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Thread: Harad is too strong!!!

  1. #41
    Flinn's Avatar His Dudeness of TWC
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Arrived too late

    anyway, in general when you have to fight against overwhelming factions, the best thing you can do (apart from using blitzing strategies as seanbg properly suggested, that is ALWAYS useful) is to approach them carefully. Study their allies and enemies, try to hit the first ones and give help to the seconds to open up other fronts for them and split their forces as much as possible and when ready storm them; use hit and run strategies as much as possible (raiding/looting avoiding cities with garrison script) use small cavalry army to intercept and vanquish their wandering small armies and keep the war on their land. Use of some assassins or tring to surrond and kill their best generals if they wander alone on the map would be useful too.

    At least this is what I would have tried, but probably in your situation it wouldn't work. A pity, after such an epic campaign ..

    Flinn

  2. #42
    knicolas2's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    what game version is the savegame? vanilla 3.2 or submods?

  3. #43

    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    I agree with the original poster, Harad is very overpowered. Its vast territory and comparatively isolated position (only Gondor is any threat) allow it to develop militarily and economically without much challenge. If you are not playing Gondor you tend to ignore Harad because of the other evil factions that are pressing at your borders. Meanwhile Gondor is getting creamed.

    If you are Gondor then your focus is mainly on holding off Mordor and Harad while you build up militarily and economically, then dealing with whatever factions are assaulting Minas Tirith when Sauron declares a crusade. It's hard to go on the aggressive successfully until late middle game.

    Meanwhile the other AI good factions almost never provide any real help to the player faction, and usually need player faction help just to survive.

    This means Harad typically becomes the "Main Threat" by the time the player has achieved the level of development shown by the original poster. Players familiar with the Maratha faction in Empire Total War know what I mean. I honestly think that toning down the AI Harad faction might be a reasonable suggestion, in MHO.
    Last edited by Captain Adverse; December 08, 2012 at 09:43 PM.

  4. #44

    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    I agree too. My suggestion harad should be divided two faction like corsairs of umbar and haradwaith or something. and also rhun is very strong it must be divided too.

  5. #45

    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post

    If you are Gondor then your focus is mainly on holding off Mordor and Harad while you build up militarily and economically, then dealing with whatever factions are assaulting Minas Tirith when Sauron declares a crusade. It's hard to go on the aggressive successfully until late middle game.
    I agree with the rest of your post, Harad needs toning down, perhaps dividing it into various tribes which constantly fight each other. But as Gondor I have gone on the offence with great success, and I just reached turn 50. Harad is on its knees, I have taken over half of its lands, all the best ones. Umbar itself fell on my 18th turn.

  6. #46
    FC Groningen's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by geppetto View Post
    I agree too. My suggestion harad should be divided two faction like corsairs of umbar and haradwaith or something. and also rhun is very strong it must be divided too.
    That will only make it worse as Gondor will probably end up fighting 3 factions with AI bonusses. Best solution I see is either tone down the number of provinces Harad can take for free until they reach enemy territory (which is a lot!), combine some provinces in that region, or lessen their economy or "king's purse".

  7. #47
    Macilrille's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Ideally from a Lore perspective, it should be Mordor that is THE main powerhouse of the evil factions. Though from a Lore perspective the Corsairs should be a seperate faction too and Rhûn should be divided in two (one for Dale-Dorfs and one for Gondor), but it would make it harder to play as Gondor. But then again, from a Lore-perspective; Gondor is underpopulated and underdeveloped. It would all require a major rebalancing of the game and that is not so likely.

    How does Harad play if you play it? Is it still a powerhouse or has Gondor taken that role?

  8. #48

    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Macilrille View Post
    Ideally from a Lore perspective, it should be Mordor that is THE main powerhouse of the evil factions. Though from a Lore perspective the Corsairs should be a seperate faction too and Rhûn should be divided in two (one for Dale-Dorfs and one for Gondor), but it would make it harder to play as Gondor. But then again, from a Lore-perspective; Gondor is underpopulated and underdeveloped. It would all require a major rebalancing of the game and that is not so likely.

    How does Harad play if you play it? Is it still a powerhouse or has Gondor taken that role?
    Playing Harad is the easiest of all the evil factions, if not the easiest of ALL factions. Harad's starting position in the lower eastern corner of the map means Gondor is the only Good faction close enough to pose any threat. Gondor is also willing to accept a ceasefire if you send a diplomat right away. Offer 100 gold tribute for a number of turns and Gondor will stay peaceful too. This allows you to take all the bandit cities east of the Anduin, turtle while you build up your economy and military, attack Gondor when YOU are ready, and the rest is cake.

    Mordor is your ally, but Rhun isn't although they will readily ally permanently if you get a diplomat over there ASAP. Just don't delay too long because sometimes they will declare war to try and get your eastern-most provinces.

    Your territory is pretty big even without all the "freebee" bandit cities that AI Harad can take, and your economy is easy to build up and gets very strong, able to support large quality armies much sooner and easier than Gondor.

    Aside from one "free" navy and invasion force Gondor gets sometime after turn 80 which you need to build a navy to defend against, Gondor never sends naval invasion forces against Harad. The Harad player just needs to place a couple of holding armies near the river border to fend off Gondor's armies, and when you are ready, send seabourne invasions against Gondors western provinces at will.
    Last edited by Captain Adverse; December 09, 2012 at 03:41 AM.

  9. #49
    Påsan's Avatar Hva i helvete?
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    ... What a challenge!


    KILL THEM ALL!



    No seriously. That looks fun.

  10. #50
    FC Groningen's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    I'd say Rhun is more easy to play as their opponents don't receive the massive buffs Gondor receives. If you're playing as Rhun and you do everything as efficient as possible, I have it confirmed that you can have both the Dwarves removed from the eastern part of the map and Dale destroyed around turn 50.

  11. #51

    Default Re: Harad is too strong!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Adverse View Post
    Playing Harad is the easiest of all the evil factions, if not the easiest of ALL factions. Harad's starting position in the lower eastern corner of the map means Gondor is the only Good faction close enough to pose any threat. Gondor is also willing to accept a ceasefire if you send a diplomat right away. Offer 100 gold tribute for a number of turns and Gondor will stay peaceful too. This allows you to take all the bandit cities east of the Anduin, turtle while you build up your economy and military, attack Gondor when YOU are ready, and the rest is cake.

    Mordor is your ally, but Rhun isn't although they will readily ally permanently if you get a diplomat over there ASAP. Just don't delay too long because sometimes they will declare war to try and get your eastern-most provinces.

    Your territory is pretty big even without all the "freebee" bandit cities that AI Harad can take, and your economy is easy to build up and gets very strong, able to support large quality armies much sooner and easier than Gondor.

    Aside from one "free" navy and invasion force Gondor gets sometime after turn 80 which you need to build a navy to defend against, Gondor never sends naval invasion forces against Harad. The Harad player just needs to place a couple of holding armies near the river border to fend off Gondor's armies, and when you are ready, send seabourne invasions against Gondors western provinces at will.

    At what level of dificulty your talking ?

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