Appeal 808 - Biased interpretation of the TOS

[koultouras]

So finaly this has came to this.

Your accusations do not institute any violations of the TOS.

To my perception every single of my "Glorious 9" posts conduct one (violation)

But yours is different than mine.

CASE 1.

Originally Posted by hellheaven1987
I wonder what does Greek economy has to do with name of Macedonia and Cyprus.

Originally Posted by Koultouras
Directly linked mate.
We are in dire financial situation, and all those things that
were slightly-or widely disputed while in normal periods, they may be used diplomaticly now against us.

Do you understand?
The links are obvious
it is the very same way that every Brittish discussion ends up with a "bollocks" as final word.

The link ?
It is obvious that Brittish have no other thing in their minds than Bollocks.

P.S. This is not an offensive post.
Thank you.

This is not violating the Tos, at least according to your interpretation.
All i say is that
"have no other thing in their minds than Bollocks."
If you try to convience me that a mind is not
the intellectual centre of a humans thinking/argueing/talking....
Then I and the whole rational world will laugh at you.
Is it or is it not a human s mind the center of thinking?
If so i just made a comment @ Brittish way of thinking.
I deny the accusation

CASE 2.

Just leave the all the worthless Southerns to rot and create a North European Union. That or simply kick out Greece.

Originally Posted by koultouras
So where would your gay people, which is a vast majotiy of your population would go for vacations
if Greeces and Mykonos in particular would be considered a 3rd world country's island?

I particulary liked that a lot.
If Holger Dansk feels i am refering to him , as if he was gay, i am not.
Perceiving this post of mine by u as that, is also a conduct against
my intended meanings.
It is an assumption, a specula, and i dont accept it.
If he thinks i meant him , it is not my problem.
it is his.
I said that there is a vast majority of his countrys population that is consisted
by homosexual people.
How that is establishing a directly or implied insult to him?

This is my closing and last thesis on the matter.
Gentlemen

I have quite well shown you with no more than 10 posts
and by having 2 threads concerning greek matters closed
in less than 7 hours since I started getting berserk,
that moderation is not about
sticking to the TOS ruling verbum
but also expanding it up its
actual sensus - pneuma.

Unfortunatelly this could be avoided, if you
had listened to us and given us the chance to
propose our alternative.
I am no fool, with no whatsoever
aknowledge of what is respect and tolerance of the
"different"

Your biased /or bigotry-wise conception
of what should one expect from discussion, and/or allowed to practice within it,
has given me , as several other members in the past,
a chance to derail a crucial to some, debate, to start
trigering flame- threads ,the presense of which i found
offensive to my tastes, and blatantly "burn" the clima
of a debate.

Unless you have been blind lately, this has happened
in no less than 3 threads, and generaly to any other
thread that happens to involve sensitive
(not only greek , it is not "all about greeks")
matters debating.

No post of mine contained any violation of the TOS.
IMHO although they all conduct violations
,THEY DO NOT if the TOS is literaly taken, as I was
advised to do in my "TOS violation & Appeal 804" thread.
Unfortunately this is what you also
happen to do, ...literaly ,obsessively and rigidly taking TOS under consideration,
legalizing behaviours of trolls
and provocateurs , and leaving people with an
intellectual capacity to perform well in a debate, unprotected against
a madness called trolling-flaming-ignorance-arrogance.

Your interpretation of TOS, has also given some users
the chance to use its Flaws.
And instead of tweaking it , you tried to make
a fool out of the ones trying to say the simpliest of matters
THAT they were offended by a mishanding of a debate
due to rigourous insistence on TOS rules.

I again deny that my posts conduct any violation.
If you want to see why, you can ask yourselves
where the TOS covers any of those "socalled" insulting/or infraction worthy posts.
If though you can not find them, then all i can say is that you are the very ones that
produced this, not me. I just followed the rules stressing them to the limit.
And never have overpassed them.
If lastly you punish me then you are obviously violating the TOS yourselves
cause you are one-sidedly interprete it.
Unless all of the posters made the same with me are punished
you have no legitimate right to punish me.
Selective appliance/abiding and interpretation of a law is also a violation of the LAW.


Last by not least
This is my proposal to you.

Add to the TOS the following
1) Provocating posts. Posts that without commenting, rudely target the ideas of an individual
and have nothing to do with the integrity of them but they only serve as
"fun" having, flame producing, "verbal explosion" provocating posts.

2). Discriminating post. ANY post that dangerously generalizes Nations/people/ethic groups/social classes-groups
and individuals on a steroptypicall basis, or tries to create a stereotype.

3) Humiliating posts. Post targeting peoples expressed minds, thought process, ideas themselves and
posts in which they refer to.You may comment , disagree, agree, be sceptical, but no idea
is/can be perceived as more moronic than another.
That will also encourage young posters to participate.


Closing.

READ IT AND DESPAIR!

I am not my avatar.
This is a net-forum, not a real one.
We do not interact as we would in a physical world
The only way to meet me is through my thoughts as depicted via posts
Once those are attacked (AND NOT PROPERLY COMMENTED)
this also conducts a direct offence to me.

I leave you by some quotes of my nations imho greatest writter.
Greece yes, that retarded nation which is full of morons and hypocritical hyper-sensitivity
as for stupid national matters or democratic/moral terms of discussing.

You can translate that , but i bet this would sound greek to you(except greek members of the council)
the quotes

Two quotes for the Truth

Δεν υπάρχουν ιδέες , υπάρχουν μονάχα άνθρωποι που κουβαλούν τις ιδέες, κι αυτές παίρνουν το μπόι του ανθρώπου που τις κουβαλάει.

Νιώθω σαν να χτυπάμε τα κεφάλια μας στα σίδερα. Πολλά κεφάλια θα σπάσουν. Μα κάποια στιγμή, θα σπάσουν και τα σίδερα.
Ν. Καζαντζακης.

P.S.
This is not an offensive post according to TOS
This is a directed offense towards TOS itself.

Thank you.

Appendix

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Good morning mate.

Well you obviously know that i an no fool and i m not trying to
spoil neither my integrity here nor have i gone mad.
The nine post cited are my only 9 "flaming" ones in my history.
To my interpretation of the TOS they all DO conduct a violation.

BUT AS I WAS TOLD TO SITES INTERPRETATION THET DO NOT.
And please let this be known to those that REFUSED the violating aspect of this kind of behavior, that i urged them to seize accepting it,
yet they tried to convience me that all are running fine.

The posts should not be deleted if you inteprate the TOS literaly
as Jom, GreenEYE_D and other moderators have indicated in my "TOS violation and Appeal 804" thread.
Please mind that if i get infracted by those posts,
i will appeal ....(no need to say what i will use for a defensive line....)

None of them violates the TOS.
The one says that there are gay people in Sweden, has an extremist logic that they field a vast majority of its population and nothing else.
The second has the word BOLLOCKs which is not punishable
and was refering to the thinking of a population NOT the persons themselves, which again is not a violation.

Unless you are saying as for the first
that there are no gay people in (sweden) and as for the second that
Bollocks is an insulting word and/or tergeting a people's way of thinking(which is offensive to me ) an offense.

You see i can play allong very well this parody.
You guys just turned me to a very dangerous troll.
Instead of making simple moral rules/teaching other how to interact verbaly
you are turning the most moderate of us to extremists.
Instead of revising a tool here , you just gave me a weapon.
I am a moderate educated fool who tries to reverse
the sensous formed against my people.
I also demand equal treatment and terms of proper
discussion.
I asked for it repeatedly.
None has ever understand that what i am doing
is what YOU guys should have prevented , not urged not embraced



If they cant provide me or my compatriots moraly established terms
of dialogue, i will turn this against them.

I am furious of the hipocricy around here.

Unless the debates and discussions around here get monitored more
so to prevent behaviours like mine in the last 9 posts, there will eventuall be
no discussion.
You failed to protect me when i asked for it.
Now you just have to close a thread after another.
Even If by a potential infraction i will make that LOUD and CLEAR
i have no worries.
Unless you guys provide a better TOS
I will continue do what i am just doing.



I am terribly sorry that our first interaction was
under these circumstances.
I m not the person of the last posts.
Believe me.
Yiannis.

Sorry mate but i am not getting passed this one.
Not this time, not as the members of this Board chosed
to escalate this crisis, rather than fix the flaws.I have also been a victim as for posting methods of some
that deliberately are left unharmed.

Why is Ferrets(btw just an example , i dont mean always him)
was left to massacre the 3threads concerning greek matters
and my last post was deleted as disruptive, without a second thought.
Please dont tell me that none of his posts were disruptive
cause i have made a list in my ''appeal 804'' thread and i can provide more
disruptive posts of his that none, but our side, has
ever claimed it as disruptive.
Although i repeatedly have been victimized from posts like that
i ve never seen a mod. having the same sensitivity, and closing
threads or deleting posts with no additional action taking place(a report e.g.) previously.

As for your suggestions
1. I have never in the list of 9 posts made
insulted anyone as nationalist directly
2. This is what i am saying from the very start
When you personalize offenses , posts can be too vague to see whether this targets
the person or his ideas.
I am speaking of ''Bollocks in British people minds''
So i am speaking about their thinking.
You know english , u can make an estimation of what i said.
And if you find that i personalized the insult, then i say you are terribly wrong.
And u can not establish any conduct against the TOS.
If you guys admitt that attacking someones ideas is also a violation
then yes u have a case
BUT THAT IS WHAT I AM SAYING BACK FROM THE START.
Yup , i am a good learner you see, it comes with the job.
3. I have tried but none seemed to listen.
Me and my fellow Greeks have been blatantly taking insults and
all we did is react to it.
The members of this Board just closed their hears ....
embracing what is self-explanatory as misbehaving.
I have nothing more to add other that this.
I have been a member since 2008.
I have given one hell of contributions to a site that doesnt protect
my ideas.
i HAVE GIVEN THEM FOR FREE, with a great cost of personal time,
wife moaning sessions, and tireless overnighting.
I demand both respect of my work and of my physical importance / essence
And my essence is my thoughts....
If you dont agree with this...
Then be my guest and let me present my thoughts
of the needs for strict moderation in D&D, and stricter TOS operation to the
Tribunal.

Once again i would have preferred to get knowing you
under different incidents.
Sorry again about that.

1. Since this is not what i wrote, ones feeling that i meant he is a gay is a speculation he did.
My post is lound and sound.
I assumed/ implyed that his people is consisted from a vast majority of homosexual people.
If he thought i meant him ...it is his problem , not mine....my message is clear.....
I refuse the accusation.
2. According to tos critising peoples minds(as of thinking-posting ) is not.
violating the TOS.
You guys try to establish a violation according to which what I meant is recieved as insultive. It is not. I didnt mean it this way. This is again your assumption.

Is it OR is it not a person's mind the way he thinks/interacts/talks????
If so then I refuse this accusation too

P.S.
Tell them they have nothing.

Even if so , the TOS has not such a case provided.
Given that i also express my point of
view via my posts , and swearing is not crime here,
allthough i am obviously targeting people, (and it doesnt matter whether i do it
against their physical or intellectual essence), this is no violation provided from
your , till yet flawless ''Bilble''.

So unless you also change the definition of disruptive in tos
in a manner that would also prevent me, getting away with the above
you remain completely exposed against people like me.
(Moderate people, reliable people, who snapped when saw the
hypocrisy of selective appliance of a law.)


Since you recently took charge , you need to hear what
your inferiors (let it be in '' _ '' cause by my vocabulary i cant find a suitable word)
have to say, and if troubled by smth, not to bash them as the representatives of this board
are doing all the way , until now but to talk your way
through a solution.

Have you guys did anything else than refusing a problem and its existence?No!
Have you guys tried to understand where we come from and what we stand for? No!
Have you guys ever thought, ''whats wrong with this...they can not be only them(us)...there has to be smth wrong with things around ...here''? No!

All we hear is your precious , flamboyant invention ...Terms of Service
Well i tell you what, service is not to defy what a member wants/has to say when complaining.
Service is not closing your hears to what others have to suggest you
in order to better your service.
Lastly Service in not smth that defies simple humanity's rules of life yet tries to impose
terms of interaction that derives from animal kingdom(the tougher and the strongest in trolling survives)

Animals do not provide services amongst them, people do.

Am i supposed to be scarred of what you just wrote...?
mate really ....i mean come on....
You guys do nothing but roaring all day.
Be human, talk the situation through.
But that is a suggestion you probably will follow
after my infraction which is planned in 1.35 am tonight
An infraction with no legitimation what soever.

Its not about taking points out of you people, or losing them....gosh look where antagonism spreads its seed.
Its about me and other members , who have smth to say or disscuss having the terms to do it properly.


P.S. This IS an offensive post.
Thank you.

[Jom]

Post: Greece thread - the guarantee blockbuster of Mudpit
User: koultouras
Infraction: insulting others
Points: 0

Administrative Note:

Insulting others.

Message to User:

Hi koultouras,

Insults are not allowed anywhere on TWC and unfortunately two of your recent posts are insulting to members of particular nationalities.

So where would your gay people, which is a vast majotiy of your population would go for vacations
if Greeces and Mykonos in particular would be considered a 3rd world country's island?

It is of course fine to say that some people from any country are gay, but claiming that the vast majority are gay suggests that the ones posting here on TWC are probably gay, and that is likely to be taken as an insult by the ones who are not in fact gay.

It is obvious that Brittish have no other thing in their minds than Bollocks.

We allow a wide leeway to criticise what other people think, so it is fine to describe what another member has said as bollocks, or nonsense. The problem here is that you are saying that everything that all British people think is bollocks. Saying that other members think nothing but nonsense goes well beyond the current topic of discussion and is insulting.

This is just a note which carries no actual penalty, but it does go on your record to show that you have been notified about these rules previously. If you keep posting stuff like this the penalties will become increasingly severe.

Regards,
DBH

Original Post:

I wonder what does Greek economy has to do with name of Macedonia and Cyprus.

Directly linked mate.
We are in dire financial situation, and all those things that
were slightly-or widely disputed while in normal periods, they may be used diplomaticly now against us.

Do you understand?
The links are obvious
it is the very same way that every Brittish discussion ends up with a "bollocks" as final word.

The link ?
It is obvious that Brittish have no other thing in their minds than Bollocks.

P.S. This is not an offensive post.
Thank you.

[koultouras]

i just saved you guys some time....lol
I ask both texts (main body and appendix )to be read before verdict
As for the fact of me opening it the thread , its because i havent been aware of the procedure.
And there was also a misunderstanding between me and DBH.
can the posts of Jom and mine be switched?

My answer to DBH
last PM

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

1. Since this is not what i wrote, ones feeling that i meant he is a gay is a speculation he did.
My post is lound and sound.
I assumed/ implyed that his people is consisted from a vast majority of homosexual people.
If he thought i meant him ...it is his problem , not mine....my message is clear.....
I refuse the accusation.
2. According to tos critising peoples minds(as of thinking-posting ) is not.
violating the TOS.
You guys try to establish a violation according to which what I meant is recieved as insultive. It is not. I didnt mean it this way. This is again your assumption.

Is it OR is it not a person's mind the way he thinks/interacts/talks????
If so then I refuse this accusation too

P.S.
Tell them they have nothing.

[koultouras]

Btw it is ok closing a thread....
But deleting critical to my case evidence is not.
Bravo.Congratz!



http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...7#post11539037


Can i report you guys now?

[Harry Lime]

Despite the nationality stamped on my passport, I can assure you that gay bollocks are the furthest thing from my mind. However I would like to remind you that the Tribunal is a place to appeal your infraction only and not a place to soap-box your thesis on the general standard of the Terms of Service.

[koultouras]

Despite the nationality stamped on my passport, I can assure you that gay bollocks are the furthest thing from my mind. However I would like to remind you that the Tribunal is a place to appeal your infraction only and not a place to soap-box your thesis on the general standard of the Terms of Service.

lol...now thats more like it.
That thread was containing evidence so i suppose that it is linked directly to my appeal here....
Btw ...*sigh....what a strong lanuguage there...

[Harry Lime]

Invalid link...so I can't see it but more importantly you weren't infracted for 'strong language'. Bollocks isn't covered by the censor so it is not censor-bypassing which, I suppose, is the TWC equivalent of strong language.

What you did receive a note for is stating that the vast majority of a country was gay, interpreted as in it's homosexual connotation and not the happy & carefree one. And also that British people "have no other thing in their minds than Bollocks". Now this could mean that all they think about is testes or nonsense or possibly the eponymous, 1977 album by the Sex Pistols (although I find the latter to be a trifle far-fetched even for my fertile imagination). Either way it is an insult to label all people in this manner.

I would like you to explain why this isn't insulting others according to the ToS, please.

[koultouras]

Because the "MIND" >>> is not protected by tos....(when what it says is being with no limitations interpreted as "attack the post not the poster,")
BTW i stand for neither of them, posts should be commented, posters should be respected
But a poster IS his post.
Unless you are claiming that we interact physicaly and not mentaly around here.
Mind>Thought>IDEAS>SAYINGS>POSTS is not protected

And again
as for that gay matter, if the offended one feels i meant him it is not my problem,
If say to you,
"Where would your poor people go, which is a vast majority of your population, if greece colapses."
...would u think that i meant that you(that person with the nickname "Harry Lime") are poor??????

I am clear enough to my appeal points.
A wall of text that may be, yet fully accessible nevertheless, to no avail as for those critising my english speaking cap.
Read it before asking me smth i ve already explained.

[Harry Lime]

I wanted you to condense your defence for no-one enjoys reading a wall of text and as most of it seemed to be a tirade against irrelevant matters, I wanted to give you the best, possible opportunity of defending yourself against this infraction and not to be detoured into areas the Tribunal has no remit over.

[koultouras]

I wanted you to condense your defence for no-one enjoys reading a wall of text and as most of it seemed to be a tirade against irrelevant matters, I wanted to give you the best, possible opportunity of defending yourself against this infraction and not to be detoured into areas the Tribunal has no remit over.

Then I stand for what i just said.

Case 1

Because the "MIND" >>> is not protected by tos....(when what it says is being with no limitations interpreted as "attack the post not the poster,")
BTW i stand for neither of them, posts should be commented, posters should be respected
But a poster IS his post.
Unless you are claiming that we interact physicaly and not mentaly around here.
Mind>Thought>IDEAS>SAYINGS>POSTS is not protected

Case 2

...as for that gay matter, if the offended one feels i meant him it is not my problem,
If I say to you,
"Where would your poor people go, which is a vast majority of your population, if greece colapses."
...would u think that i meant that you(that person with the nickname "Harry Lime") are poor??????

I would also like to have the reports of the users offended.
It would not be right not knowing what excactly i am being accused of.
I am requesting the actual texts of the reports

[Harry Lime]

Case I

I have no idea what your argument is. You're arguing that the ToS doesn't protect your mind and therefore it's ok for you to break the rules? Do you want Ged to implant cybernetic devices to quell your rebellious tendencies?

Case 2

It is irrelevant whether I, 5000 British Grandmothers or the Grand Old Duke of York was offended by your posts. The only assumption that is made is, "is this post insulting other members using the below set of criteria"

Using race, religion, sexual orientation, culture, ethnicity, handicap, nationality, or gender as a means of insult, either directly or implied

and for the unmentioned Case 3...

Using race, religion, sexual orientation, culture, ethnicity, handicap, nationality, or gender as a means of insult, either directly or implied

[koultouras]

Case I

I have no idea what your argument is. You're arguing that the ToS doesn't protect your mind and therefore it's ok for you to break the rules? Do you want Ged to implant cybernetic devices to quell your rebellious tendencies?

Case 2

It is irrelevant whether I, 5000 British Grandmothers or the Grand Old Duke of York was offended by your posts. The only assumption that is made is, "is this post insulting other members using the below set of criteria"



and for the unmentioned Case 3...

Answer
1.
What is your expression of your mind in a debate within this site?
According to TOS what I did is not prohibited.
I havent broken any rules.
I repeat read the TOS , present me violations clearly conducted and clearly prohibited by it, not a biased interpretation of what I did.

2.
I havent used an orientation of any kind as an insult. I clearly made a statement.
It may be an hypothetical one, a speculating one, a false one, or a provocating one.
None of the above is prohibited according to TOS.
Interprete it , as you may like. But until you clearly prove me that
making that kind of generalization is dangerous as for the course of a debate and/or
as for a persons/nations/groups integrity , i havent made anything wrong.
If it is wrong, (that is :the Majority of his country is consisted of
homosexual people,) he could present facts that raise my claims.
Any given fact that would raise that, would be acceptable.

1+2.
I can not be persecuted for breaking smth that doesnt exist.
Make new rules and you have yourselves a case here.


EDIT
What about that?

I would also like to have the reports of the users offended.
It would not be right not knowing what excactly i am being accused of.
I am requesting the actual texts of the reports

[koultouras]

Ok
you obviously dont know what to do about me....
i will even make this convient for you....

«οὑδείς γάρ κολάζει τούς ἀδικούντας πρός τούτῳ τόν νοῦν ἔχων καί τούτου ἔνεκα, ὄτι ἡδίκησεν, ὄστις μή ὥσπερ θηρίον ἀλογίστως τιμωρεῖται· ὁ δέ μετά λόγου ἐπιχειρὢν κολάζειν οὑ τοῦ παρεληλυθότος ἔνεκα ἀδικήματος τιμωρεῖται - οὑ γάρ ἄν το γε πραχθέν ἀγένητον θείη - ἀλλά τοῦ μέλλοντος χάριν, ίνα μή αὖθις ἀδικήση μήτε αὐτός ούτος μήτε ἀλλος ὁ τούτον ιδών κολασθέντα. και τοιαύτην διάνοιαν ἔχων διανοεῖται παιδευτήν εἶναι ἀρετήν· αποτροπής γοῦν ένεκα κολάζει.» Πλάτων, Πρωταγόρας 324Β (6-15)[2]


I am upholding the laws you can not.
I am respecting laws that you are not aware of.
I am keeping for my self something you dont have in your language...."φιλοτιμο"
BYE!

[Søren]

Appeal 808 - Insulting Others (Unanimous)

With regard to the "gay" post, the Tribunal considers that while some people may be very insulted, or indeed outraged, by the idea that many of their fellow countrymen are of that persuasion, it can hardly be considered an insult per se. As regards the "bollocks" post, the Tribunal acknowledges that it was by no means a strong insult, but a 0-point note is by no means a strong infraction, so we uphold the note on the basis of the second post alone.

Appeal DENIED