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Thread: Tolkien General Discussion II

  1. #3081
    JJJaikishan's Avatar Vexillifer
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    Default Re: Tolkien General Discussion II

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperTechmarine View Post
    Funny you should say that, I was just discussing that with Feanaro.

    If we assume an Alcarondas is the size of a carrack (Considering the description, and the fact that Numenorians were ocean-faring with these ships, something galleys, galleons and other galls would have a hard time doing), the number of its crew, the space gained if you remove the cannons (Which obviously Elendil didn't have), you come to a number of around 600 possible crew members, plus whatever civilians Elendil could fit in and you might have a number of 700-1000, mulltiply this by 9 and you have the number of Dunedain that came with Elendil to Middle Earth.
    In accordance to that calculation, the Elendili would have amounted to about 8000 odd people, with lets assume 3000-3500 men of fighting age(At the least).
    However, this calculation completely throws the number of Ar Pharazon's host out of the league of every army ever assembled. Even if his 'Great Armament' had 100 ships, that would amount to 50000 men atleast. Could Numenor have supported that kind of an army?
    A nation cannot just take every able male and make him a warrior. There are shipwrights, farmers, miners, etc. all the things that make up a society and economy would have to be taken into account so the total number of available men as warriors is a relatively small percentage of the population, less than 10% at the most and usually more like 5% in time of war. A typical human population would be 50% women & 35% young and old males leaving only 15% of the total population as males of the right age. Of that, many would be involved in other activities as described above leaving at best 10%. Of that 10% some would be in supply, sailors, etc.
    Also, if the Numenorians lived far longer than the regular non-edain men, and even 30% of the entire male population was fighting as soldiers, even then, Numenor would have to have a population in the range of atleast 300,000, which I honestly think is out of the bounds of the island nation.
    Also, we must keep in mind that the Numenorian kings before Ar-Phrazon were not great rulers either, and gradually, the Dunedain, had started migrating to Middle-Earth (These are the ones which make up the bulk of Elendil's army during the battle of the last alliance.)
    Your veiws loremasters...?
    Last edited by JJJaikishan; Today at 02:36 AM. Reason: Some addition

  2. #3082
    Calypze's Avatar Vexillifer
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    Default Why can't the dwarves build boats?

    It means the two islands are forever safe from a dwarven invasion.

  3. #3083
    Ngugi's Avatar TATW Local Moderator
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    Default Re: Why can't the dwarves build boats?

    Quote Originally Posted by Calypze View Post
    It means the two islands are forever safe from a dwarven invasion.
    The reason is lore.
    And I could provide the quotes about it, but since it is clear from before that you lack the manner to say even thank you when you do get an answer, I won't bother.

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  4. #3084
    Calypze's Avatar Vexillifer
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    Default Re: Why can't the dwarves build boats?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ngugi View Post
    The reason is lore.
    And I could provide the quotes about it, but since it is clear from before that you lack the manner to say even thank you when you do get an answer, I won't bother.
    Thank you, sorry about that earlier.

    I originally posted it as an independent thread, didn't consider it a general LOTR question.

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