Tolkien General Discussion II

**Veteraan** · February 09, 2017, 09:06 AM

This brings me back to my childhood days, because when I was twelve and read the Lord of the Rings for the first time (in Dutch), the 3 books had covers by Cor Blok.

**AmrothForGondor** · February 09, 2017, 09:36 AM

Speaking of LOTR illustrations, i found this russian illustrations in the Tolkien reddit, they have a medieval tapestry feel.

https://imgur.com/a/Ea4js

**Ngugi** · February 09, 2017, 09:49 AM

Nice, enteraining with the very eastern iconography in some images (Aragorn with gloria and angel above Galadriel), and interesting takes on Nazgul, Orcs and the Balrog ^^

That's something I'm afraid the movies taken form us; we'll see less diverse, personal takes on how things looks in the future.

**Maiar93** · February 09, 2017, 10:02 AM

Really interesting pictures. The Bridge of Khazad Dum looked super funny though it's like a plank xD

**Mhaedros** · February 09, 2017, 10:52 AM

The Hobbits in Return to the Shire looks stunning

Indeed, as Ngugi says it's a shame a lot of culturally inspired pictures like these probably won't be as common in the future (or in the Now for that matter!).

**AmrothForGondor** · February 09, 2017, 04:38 PM

yeah, i took me some times before i created my own "visual headcannon· different from the movies.

**AmrothForGondor** · February 19, 2017, 05:19 PM

By the way, one doubt i had watching the Men of the Mountains preview in DCI: Last Alliance,in the lore did they march against Gondor or they did just simply hide in their fortress?

**Ngugi** · February 19, 2017, 05:29 PM

They did not participate in the war at all; they did not want to honour their Oath but did not dare to challenge the Dúnedain either:

Originally Posted by RotK; The Passing of the Grey Company

‘I hope that the forgotten people will not have forgotten how to fight,’ said Gimli; ‘for otherwise I see not why we should trouble them.’

‘That we shall know if ever we come to Erech,’ said Aragorn. ‘But the oath that they broke was to fight against Sauron, and they must fight therefore, if they are to fulfil it. For at Erech there stands yet a black stone that was brought, it was said, from Númenor by Isildur; and it was set upon a hill, and upon it the King of the Mountains swore allegiance to him in the beginning of the realm of Gondor. But when Sauron returned and grew in might again, Isildur summoned the Men of the Mountains to fulfil their oath, and they would not: for they had worshipped Sauron in the Dark Years.

‘Then Isildur said to their king: “Thou shalt be the last king. And if the West prove mightier than thy Black Master, this curse I lay upon thee and thy folk: to rest never until your oath is fulfilled. For this war will last through years uncounted, and you shall be summoned once again ere the end.” And they fled before the wrath of Isildur, and did not dare to go forth to war on Sauron’s part; and they hid themselves in secret places in the mountains and had no dealings with other men, but slowly dwindled in the barren hills. And the terror of the Sleepless Dead lies about the Hill of Erech and all places where that people lingered. But that way I must go, since there are none living to help me.’

**AmrothForGondor** · February 20, 2017, 08:24 AM

Thanks for the answer Ngugi, truly a great loremaster

**Ngugi** · February 20, 2017, 08:50 AM

Sharing what I may ^^

**Salah-ad-deen** · February 20, 2017, 04:25 PM

I have a question. How does the ring increase power for different people, for example, Gollum became more keen of hearing I believe, how would it effect others if they used it?

**Infidel144** · February 20, 2017, 05:45 PM

"The chief power (of all the rings alike) was the prevention or slowing of decay (i.e. 'change' viewed as a regrettable thing), the preservation of what is desired or loved, or its semblance - this is more or less an Elvish motive. But also they enhanced the natural powers of a possessor - thus approaching 'magic', a motive easily corruptible into evil, a lust for domination. And finally they had other powers, more directly derived from Sauron ('the Necromancer': so he is called as he casts a fleeting shadow and presage on the pages of The Hobbit): such as rendering invisible the material body, and making things of the invisible world visible."
Letter 131

**athanaric** · February 21, 2017, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by Mhaedros

Holy mother of Ilu, those things go for thousands :O Maybe I should've paid more attention during the arts lessons

It's weird how LotR and other works of Tolkien mostly have fan art and illustrations that are either idiosyncratic modern art like this (it's fun to look at, but can't say that I'm a fan of it), or terrible kitsch (there's only one or two exceptions I can think of). Whereas A Song of Ice and Fire seems to be drawing (har har. geddit?) more, and better, artists who deliver naturalistic depictions. Or is that just my impression, based on incomplete knowledge of fan art? Does anyone know any quality naturalistic/realistic Tolkien fan art?

**♔atthias♔** · February 25, 2017, 05:15 AM

I have a question
is durins bane a balrog like they apear in is earlier work when they were more like trolls so that turgon could kill seven of them or a maia balrog like they are in his later works
I ask this because when legolas encounters durins bane he cries a balrog a balrog of morgroth
to me that reads like a creature that is tortured into a balrog like orcs are of elves
can anybody shed light on this?

**Ngugi** · February 25, 2017, 06:57 AM

Yes, Maybe and No

Yes, in that it seems JRR still considered the Balrogs as created beings (though not made from any pre-existing creature) when he wrote LotR* and remained in texts afterwards.
Maybe, as the idea of Balrogs as Maiar came before LotR was published*.
No, as in that the concept of Morgoth creating Balrogs was dropped completly, meaning that the Balrog in Moria was a Maiar.

This is a good survey on the topic: http://tolkien.slimy.com/essays/TAB3.html

**♔atthias♔** · February 25, 2017, 01:11 PM

Originally Posted by Ngugi

Yes, Maybe and No

Yes, in that it seems JRR still considered the Balrogs as created beings (though not made from any pre-existing creature) when he wrote LotR* and remained in texts afterwards.
Maybe, as the idea of Balrogs as Maiar came before LotR was published*.
No, as in that the concept of Morgoth creating Balrogs was dropped completly, meaning that the Balrog in Moria was a Maiar.

This is a good survey on the topic: http://tolkien.slimy.com/essays/TAB3.html

thanks for the answer
also I cannot rep you for this so could somebody else do this please?

**Ngugi** · February 25, 2017, 02:44 PM

You're welcome
No need, no need

**santesale** · February 26, 2017, 10:56 AM

Gandalf is a Maia, send to Middle-Earth to fight Sauron. His real name is Olorin. When he arrived in M.E. he traveld from the North to the South and to the greatest part of the West.Therefore, it is possible that he knew many languages, including the Black Speech. And LOTR it's not a low-magic setting. You would be amazed by the amound of magic M.E. has.