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Thread: Scottish Football 2013/2014

  1. #1161
    Mausolos of Caria's Avatar Pili Prior
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    Take part in my poll on tm NOW!

    Fair enough, they did indeed sign too many useless players. But going after that, Hibs deserve it even more It's strange if you see the squad and there are young talents (Stanton or Harris) as well as players who have played at a very high level in the past (Kevin Thomson for instance) and now they also got a good manager. But Butcher probably needs time to find his own players and I think things are seriously wrong in their dressing room. Some of these players play like they are even less motivated than Bayern or Frankfurt right now.

    Don't forget Dundee, they might also end up staying after the Morton result

    19 May 2012
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  2. #1162
    Cold_Mac's Avatar Princeps
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    Lets try and analyse them

    Hibs are a total mismatch. Don't think their squad is worse than ICT's, but seemingly don't fit Butcher's style at all.

    - From a footballing standpoint, I think most problems stem from the fact that their singular fit striker is a galloping hippo that is, in my eyes, barely good enough for the second division. Defense is fine, with fine, tidy footballers (Hanlon) and technically very poor (Nelson) stalwarts.

    - Going for the manager. He just babbles about the same issues (we lack fight....got to make fans proud....players have to fight...) and doesn't seem to have a clue to imprint his direct, fast vision of football on a team built entirely for flat, slow sitting back.

    - Apparent lack of flexibility on his part which leads to him loaning a bunch of disinterested, poor players from the english leagues and expects them to lift the team.

    - His midfield requires energy and forward passing. None of the qualities possessed by a midfield consisting of Thomson, Taiwo, Stevenson, Robertson & Tudur-Jones. Very static, reactive, with little flair & creativity.

    A manager like McInnes or Tommy Wright would appear to be much closer to maximise the potential of the squad than Butcher.
    Satisfaction is a mere construction - but a beautiful one.

  3. #1163
    Treva, the Renewer's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    What's this about a poll?
    The tentacled horror from beyond my stars spoke, and von Neumann help me, in my madness, I understood its words.

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  4. #1164
    Mausolos of Caria's Avatar Pili Prior
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    I think it's too easy to blame Butcher for what he said in the media, most players and managers always speak the same phrases these days :tongue: Well signing loan players (mostly from England) is a usual praxis and every club outside the OF does it because of the restricted wherewithal in financial terms. Motherwell for instance have been very successfull doing it, be it the unbelievable Lukas Jutkiewicz, the tricky Lionel Ainsworth or the steadfast Gavin Gunning. But obviously it also requires scouting and there's no doubt that George Boateng was one of the most pointless signings ever. Probably Butcher isn't too blame on his own for this, also other folk like Rod Petrie, but as it is the squad is unbalanced and has been for a while.
    Personally, I think Hibs would need to strengthen the following areas and could do with the following players:

    1. ATTACK:

    The current situation: As you remarked, they need to sort out their strikers. James Collins has eventually shown he is not worth the fee and they should try to get rid of him. Heffernan is a good experienced striker, but often plagued by injuries. He should be a decent backup. That leaves Handling and Cummings, the latter is only 18 and has shown glimpses of talent, so he would be the other back- up together with Heffernan. I'm not sure about Handling, he had some good games last season and should probably be loaned out, but he's out of contract so maybe it's time to move him on. The same goes for Ross Caldwell, who is on loan with Alloa, but only scored twice for them. One of the the two needs to go.

    The possible solution: Hibs need a striker who is dynamic, who has pace and a vision to always go at goal and shoot- someone like Leigh ,,Sparky'' Griffiths. Luckily, exactly a player like him is there on the offering at the same club Griffiths was at- Livingston's Marc McNulty. Livi's season has been inconsistent, but McNulty- who's equally called ,,Sparky''- has always been a threat to the opponent's goals, even when he failed to score he rarely had a quiet game. Even his character seems to be similar to Griffiths, and Hibs might need to pay a decent fee. But as every young attacking player he could repay them not only with goals, but also with a higher fee later on and it's a risk Hibs should take.

    2. MIDFIELD (Including the Wings):

    The current situation:
    I agree with you, the midfield lacks energy and pace. Taiwo is terrible, he needs to go. Thomson will leave as well, and Dean Horribine hasn't got the talent. On the wings, Watmore and Haynes will go back to their current clubs and they won't be missed that much. Zoubir can be an exciting player, but he lacks the consistence and should also leave, especially if we consider the lack of game action he saw in recent weeks. Alex Harris and Sam Stanton are the bright lights in Hibs' midfield, and the club did well to tie both down on long- term deals. In a more consistent and confident team, both have the potential to blossom. The same can be said about Liam Craig, who was a very effective midfielder at St Johnstone and is still Hibs' top scorer of the season.
    Scott Robertson wasn't that bad either, but it also depends on his wage if Hibs should and could keep him as well as Paul Cairney, who can and has also been a good player and he's a specialist for set-piece situations- and Tudur- Jones, who is familiar to Butcher and can perform the destroyer- role. All three of them are probably too much. But Hibs definitely need another winger and perhaps a quick attacking midfielder.

    The possible solution: A solid box-to-box midfielder would add the necessary energy to the Hibs midfield and he might come in form of St Mirren's Kenny McLean, who showcasted all of his talents on Saturday against the Green and White. After his injury he needed some time to regain his form, but he's definitely talented enough and out of contract now. Probably not a bargain, but Kallum Higginbotham is an exciting player who can play both on the wing as well as in the center. He has a sublime shooting technique, can overrun defenders and is faster than most of Hibs' current players. Maybe that's a crazy idea, but an alternative would be Nigel Hasselbaink, who enjoys freedom of contract in the summer and offers great pace and technical ability. On the downside, he is also an inconsistent player and probably not the kind of player Terry Butcher would look out for. More likely he would sign someone like Marley Watkins from his former club.

    3. DEFENCE:

    The current situation: Let's start with the easy ones... Daniel Boateng will go, Maybury will at most retain his playing registration, but focus on his coaching works. Ryan McGivern often joins the attacks and he's had a lot of time to prove himself, but in the grand scheme of things I would get rid of him since he's not stable enough as a left-back. Michael Nelson can be an experienced back-up, James McPakes' fitness is very much in doubt and he might leave to take a restart somewhere else. Paul Hanlon has been Hibs' best defender this season and should and will stay, only since his injury have Hibs really slipped into relegation troubles. Jordon Forster is strong in the air and has a lot of potential. Lewis Stevenson can cover left-back and defensive midfield and has never been among the worst so he could stay. This leaves Hibs with the demand for at least one new defender...

    The possible solution: Hamilton's Ziggy Gordon has been named among the Championship team of the season, and rightly so. The 20-year-old with Polish roots has quickly developed into one of the best defenders of the division. He prefers to play at Right Back, but has also played as a centre back or left back this season so he could cover all positions. If they would want a true left back to replace McGivern, Hibs could additionally sign Falkirk's Stephen Kingsley for free, who is more of a defensive player. However, if they would still have the funds to pay a fee Graeme Shinnie would obviously a great signing, but he might be more ambitious.

    As for goal, Ben Williams is okay I think, an average SPL keeper.

    @ Treva On another forum, sorry ;)
    Last edited by Mausolos of Caria; April 20, 2014 at 03:52 PM.

    19 May 2012
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    ''Of all the small nations of this earth, perhaps only the ancient Greeks surpass the Scots in their contribution to mankind.''

    Sir Winston Churchill

  5. #1165
    Treva, the Renewer's Avatar Sagittarius
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    Hey, hey, hey, obsessions with your rival club's weaknesses are only allowed for Old Firm fans.
    The tentacled horror from beyond my stars spoke, and von Neumann help me, in my madness, I understood its words.

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  6. #1166
    Cold_Mac's Avatar Princeps
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    I think it's too easy to blame Butcher for what he said in the media, most players and managers always speak the same phrases these days
    But he is Terry Butcher! His interviews at Motherwell/ICT were always refreshingly direct. Not now. He offers no insight, no alternative, no direction and foremost no opinion in his answers. In his early ones, he singled players out for praise/criticism but since then he's on the Allan Johnston road.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    Well signing loan players (mostly from England) is a usual praxis and every club outside the OF does it because of the restricted wherewithal in financial terms.
    Yes, there are examples of loans working out but usually it tends to show lack of scouting & could be counter-productive on the long-term.

    Its problematic that you can't loan more than 2 players from one SPFL club in the same division, although the aim here is to improve the youth development and their first XI chances. Most loanees are on higher-average wages, don't have any reason to do exceptionally well for you and tend to have better options if they do.

    Is there a better no way to spend your resources than throw them at an unknown quality for an unknown quantity of games on a very dubious basis? It is no sustainable business model, unless you are Everton. Remember the 5:1 game? Hibs had 4 loanees in the starting XI.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    Motherwell for instance have been very successfull doing it, be it the unbelievable Lukas Jutkiewicz, the tricky Lionel Ainsworth or the steadfast Gavin Gunning.
    Motherwells have done really well here, agreed, though I rate some non-british deals (Ojamaa, Anier) or permanent deals for experienced professionals/young talents as their best. Clubs like Aberdeen, Dundee United & St. Johnstone use loans less & lesser and mostly to cover emergency situations.

    Those examples are, in some cases, years old
    Was Jutkiewicz that good? Scored about 11 goals and seems to be idolised because one of them was breathtaking. Ainsworth, so far, had 5 month of good football, but shown signs of remarkable improvement under McCall and should be best advised to stay.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    1. ATTACK:
    Agreed, keep Handling & Cummings who are both prolific at U-20 level and get a McNulty-esque striker. I'd say the best possible outcome could be a deal for Scott McDonald - out of contract for Millwall, has worked under Butcher before and would probably be available.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    2. MIDFIELD (Including the Wings):
    Yep, the basic fundament is there but Stanton & Harris are too inexperienced/young to carry the creative burden. Why the hell did they let Wotherspoon leave? Have to say, Craig has been a disappointment since Butcher came in. His deeper, central role is probably not his best.
    Nigel Hasselbaink was exactly my association when I read your post Higginbotham might be available on the cheap if Partick are finishing on the relegation spot.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    3. DEFENCE:
    Another option might be to loan Darren Fisher (lovely self-contradiction) from us and sign whoever doesn't get promoted from the championship? Although Falkirk players tend to stay with their hometown club as long as a big offer comes along and Kingsley is one everybody raves about.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    As for goal, Ben Williams is okay I think, an average SPL keeper.
    Problem here is - he's going to leave, according to the Hibs researcher. With the current team - Williams, there might be genuine relegation trouble ahead.
    Satisfaction is a mere construction - but a beautiful one.

  7. #1167
    Erebus Pasha's Avatar vezir-i zam
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  8. #1168
    Mausolos of Caria's Avatar Pili Prior
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    I increasingly get the impression, that captain Hamill doesn't like people

    @Hibs:

    Are you implying that Butcher has been spoiled by the Green-White Hell of Easter Road?

    Well, if you scout them properly you can get loan players in who are above the potential players have that the club can usually recruit. For the parent club, it's useful to give them experience anyway. Lukas may be overrated But this will be remembered for ages: http://youtu.be/bQvQEFczWis?t=4m10s

    I can agree with most of the rest. Which goalkeeper should they sign, if Williams actually leaves? I don't think Sean Murdoch is up to it.

    19 May 2012
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    ''Of all the small nations of this earth, perhaps only the ancient Greeks surpass the Scots in their contribution to mankind.''

    Sir Winston Churchill

  9. #1169
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014

    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    I increasingly get the impression, that captain Hamill doesn't like people
    He's a bit like Barocogo at the moment.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    Are you implying that Butcher has been spoiled by the Green-White Hell of Easter Road?
    Even he can't escape! Doomed to be the second coming of Colin Calderwood!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mausolos of Caria View Post
    I can agree with most of the rest. Which goalkeeper should they sign, if Williams actually leaves? I don't think Sean Murdoch is up to it.
    Scott Bain? Heard it is probably Lukasz Zaluska, which wouldn't improve them.
    Satisfaction is a mere construction - but a beautiful one.

  10. #1170
    Mausolos of Caria's Avatar Pili Prior
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    Default Re: Scottish Football 2013/2014



    Brilliant.

    19 May 2012
    Hibernian 1-5 Heart of Midlothian


    ''Of all the small nations of this earth, perhaps only the ancient Greeks surpass the Scots in their contribution to mankind.''

    Sir Winston Churchill

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