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Thread: Fireships - Flaming Hogs of The Seas

  1. #1
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    Default Fireships - Flaming Hogs of The Seas

    Observing the stubborness of CA and the R2TW TWC subforum on those Pigs Barbequed Alive, either born from Historicity debates, for the lulz gameplay, pyromania, or just love for charred bacon...I'd like to discuss about Fireships. Atleast both of them burns.

    Fireships are known to be a bane for Closely-Packed Ship Formation...something The Armadas of The Antiquity tend to form.

    I get the inspiration for this thread after reading Naval Game Importance Thread, especially this post about Siege of Rhodes by Shigawire
    Quote Originally Posted by Shigawire View Post
    I would just like to share this gem I found in my book by Paul Bentley Kern "Ancient Siege Warfare" by Indiana University Press
    It's about ship-borne catapults. It's about Demetrios Poliorketes' siege of Rhodos.

    From Paul Bentley Kern's "Ancient Siege Warfare" by Indiana University Press

    He needed to gain control of the harbor in order to seal off Rhodos from the outside world. He mounted a stone-throwing catapult on a cargo ship. Protective sheds covered both catapults. Ship-borne siege towers four stories high supported the catapults. To prevent the Rhodians from ramming or sinking the ships bearing the siege machinery, a spike-studded boom floated ahead of them. Demetrius fortified lighter ships with walls of planks. The plank walls protected long-range arrow-shooting catapults and Cretan archers. Shooting through embrasures that could be closed when not in use, the catapults and archers killed the Rhodians who were trying to strengthen the harbor's fortifications.

    The Rhodians fully realized the importance of keeping their harbor open, and they took strong measures to defend it. They stationed catapults at two key points at the entrance of the harbor and covered the catapults with protective sheds. They also built platforms on the cargo ships in the harbor to make them capable of bearing catapults.

    Rough seas thwarted Demetrius' first effort to deploy his ship-borne siege machinery against the harbor. When calm weather arrived, Demetrius carried out a night attack that succeeded in capturing the end of the mole at the mouth of Rhodes' largest harbor. He landed four hundred soldiers there who fortified the place with a wall of stones and planks behind which he stationed a variety of catapults. These catapults were only five hundred feet from the walls of Rhodes, well within the range of Demetrius' powerful stone-throwers. During the next day, these catapults disabled the Rhodian siege machinery in that area and seriously damaged the city's walls, which were weak and low at that point. But the Rhodians were able to fire back at Demetrius' catapults, inflicting sufficient damage to decide him to withdraw his machines at the end of the day. The Rhodians pursued him with fire boats and managed to set fire to some of Demetrius' ships before being driven back by the spiked boom and Demetrius' arrow-shooting catapults.

    The next day, Demetrius attacked again, but this time he not only launched his siege ships against the harbor but at the same time attacked the city on land from several sides. He sustained these attacks for eight days, during which his stone throwers smashed the Rhodian siege machinery at the entrance to the harbor and damaged the harbor fortifications. Some of Demetrius' soldiers actually captured a portion of these fortifications. However, they were unable to hold their position against a Rhodian counterattack.

    Many of the ships that had landed these soldiers smashed on the rocky shoreline or ran aground. The Rhodians burned the grounded ships, leaving Demetrius' force in a desperate position. This action diverted the Rhodians, however, giving Demetrius the chance to land more soldiers, who attacked the city by escalade.

    Fierce fighting over the walls inflicted heavy casualties on the attacking force, including some of Demetrius' most important officers. These losses forced Demetrius again to withdraw his forces. Seven days were required for him to repair his siege machinery and ships, giving the Rhodians time to repair their damaged walls.

    When Demetrius returned to the attack, he again concentrated entirely on the harbor. Once again he moved his siege machines forward, shooting flaming arrows at the Rhodian ships and throwing stones against the Rhodian wall. Demetrius pressed the attack with great determination, and the Rhodians were in considerable difficulty. However, they were able to extinguish the fire arrows, narrowly averting the loss of their fleet. Their situation was still precarious, however, and the democratic magistrates issued a desperate call to the Rhodian aristocracy to man ships to save the city.

    Execestus, the chief admiral, took command of three of the best Rhodian ships, manned by the best rowers, and counterattacked Demetrius' siege ships in the hope of stoping the bombardment that was shaking the walls of Rhodes. Demetrius' catapults subjected the Rhodian ships to intense fire, but they advanced with such speed that they broke through the iron-studded beam that protected Demetrius' siege ships. Such was the skill of the crack Rhodian rowers that the Rhodian ships sunk two of the siege ships by repeatedly ramming them, a tactic for which Rhodian sailors were famous. In an age of grappling and boarding, the old art of ramming had declined, and it may have been new to the Macedonians.

    To save the third siege ship, Demetrius ordered it hauled back with ropes. The Rhodians, flushed with success, recklessly pursued. They soon found themselves surrounded by enemy ships, and one of the Rhodian ships, which carried Execestus, fell into Demetrius' hands. But the other two escaped, revealing the greatly superior skill of the Rhodian sailors.

    Undiscouraged, Demetrius built another sea-borne siege machine that was three times bigger than the ones the Rhodians had disabled. As he brought this monster forward, however, nature rescued the Rhodians. A violent storm arose that capsized the gigantic siege ships, whose size may have made them top-heavy. The Rhodians took advantage of the storm to make a sortie from the city against the men Demetrius had landed on the mole. Isolated by the ferocity of the storm, these men, who numbered four hundred, soon had to surrender. Thus the Rhodians retained control of their harbor. The importance of this was soon demonstrated when more than 650 soldiers from Knossos and Egypt sailed into the harbor to reinforce Rhodes. They undoubtedly brought abundant supplies as well.

    Having failed in two attacks on the harbor, Demetrius changed strategy. He now gave up hope of isolating Rhodes and directed his attacks against the city itself. He meant to break through Rhodes' defenses by the sheer weight of his attack. The centerpiece of the assault was to be the largest siege machine in the history of siege warfare, the "helepolis," or "taker of cities." The helepolis was the work of Demetrius' leading engineer, the Athenian Epimachus.
    The Post do not focus on the fireships itself, but on a Naval Siege, followed by Joint Naval-Land Amphibious Siege. Thats what interests me the most...

    But Let us return to our pyromaniacal discussion about Fireships shall we? Why do i bring this post about Naval Siege?

    1>Because Fireships are not designed to be fireships from the start - they are Improvised Weapons (just like flaming pigs) thats known for its effectiveness, and used wisely by clever commanders.
    2>For that reason above, The Fireships should be a Siege buildables for both The Besieger and The Besieged - akin to Battering Rams, Ladders, and Siege Towers, built in-site by engineers.

    I believe the fireships should be sailing vessels...couldnt imagine being a rowing vessel...a waste of rowers...sailing ships are more crew-efficient - Fireships always sailed by skeleton crews...

    The Direction of The Winds would be crucial for commanders using Fireship Attack against The Naval Gauntlet Besieging The Port...

    What do you think?

  2. #2

    Default Re: Fireships - Flaming Hogs of The Seas

    I think I support this idea... I only have reservations about how it might be implemented because enemy can see on minimap and also AI seems to know right when its been targeted. If fireships appeared to enemy as normal ships until the final attack that might work otherwise they will simply be targeted first and mostly useless.

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