Spain - Compact army?

[MDCCLXXVI]

Currently deep into a relaxed Spain campaign, not interested in completing victory conditions, just attacking and defending.

So, here is what I'm looking for.

An efficient and useful SMALL army composition for Spain.

Some parameters:

- 5-8 units, no more than 8, preferably closer to 6.
- Late game.
- Field army, not for city or castle battles.
- Not auto-resolved battles.

And the purposes of the SMALL army:

- The most cost effective and efficient army to inflict maximum focused damage on enemy stacks. I don't want any redundancies or 'dead weight' in this army.

- To neutralize an enemy stack in the field. Not necessarily destroy completely, but to render the enemy stack combat ineffective. Example is to target/eliminate the seige and heavy inf of an enemy stack that is presumably heading toward one of my cities/castles.

- The other side of that, is to hamstring an enemy field stack by taking out its cavalry and/or bows.

--

I understand there might be a few different compositions.

And yes, I like Jinetes but don't want 8 units of Jinetes in the army.

[Nicolaos]

Sorry delete please

[Nicolaos]

Idk maybe
1x General
1x Gendarmes
2x Infantry (e.g. Chivalric Knights)
2x Missile like spanish knights

[Silverheart]

Considering the parameters OP presented, I´d say a lot of cavalry would be necessary for maximum success.
Only Jinetes would indeed be ineffective, since they wouldn´t be able to do much once they run out of javelins.

Given the parameters, I´d rather suggest something like:
1. 8 Knights (mailed, feudal or chivalric optional - I like the mailed ones best)
A classic heavy cavalry-based army. I´ve tried in french and german campaigns to utilize cavalry-only armies, and have found that the tactic of charging straight at enemy archers with 4 units while outflanking with the others (on both flanks, so 2 units each) was surprisingly effective at annihilating much larger armies. Just make sure to not let your knights get caught up in melee, and make full use of their charges from both front and rear! Also, you will lose many men with this, so you need to have castles close to your borders where they can be retrained quickly.
2. 4 Knights, 4 Mounted Crossbowmen
Also an effective combo - you can either let the crossbowmen pepper the enemy from the front while outflanking with the knights, or outflank with the crossbowmen and keep the knights away (charging at enemy archers might be necessary, though) until they´re out of ammo - then you begin outflanking with the knights instead after the enemy has been weakened by the arrows.
3. 4 Knights, 2 Dismounted Knights, 2 Musketeers (optionally, Pavise Crossbowmen)
With this one you let the foot troops stand back while the knights outflank the enemy. Let the missile troops fire away at any enemy who gets within range.
If they get too close, charge in your infantry from the front while the cavalry charges in from the rear - this will hopefully chock the enemies into rout, and if not, just pull the cavalry back and charge again.
4. 2 Knights, 2 Tercio Pikemen (center), 2 Dismounted Knights (flanks), 2 Musketeers (optionally, crossbowmen)
With this one, you get a full, balanced army in pocket-size - knights for outflanking, missile troops for weakening enemies, pikemen to hold the centreline, and heavy swordsmen to grind down the enemies flanks. Utilizing the same tactic as in example 3, you can take on a variety of troop types effectively with this one.

Personally, considering that OP claims to not be interested in conquest but merely skirmishing across the borders, I´d would prefer the all-cavalry armies, since they are much faster and more mobile than any army with foot troops in it, making them ideal for decisive cross-border raiding.

[windsupernova]

As far as small, mobile armies that work good on the field.

Get Cavalry. Maybe 4 Heavy Cav and 2 Missile Cav?

[PrestigeX]

I'd probably go with

1 - family member
2- Chivalric Knights / Knights Santiago
2 - Pavise Crossbowmen
2 - Mounted Crossbows.


if you wish, you can take NO pavise xbowmen and then increase the cavalry numbers.
Reason being, is that Mercenary Crossbows are relatively easy to hire - and are pretty much as good as Paviser Xbow.
This would be especially useful becaue if you are All mounted, then you can march further =).

in my games I often cancel the infantry entirely for Field armies, and rely on Mounted troops and then Missile Troops - especially by the mid or late game, no so much in the earlier period btw.

[shikaka]

Only Jinetes would indeed be ineffective, since they wouldn´t be able to do much once they run out of javelins.

While Jinetes are not chivalric knights in melee, they can fight well if needed. Kind of a two purpose unit like Boyar sons. They are mailed knights without formed charge.


As for the question: I would probably take 2 heavy cavalry and 4-6 jinetes.

[BM309K58SMERCH]

3. 4 Knights, 2 Dismounted Knights, 2 Musketeers (optionally, Pavise Crossbowmen)


4. 2 Knights, 2 Tercio Pikemen (center), 2 Dismounted Knights (flanks), 2 Musketeers (optionally, crossbowmen)

Personally as a Spain player, I would say those two are the best combinations. I don't know whether they will be considered compact enough for you, but they're perfect.

[Double A]

I played a Rohan campaign in TATW until it started unnecessarily glitching out on me, and I fought the Uruk-hai with an all-cavalry army comprised of about 6 bodyguards, 2 heavy cavalry, and 3 horse archers. Since bodyguards are half-sized units, that's 5 HC and 3 HA, just make sure to bring a general. It was a lot of fun. I kited the Uruks with my HAs and then charged them from every direction with my blob of HC. I won a lot of battles with very acceptable losses, and I was getting attacked by about two stacks every turn. They were mainly heavy infantry with a few archers, but if they had cavalry, I would have killed that first with the same strategy. When any but the most elite unit is charged from all four sides by cavalry, it is going to rout.

[Silverheart]

While Jinetes are not chivalric knights in melee, they can fight well if needed. Kind of a two purpose unit like Boyar sons. They are mailed knights without formed charge.

Correct, Jinetes are quite good at surviving in melee - they´re surprisingly tough compared to most other missile cavalry.
But firstly, their lack of range and low ammo makes them inefficient without other troops to take over once they´re run out. They can then be utilized for melee duties to provide extra weight.
However, they´re poor at charging, and unlike the Boyar Sons they are medium in both armour and armament (the Boyar Sons are heavier, and armed with axes). In other words, they are good at surviving in melee, but not at killing - they work best when charging in behind knights to provide extra weight, or intercepting enemy cavalry that´s pursuing your own knights (forcing them into melee and opening up a possibility for the knights to charge from the rear).
Secondly, their poor charging capabilities means that they will not have much impact on a large enemy army (which would be able to sustain the damage from the javelins and still have plenty of soldiers left) once they are out of ammo. Attempts to charge the enemy into rout would only work if you continously focus as many as possible on units that are out on the flanks or isolated - in which case you would still lose a lot of men, and eventually not be able to scare the enemy any more.

I´m not saying they´re poor troops, since I myself hold them in high regard (and groan whenever I encounter enemy armies that have them). I´m just saying that they are not as useful in small-army-versus-large-army situations as Knights or Mounted Crossbowmen (which have more ammo and longer range), and that´s the kind of situation I was advicing for.
In battles against enemy armies roughly the same size or smaller than theirs, they are still invaluable, of course

[herne_the _hunter]

1 x family member and 7 x mounted crossbowmen with the general to just recruit mercenaries if and when needed. Hit and run agogo...

[Double A]

If the retreat mechanic actually made any sense, that would be a wonderful strategy, though I am partial to a high dread general and a stack of horse archers.