Stolen goods

[Sevachenko]

So between late last night or earlier today we had valuable goods stolen from our base in the nether. The contents stolen were around a stack of 64 diamonds, 12 in another chest, and around 5 stacks of iron. These chests were in claimed stalker territory, were private, and NO one was on at the time. We are also not at war with any faction. From my knowledge and that of others there was no legal way this theft was conducted and I demand the restoration of our lost goods. Given the nature of the theft, and how we believe it was illegally conducted, if this is not rectified, we will be leaving this server.

Screenshots

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[Poach]

It's my understanding that you're able to open enemy chests whether or not they're online: blocks themselves are protected.

Therefore, if an enemy can get into your valuables storage, they can steal from it regardless of who is online.

Furthermore, we don't like being threatened. You will stop that if you expect us to bother with this. What did you expect to gain from that statement except make us think you're going to throw a hissy fit and threaten to leave every time something you don't like happens? Why the hell should we give a damn about people who throw tantrums if they don't get their own way? That's something toddlers do, man.

Finally, you've just broadcast your chunk coordinates and have an insecure base perimeter. Oh how clever.

[Sevachenko]

It wasn't a threat, if this indeed was an illegal action and we weren't helped then that would be our grounds for leaving. I would also like to know who warred us then declared peace. Oddly enough from personal experience, most recently being the monks we weren't able to open up their chests even when we declared war.

[jacb547]

I think the Stalker sowed what they planted

[Remlap]

It wasn't a threat, if this indeed was an illegal action and we weren't helped then that would be our grounds for leaving. I would also like to know who warred us then declared peace. Oddly enough from personal experience, most recently being the monks we weren't able to open up their chests even when we declared war.

At that time the config was having issues, it was brought to my attention and fixed a few days after you conducted that raid. As it is we are working on disabling block placement while offline, if you believe that someone broke blocks or placed them to get your stuff when you were offline then we can investigate. However if they haven't then what they did is perfectly legal.

[Poach]

That was an error in the Factions code and was fixed. Only block placement and breaking are disabled on claimed land when no faction members are online.

Therefore, unless blocks had to be broken to enter your storage, this is easily within the rules:

1. Someone finds your base. They get inside because it is not a secure perimeter.
2. They find your chests.
3. They /enemy you. Loot everything. They /neutral you.
4. They could not break or place any blocks in your land in that time, but if they didn't need to do that to get the chests, then they're fine.

So no rules were broken here unless you have evidence that they broke in while all your members were offline.

Finally, I will not be telling you who did it: we're not here to be your detectives. No rules were broken, so Moderation is no longer involved.

[Noodlegasm]

The raiding faction gets raided, then moans about it

[Magefsx]

That was an error in the Factions code and was fixed. Only block placement and breaking are disabled on claimed land when no faction members are online.

Therefore, unless blocks had to be broken to enter your storage, this is easily within the rules:

1. Someone finds your base. They get inside because it is not a secure perimeter.
2. They find your chests.
3. They /enemy you. Loot everything. They /neutral you.
4. They could not break or place any blocks in your land in that time, but if they didn't need to do that to get the chests, then they're fine.

So no rules were broken here unless you have evidence that they broke in while all your members were offline.

Finally, I will not be telling you who did it: we're not here to be your detectives. No rules were broken, so Moderation is no longer involved.

Well that's utter rubbish. So you can just go about /enemying everyone and anyone, walking up to their chests and nicking their stuff as long as none of them are online, and then walk away leaving them nonethewiser? You realise this has massive implications for the smaller factions who cannot have people online for the larger part of the active day, and they'll likely have to go through the inconvenience of covering all their chests in cobble or whatever, cause they havn't had the time to set up camp properly.

The change should have been ANNOUNCED prior; iirc you couldn't open chests unless one person was online from the very start, and I reckon the good amount of people have had their chests in open but claimed places would have had no idea were this not broadcasted by cryers... I think the only people who knew about this change then were the admin/mod team (le hint, cryers ) and their buddies.

Likewise nobody announced the change in damage taken by destroying enemy blocks to 2.5 hearts... :|

Does this also apply to levers/buttons now?

[Remlap]

Well that's utter rubbish. So you can just go about /enemying everyone and anyone, walking up to their chests and nicking their stuff as long as none of them are online, and then walk away leaving them nonethewiser? You realise this has massive implications for the smaller factions who cannot have people online for the larger part of the active day, and they'll likely have to go through the inconvenience of covering all their chests in cobble or whatever, cause they havn't had the time to set up camp properly.

The change should have been ANNOUNCED prior; iirc you couldn't open chests unless one person was online from the very start, and I reckon the good amount of people have had their chests in open but claimed places would have had no idea were this not broadcasted by cryers... I think the only people who knew about this change then were the admin/mod team (le hint, cryers ) and their buddies.

Likewise nobody announced the change in damage taken by destroying enemy blocks to 2.5 hearts... :|

Does this also apply to levers/buttons now?

Damage hasn't been fixed yet, since factions more or less itself last time I adjusted it. To address the first part, this has always been possible the only thing that wasn't available was block placement/destruction when they were offline. However the new factions buggered that, so if someone uses that exploit let one of the moderators know we will look into it and handle it accordingly.

[Magefsx]

Alright then; my bad
does the same apply to doors and buttons/levers?

[Katsumoto]

I have to agree with Mage here, a bit more communication from the mod team and admins would certainly be appreciated in regards to these mechanics. As far as I'm aware there's nothing in the wiki or anywhere else detailing what enemies can and can't do on your land when you are online/offline. The damage when placing/destroying blocks on enemy territory also isn't mentioned anywhere (correct me if I'm wrong), and I only found about it when Pat mentioned it. I too was under the impression that chests could only be accessed by enemies if you were online. I am also curious about how this affects doors.

[Poach]

Chests have always been accessible when your enemies are offline. This was not a change, this was not an addition: this has always been the case. Any faction who has been to war will know this. As such Mage's gripe about "announcements" is rendered moot. Security is as simple as putting cobblestone blocks over the door if your base perimeter is not secure.

As Rem said, the 2.5 hearts thing is not yet implemented because (and I don't know the ins and outs of this) when Rem changed the value from 0.5 to 2.5 many other things went wrong.

[Katsumoto]

Well I definitely recall Rem telling me otherwise at the launch of the server. And I don't think Mage's gripe is rendered moot as it still isn't written anywhere - you can't expect people to know what mechanics the server uses just by hear-say, this being especially true for new members but also evidently for players who have been here for a while. We shouldn't have to poke around in the dark here. It needs to be clearly defined.

[Poach]

Very well, I added a section to the PvP Server Guide. The fact remains that this has always been in effect and is therefore not an unannounced change. Any and all who have partaken in declared wars have always been able to do this.

[Diglytron]

Ay 64 diamonds is quite a lot 0.o...

[Katsumoto]

Thanks Poach :3

[Mangerman]

These chests were in claimed stalker territory, were private, and NO one was on at the time.

What do you mean by private?

[Poach]

They'd clearly tried to lock the chests using the same code we use to lock the rooms, without realising that factions outranks [private] tags and thus is an entirely useless defence mechanism. Of course looking at the screenshots they've done it wrong anyway, so even if it could work it wouldn't have been helpful to them.

[ChocoboKnight]

Security is as simple as putting cobblestone blocks over the door if your base perimeter is not secure.

So does that mean doors can be opened while your enemies are offline? You haven't been overly clear on this.

[Musthavename]

You guys need to calm it down a bit, it's just a game.

When 1.2 came out there was a choice between making the full upgrades to our old modded version of factions to make it 1.2 compatable or making our changes to a new version of factions. It was a lot less work to do that latter, hence that was the route taken. Most of these subtle changes are simply because factions made upgrades, some of which we don't necessarily want. When these undesired effects are brought to my attention I attempt to do something about them provided that's what GED and the mod team want.