pulled this one straight out of his arse and it has no basis in any of Tolkien's works.

I think that the Easterlings at Black Gate in TTT were originally meant to be Haradrim just like the book states - the banners, that suit well to Tolkien's description (black serpent on red background) is one thing; the other are their arms and armor, which can be seen later in the movie in the hands of Haradrim in Ithilien:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Two guys to the left are wearing parts of the same armor that was used in the Black Gate scene




And this one looks exactly the same, save the helmet

[Dude with the Food]

I think Caarl Jung was right is right. When you look at the African tribes/Asian kingdoms, many of them were played using fear by westerners or otherwise destroyed/invaded/replaced which isn't far off what happens in Middle Earth. Case closed. Can we finally get on to the important topic?

If Melkor could only mutate existing creatures, how did he get to dragons? The only things close enough in terms of power I can think of are eagles and at the beginning of the silmarillion, they don't seem to be the types of things he could capture easily.

[Ngugi]

If Melkor could only mutate existing creatures, how did he get to dragons? The only things close enough in terms of power I can think of are eagles and at the beginning of the silmarillion, they don't seem to be the types of things he could capture easily.

Don't underestimate a world where unnamed and undescribed beasts lived in ages past

Then the seeds that Yavanna had sown began swiftly to sprout and to burgeon, and there arose a multitude of growing things great and small, mosses and grasses and great ferns, and trees whose tops were crowned with cloud as they were living mountains, but whose feet were wrapped in a green twilight. And beasts came forth and dwelt in the grassy plains, or in the rivers and the lakes, or walked in the shadows of the woods.
(...)
Green things fell sick and rotted, and rivers were choked with weeds and slime, and fens were made, rank and poisonous, the breeding place of flies; and forests grew dark and perilous, the haunts of fear; and beasts became monsters of horn and ivory and dyed the earth with blood. Then the Valar knew indeed that Melkor was at work again...
- Silmarillion; Of the Beginning of Days

There he delved anew his vast vaults and dungeons, and above their gates he reared the threefold peaks of Thangorodrim, and a great reek of dark smoke was ever wreathed about them. There countless became the hosts of his beasts and his demons, and the race of the Orcs, bred long before, grew and multiplied in the bowels of the earth.
- Silmarillion; Of the Flight of the Noldor

The great shadow descended like a falling cloud. And behold! it was a winged creature: if bird, then greater than all other birds, and it was naked, and neither quill nor feather did it bear, and its vast pinions were as webs of hide between horned fingers; and it stank. A creature of an older world maybe it was, whose kind, fingering in forgotten mountains cold beneath the Moon, outstayed their day, and in hideous eyrie bred this last untimely brood, apt to evil. And the Dark Lord took it, and nursed it with fell meats, until it grew beyond the measure of all other things that fly; and he gave it to his servant to be his steed.
- RotK; The Battle of the Pelennor Fields

[Cyclops]

...By such logic, all British people who lived in that era were racist, because their world view was shaped by certain cultural attitudes that would be seen outmoded by now...

The past is a foreign country, they do things differently there.

I think our ancestors might not recognise us, and find our attitudes ridiculous or offensive. I recall the casual racism of my grandmother, a generous and loving person who could not believe any "white" woman would marry a "little jap". In fact my sister married a guy whose mother was at Hiroshima (a Samurai family no less) and he's not six foot, but gran was senile for a decade by then so she had no idea.

Thats just three generations ago. Tolkien was born an educated a generation before my grandmother, and for him the idea a brown man was equal to a white one would seem a theological possibility but a social absurdity.

Recall he began writing the legendarium before WW1 was finished, but he was quizzed about his work in the wake of the Holocaust, so there's no doubt some ideas would look bad in light of events.

I know "racism" is a hot button, but I wouldn't damn JRRT for it. We're made of isms and I'm sure I hold attitudes my descendents will find apalling. He seems to have been a decent chap, old fashioned, not cruel and wrestled with how theology intersected with his fantasy world.

[athanaric]

The only thing that Tolkien can be legitimately accused of, is intellectual laziness in regards to his treatment of the "Eastern races" of his mythos, a failure to go beyond "Eastern" stereotypes of contemporary popular culture. He simply didn't flesh them out, or give their back-story nearly as much depth and plausibility as he did for the other races present in his works. Whether it was due to lack of time or lack of concern doesn't matter. It is definitely something that stands out and is viewed rather offensive or at the very least inappropriate by modern readers. But not by any means, should it be called racist, because that belies a complete ignorance of its genuine definition.

Indeed, and I wish there were a really good writer (preferrably authorized by the Tolkien estate) who'd flesh out the other parts of Arda and write novels set in those regions. IMO Tolkien's world has a lot of potential and is less cheesy than most other fantasy worlds.