The Stainless Steel Answer Station - ask all questions here - NOT FOR BUG REPORTS!

[k/t]

Units with a slung shield get +1 to armour and have 0 shield.

[flyingcat]

shields give armor bonus to front and left side depending on the shield stats in edu

no regardless of how the unit model looks shields dont provide bonuses to the back. no way to change it.

thanks.

Then still a related question if it doesn't bother you:What's the use of shield wall?

For example,Scoutatoi Swordsmen.
I suggest it was much more widely used in history than stakes,however I couldn't find its use in SS.

[Vissewalde rex de Gerzika]

It is good vs charges, at least in theory.

[Andytheplatypus]

thanks.

Then still a related question if it doesn't bother you:What's the use of shield wall?

For example,Scoutatoi Swordsmen.
I suggest it was much more widely used in history than stakes,however I couldn't find its use in SS.

as far as the actual effects that shield wall gives the unit, I have no idea if it provides any bonuses or not.

I use shield wall to help units absorb charges, it is usually good at that provided the defending unit has enough armor.

it is also effective when used in cities because of the limited space for units.

even when shield wall is given to missile units it actually works amazingly well if you need to use archers in a confined space

[k/t]

I think the shield wall belonged to an earlier era. There are still some units who have it in SS, but a lot fewer than in the TLK mod.

In terms of effects, M2 stakes are unrealistic crap.

[flyingcat]

I use shield wall to help units absorb charges, it is usually good at that provided the defending unit has enough armor.

Hmm..It may be that case in theory,but in game heavy cav(>feudal) could easily crash through the walls.it's useful against light cav anyway.

I think the shield wall belonged to an earlier era. There are still some units who have it in SS, but a lot fewer than in the TLK mod.

In terms of effects, M2 stakes are unrealistic crap.

Stake,I think,is a CA's design to strengthen English.
In my perspective(or dream),shield wall should be useful against straight arrows(like crossbows),and it might be widely used..(I don't know,just guess)

[k/t]

"Stake,I think,is a CA's design to strengthen English."

Don't forget the AP longbowmen with 7 attack.

People have reported taking fewer casualties from missiles when in shield wall. I remember someone doing a test, too, but I don't remember the results. I think he found equal losses when in loose formation or in shield wall.

Cavalry will be toned down a little in RC2, which will feature in SS7. Ultimately, the engine doesn't depict the effects of a charge all too well, so all we can do is tinker.

[FriendoftheDork]

Is the Archery Guild supposed to work? I got it seemingly at random in a city I captured, while my own city (Trebizond) where I have pumped out archers alot I'm not getting it. In any case, it does not give experience to any of my archers yet, and the first guild building looks like a roman barracks...

[k/t]

A lot.

You have to recruit the units right before you end your turn in order for experience bonuses to be given. The Woodsmen's Guild is pointless anyway, since the Swordsmiths' Guild will give the same bonus but to more units.

[FriendoftheDork]

A lot.

You have to recruit the units right before you end your turn in order for experience bonuses to be given. The Woodsmen's Guild is pointless anyway, since the Swordsmiths' Guild will give the same bonus but to more units.

No the experience bonus is not there at all. I'm not talking about the bug that "forgets" extra honor, there is no possibility of recruiting archers with more honor.

The Swordsmith Guild is acting weird too, I got it in a castle I never built any swordsmen in, while the ones I have built them is not getting it.

[Andytheplatypus]

No the experience bonus is not there at all. I'm not talking about the bug that "forgets" extra honor, there is no possibility of recruiting archers with more honor.

The Swordsmith Guild is acting weird too, I got it in a castle I never built any swordsmen in, while the ones I have built them is not getting it.

did you retrain the units and its not getting experience?

or you are not given the option to retrain them?

[FriendoftheDork]

did you retrain the units and its not getting experience?

or you are not given the option to retrain them?

There is no option to retrain them at all.

Horse Breeders guild works just fine in comparison.

[Andytheplatypus]

There is no option to retrain them at all.

Horse Breeders guild works just fine in comparison.

pretty sure you can only retrain units that you can recruit from that settlement

[FriendoftheDork]

pretty sure you can only retrain units that you can recruit from that settlement

Ok since we are not clear still after 3 posts:

1. I got the Archer's Guild in Palermo on Sicily.

2. I can recruit Muslim Archers and Toxotae there. (I'm Byzantines).

3. None of them are listed with valour/experience bonus, and can't be retrained.

4. Horse Breeders Guild and Swordsman Guild gives experience as they should.

5. Archers guild level 1 looks like the roman barracks from RTW in the building browser, but looks like a normal guild when built.


UPDATE: It works for Murtatoi, the Byzantine superior archer. I couldn't see it right away as I can only get those in the byzantine recruitment zone (I get muslim archers instead in Sicily).

It's strange though that it doesen't work for my basic levy archers, the toxotae. Is there a value that don't count it as an archer?

[k/t]

Perhaps it's due to the Missile/Skirmish distinction.

[FriendoftheDork]

Perhaps it's due to the Missile/Skirmish distinction.

Indeed. Mourtatoi is class missile, while Toxotae is class skirmisher. That's very strange.

Also, Highland Archers and Sherwood foresters are skirmishers, while Longbowmen and Yeomen Archers are missile.

Anyone else noticed this strangeness in their game? Also, will reclassifying the units be save-compatible?


Which file describes the effect of each level of guild? The export_descr_guilds gives the triggers, where skirmish units also gives guild points as well as missile units.

[flyingcat]

Indeed. Mourtatoi is class missile, while Toxotae is class skirmisher. That's very strange.

Also, Highland Archers and Sherwood foresters are skirmishers, while Longbowmen and Yeomen Archers are missile.

Anyone else noticed this strangeness in their game? Also, will reclassifying the units be save-compatible?


Which file describes the effect of each level of guild? The export_descr_guilds gives the triggers, where skirmish units also gives guild points as well as missile units.

That's easy.
When you have a battle deployment,notice that your missile troops will be initially disposed behind most infantry,while skirmishers will be disposed in the front.
If I'm right,I remembet any archer with less than 5 attack is skirmisher.

[napoleonic]

in real world classification, missile unit is one that shower arrows upon enemies from long range while skirmisher shots more directly to the enemies in shorter range.

[FriendoftheDork]

That's easy.
When you have a battle deployment,notice that your missile troops will be initially disposed behind most infantry,while skirmishers will be disposed in the front.
If I'm right,I remembet any archer with less than 5 attack is skirmisher.

I've noticed my Mourtatoi are often behind my lines, which is not good as I want them to the front to deploy stakes.

Muslim archers have 5 attack and are still classified as skirmisher, despite also having long range. Crossbowmen also have skirmisher class despite their attack value.

It seems most archers in the mod has the skirmisher class.

In any case, you're not answering my questions.

[flyingcat]

I've noticed my Mourtatoi are often behind my lines, which is not good as I want them to the front to deploy stakes.

Muslim archers have 5 attack and are still classified as skirmisher, despite also having long range. Crossbowmen also have skirmisher class despite their attack value.

It seems most archers in the mod has the skirmisher class.

In any case, you're not answering my questions.

Ahh.

go to SS6.3\data\export_descr_unit.txt

every unit has a long list.Find its category and class.

Muslim Archers:Category infantry,Class Skirmisher
Mourtatoi:Category infantry,Class Missile.

I think changing it is enough,but I don't know whether they are save-compatible or not.

A bit Interesting,because I have always thought that Muslim Archers have 4 attack..
Don't criticize me so hard,and I'll feel guilty