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Thread: DoM Gameplay Mechanics and Features Overview (upd: 24/12/2013)

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Hey Aradan i've got an other dilema regarding the provinces: Will there be , on the campaign map regions and cities like Isengard, Osgiliath(on Osgiliath it could be possible to rebuuild it eventually and make th capital once more - this could be a new idea to implement in the mod).So what do you say about this.

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    Aradan's Avatar Flame Imperishable
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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Rebuilding Osgiliath is impossible, we can't have settlements on rivers - and unless the settlement is unupgradeable, we can't set it to have a specific appearence.
    Nan Curunir is already a province of its own.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Ok Aradan thx for the answer.I am glad that Nan Curunir is back as a province and Isengard as a city(in THS it was just a wonder).

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    In TNS it is actually part of the Lower Dunland. But, wasn't Nan Curunir mostly flooded, and the rest planted in orchards by the Ents? And, on all that, it was surrounded by the wall of threes. That would make it somewhat uninhabitable, unless people had drained the lake, or houses were built above the water similar to Venice (that I highly doubt). I think that Isengard was never a city, just a fortress. Of course, I’m not questioning what you are doing (you are certainly having greater knowledge of Middle-earth than I), but I am curious.

    I’m also curious about few other things:

    From the LOTR books I get impression that Dunland is quite desolate place. But in the game it starts with large cities, and has huge population growth. I mean they are breading like rabbits (or orcs?). I don’t know what happened in those 300 years, but surely they populated the place...

    Will Minhiriath/Tharbad be a playable faction, and will their units be based on the RK’s units, or Dunland’s units (barbaric or “civilised”), or both?

    I was always (I mean from the day I started to play this mod, of couse.) wandering Adûnabâr faction symbol. I think that star symbolize old Númenór (the lost glory of old...), but what is the meaning of the tree symbol behind. It is the symbol of the Shadow Cult, and symbolically shows who is actually ruling behind the throne, but how did you came to it? Is the Black Tree (, or how are you calling it?) some kind of polarity to the White Tree of Gondor; depiction of the White Tree destroyed; somehow converted to the Cult, Evil,... (only the symbol); or real sacred tree of the cultists? I would like to know more about it.

    I was playing custom battle with Elves, and their banners draw my intention. You know how they look like, but in the RoTK when elven host “give” Arwen to Aragorn, elven flag is described as silver(y). That was maybe overlooked by the team... I’m fresh reading TLOTR, however I have read translation to Croatian so I can't be sure that translator didn't commit a fault. (As an example it really annoys me when translator(s) make crucial mistakes like translating corn (wheat) as a corn (maize). I don’t have to mention that timeframe is Middle Ages.So in my translated book I get knights/lords from 1215. A.D. eating maze bread.) In fact, I’m not sure was it the flag of the Elven nation, or only the standard of Elrond’s house...

    Only one thing I lack to finish my work with expanding the wiki articles: the year of rebellion of Amandil. So I ask, did you, for the FATW lore, created it, or it is unknown?
    Last edited by Jagmodo; April 17, 2012 at 08:20 AM.





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    Aradan's Avatar Flame Imperishable
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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Predator1994 View Post
    Ok Aradan thx for the answer.I am glad that Nan Curunir is back as a province and Isengard as a city(in THS it was just a wonder).
    Never said Isengard is a city.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagmodo View Post
    In TNS it is actually part of the Lower Dunland. But, wasn't Nan Curunir mostly flooded, and the rest planted in orchards by the Ents? And, on all that, it was surrounded by the wall of threes. That would make it somewhat uninhabitable, unless people had drained the lake, or houses were built above the water similar to Venice (that I highly doubt). I think that Isengard was never a city, just a fortress. Of course, I’m not questioning what you are doing (you are certainly having greater knowledge of Middle-earth than I), but I am curious.
    See above.


    From the LOTR books I get impression that Dunland is quite desolate place. But in the game it starts with large cities, and has huge population growth. I mean they are breading like rabbits (or orcs?). I don’t know what happened in those 300 years, but surely they populated the place...
    Dunland is not desolate, it's actually well-populated. Enedwaith, on the other hand, was indeed desolate, but it was settled by Rohirrim (and probably Dunlendings too) since the beginning of the 4th age. 350 years is a long time for men to repopulate it, especially when there is peace. That said, it's not densely populated at game start.



    Will Minhiriath/Tharbad be a playable faction, and will their units be based on the RK’s units, or Dunland’s units (barbaric or “civilised”), or both?
    All mannish factions are playable.
    A mix of locals and Dunedain, with a touch of dunlendish and rohirric influence.


    I was always (I mean from the day I started to play this mod, of couse.) wandering Adûnabâr faction symbol. I think that star symbolize old Númenór (the lost glory of old...), but what is the meaning of the tree symbol behind. It is the symbol of the Shadow Cult, and symbolically shows who is actually ruling behind the throne, but how did you came to it? Is the Black Tree (, or how are you calling it?) some kind of polarity to the White Tree of Gondor; depiction of the White Tree destroyed; somehow converted to the Cult, Evil,... (only the symbol); or real sacred tree of the cultists? I would like to know more about it.
    The star is for Numenor, yes. The tree: "Deep indeed run the roots of Evil, and the black sap is strong in them. That tree will never be slain. Let men hew it as often as they may, it will thrust up shoots as soon as they turn aside." - Borlas
    Plus, it also doubles as a mockery of the White Tree.

    I was playing custom battle with Elves, and their banners draw my intention. You know how they look like, but in the RoTK when elven host “give” Arwen to Aragorn, elven flag is described as silver(y). That was maybe overlooked by the team... I’m fresh reading TLOTR, however I have read translation to Croatian so I can't be sure that translator didn't commit a fault. (As an example it really annoys me when translator(s) make crucial mistakes like translating corn (wheat) as a corn (maize). I don’t have to mention that timeframe is Middle Ages.So in my translated book I get knights/lords from 1215. A.D. eating maze bread.) In fact, I’m not sure was it the flag of the Elven nation, or only the standard of Elrond’s house...
    That would be Elrond's banner.

    Only one thing I lack to finish my work with expanding the wiki articles: the year of rebellion of Amandil. So I ask, did you, for the FATW lore, created it, or it is unknown?
    FO 228. You can find a mention of it in the description of the Plains of Gorgoroth CB.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    What sort of changes can we expect to see to the Elven unit roster? Will we get one company of Noldorin Swordsmen of Doom or have all the Noldorin left Middle Earth?
    "Oh no! Uzbeks have drunk my battery fluid!"

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Ok Aradan i apreciate the answers and i egerly await for the new release of the awsome FATW DOM.
    Glad to see such interst in the subforum and the team's hard work gone so far.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ajidica View Post
    What sort of changes can we expect to see to the Elven unit roster? Will we get one company of Noldorin Swordsmen of Doom or have all the Noldorin left Middle Earth?
    From the current units, maybe one or two will remain (probably heavily changed), all the rest will be new. Aaaaand... who knows.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Thank you for answer. Actually I overlooked something, and that is supposed Dunland’s population growth (+12%). It is caused by orc infestation (Orc – den, and Orc - pit). So my comment about them “breeding like rabbits” was simply untrue. Orcs are breeding like rabbits (sort of).

    Edit:
    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    All mannish factions are playable.
    Aha! So, Dorwinion is not an emerging faction, as they are humans? Hmm, now I’m confused...
    Last edited by Jagmodo; April 17, 2012 at 03:59 PM. Reason: Grammar





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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagmodo View Post
    [/FONT]
    Aha! So, Dorwinion is not an emerging faction, as they are humans? Hmm, now I’m confused...
    Aradan said that the emergent faction wont be playable... This either means that dorwinion are not human or that they are not the emergent faction... you know what now im confused too

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post

    Dunland is not desolate, it's actually well-populated. Enedwaith, on the other hand, was indeed desolate, but it was settled by Rohirrim (and probably Dunlendings too) since the beginning of the 4th age. 350 years is a long time for men to repopulate it, especially when there is peace. That said, it's not densely populated at game start.
    Dunland is indeed quite fertile, as is stated in RotK "Many Partings".


    The star is for Numenor, yes. The tree: "Deep indeed run the roots of Evil, and the black sap is strong in them. That tree will never be slain. Let men hew it as often as they may, it will thrust up shoots as soon as they turn aside." - Borlas
    Plus, it also doubles as a mockery of the White Tree.
    I always was wondering about this, too. The Black Tree seemed sorta weird to me, especially with something black dripping down from its boughs.
    It is too evil IMHO, at least in TNS. DoM takes place later, so it might be ok. I think it would make sense if only cultic units display the tree.

    That would be Elrond's banner.
    Maybe. I think there's no explanation for it. Could also be Galadriel's or Arwen's.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    From the current units, maybe one or two will remain (probably heavily changed), all the rest will be new. Aaaaand... who knows.
    Wow, really?! I'm sorta surprised. I expected lots of new units of course, but merely as an expansion of the old roster. The older elven units (Aran Magor, Echdîriath) are nice (apart from the curved blades!!!!!!!!!). The newer ones, the Galadhrim units, are ofc too movie-ish.

    I hope for some High Elves in a Historical Battle.
    Éorl, please show us some screens!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagmodo View Post


    Aha! So, Dorwinion is not an emerging faction, as they are humans? Hmm, now I’m confused...
    Of course Dorwinion is the emergent faction. I think we've discussed this topic for long enough now.
    Anyway I guess that ALL factions are playable, except probably the Hobbits (for how long is another question). We do know the Dwarves are playable. We do know the Elves are playable. We do know, there's no orc faction. If all mannish factions are playable, and two of three non-mannish, well, make the conclusions yourself. Dorwinion is not a 'real' faction and ofc will not be playable, since emergent factions are unplayable by definition.
    I would rather have a memory that is fair but unfinished than one that goes on to a grievous end.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Thangaror View Post
    Of course Dorwinion is the emergent faction. I think we've discussed this topic for long enough now.
    Anyway I guess that ALL factions are playable, except probably the Hobbits (for how long is another question). We do know the Dwarves are playable. We do know the Elves are playable. We do know, there's no orc faction. If all mannish factions are playable, and two of three non-mannish, well, make the conclusions yourself. Dorwinion is not a 'real' faction and ofc will not be playable, since emergent factions are unplayable by definition.
    I know. Aradan confused me with statement that ALL mannish factions are playable, so started to doubt that we were right. But he forgot about the emerging faction, or simply I should have known better and don’t hold for he’s every single word and THINK that emerging faction is NOT a REAL faction in a whole sense of that word. I agree, unplayable factions will be emerging (Dorwinion) and the Hobbits (and for them I’m not 100% sure). It would be extreme pleasure to play with them, but you are probably right as it would be unusual to see their faction objectives (conquer this and that). Still, they may have wish to have colonies somewhere, but I’m probably writing nonsense as most of them are unwilling to move a few km from their home...





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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagmodo View Post
    I know. Aradan confused me with statement that ALL mannish factions are playable, so started to doubt that we were right. But he forgot about the emerging faction, or simply I should have known better and don’t hold for he’s every single word and THINK that emerging faction is NOT a REAL faction in a whole sense of that word. I agree, unplayable factions will be emerging (Dorwinion) and the Hobbits (and for them I’m not 100% sure). It would be extreme pleasure to play with them, but you are probably right as it would be unusual to see their faction objectives (conquer this and that). Still, they may have wish to have colonies somewhere, but I’m probably writing nonsense as most of them are unwilling to move a few km from their home...
    yeah i cant see hobbits as warlike as other races. I do know they fought the last battle in the "war of the ring" but i still cant picture them marching into war. What kind of "army" they have? i know riding poney into war is not really effective.

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ulrich Liechtenstein View Post
    yeah i cant see hobbits as warlike as other races. I do know they fought the last battle in the "war of the ring" but i still cant picture them marching into war. What kind of "army" they have? i know riding poney into war is not really effective.
    On the contrary, horses of the Mongols could be called ponies by the European standards. And with their help they had the largest contiguous land empire in human history...
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    And for the Hobbits there is recorded in the Tolkien’s books that they had bowman. Still, I can’t imagine them as Mongols, but they could have some archers on ponies. As of other units, I think some infantry using spears and forming shieldwall + some sword and maybe axe units (typical).

    Edit: @ Aradan, Eorl and other developers
    I just wanted to inform you that I have expanded the wiki articles. You can see them
    here:


    http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Mouth_of_Sauron#Role_in_.22Rome:_Total_War.22_modifications

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rome:_Total_War#Modifications

    On Wikipedia, they don’t allow to mention any other mods here, besides those that are having their own Wiki pages. In their words: “Do not add ANY mods which aren't notable. If they don't have a Wiki page, they're most likely NOT notable.” So I add this sentence: “There are major modifications covering almost every era of human history from 9.century B.C. to early 19. Century and even put in the fantasy settings like Middle-earth and Warhammer universe.”
    People that find some of this settings interesting may look themselves for the mod...

    Hope you like it. If you don’t, well, then change it, or delete it, your choise.
    Last edited by Jagmodo; April 17, 2012 at 06:33 PM.





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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    From the current units, maybe one or two will remain (probably heavily changed), all the rest will be new. Aaaaand... who knows.
    Yay!
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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Wow, really?! I'm sorta surprised. I expected lots of new units of course, but merely as an expansion of the old roster. The older elven units (Aran Magor, Echdîriath) are nice (apart from the curved blades!!!!!!!!!). The newer ones, the Galadhrim units, are ofc too movie-ish.

    I hope for some High Elves in a Historical Battle.
    Éorl, please show us some screens!
    The elves will be done last of all units, so as to profit most of what I learn about unit-modeling as I go along.

    Since we want to avoid releasing late like 2020, I'm currently quietly working to get the unit models done. You can expect screenies of the re-done units (3d shields/weapons, many tweaks and improvements, some replacements and additions) in May!

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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    While late equals 2020, soon equals 2018


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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    You have mentioned that Harad, Rhun and Dunland beside Adunabar have option to go Cultic, and later have Cultic reforms. How would that look like? Will they get Adunabar’s cultic roster, or they will have their own version of cultic units? Maybe it will be something different entirely? In my opinion it would be a huge leap (and a bit unconvincing) for let’s say Dunland if they would go in one turn from their tribal ways of warfare to more organized and disciplined ways of Adunabar warfare . Especially heavy armoured knights for Dunland seem unfitting to me...

    Will Elven faction have Elf-friends (Elvelen? Elvelyn? – I can’t find right spelling) from the beginning (, recruitable in elven lands,) or they will be present only for the player when he conquer human territory with Elves? How will their recruitment function? Will they be recruitable in human settlement with the local lower ranking troops, or only Elf-friends will be able for them?

    Having some of them from the beginning would somewhat justify their expansion on human territory. Adunabar is most likely first and main target (for player) because possibly some refuges from ex-RK’s territory would gain shelter in Rivendell, and possibly persuade Elves to go to war with Adunabar to help the RK, or just reclaim their former lands and annex them to elven lands. Reason would be their dissatisfaction with their former governments – both RK’s (failed to prevent division of their territory, and protect them from the Cult) and Adunabar’s (for obvious reasons if they remained loyal to “Dunedainic ways”...).

    What kind of units will Dwarves be able to recruit in non-mannish settlements? I guess local lower ranking units. What I would like to know, will there be some sort of Dwarf-friends as is the case with the Elves?

    Looking at the new cultic units, some of their face masks look to me a bit like that of Hannibal Lecter. Is it on purpose, or is it the odd chance? Not that I’m complaining, just I can’t decide is it pure genius or you are trying to tell us something in a subtle way...
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 





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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jagmodo View Post
    You have mentioned that Harad, Rhun and Dunland beside Adunabar have option to go Cultic, and later have Cultic reforms. How would that look like? Will they get Adunabar’s cultic roster, or they will have their own version of cultic units? Maybe it will be something different entirely? In my opinion it would be a huge leap (and a bit unconvincing) for let’s say Dunland if they would go in one turn from their tribal ways of warfare to more organized and disciplined ways of Adunabar warfare . Especially heavy armoured knights for Dunland seem unfitting to me...
    The cultic roster is common, with visual differences mostly, but certain units are available to certain factions only with a specific building (eg Dunland doesn't normally get heavy cavalry). It would be great to be able to have different phases of cultic integration, but that would require model slots we don't have or mechanics that are not available. We have to make do with what is available...

    Will Elven faction have Elf-friends (Elvelen? Elvelyn? – I can’t find right spelling) from the beginning (, recruitable in elven lands,) or they will be present only for the player when he conquer human territory with Elves? How will their recruitment function? Will they be recruitable in human settlement with the local lower ranking troops, or only Elf-friends will be able for them?
    All elven provinces are Elven Lands (inhabited by Elves) at game-start; the player can choose to convert them to mannish if he wants, but it takes time. Only Elvellyn are available to Elves, not local levies or any other form of mannish troops (except mercs).

    Having some of them from the beginning would somewhat justify their expansion on human territory. Adunabar is most likely first and main target (for player) because possibly some refuges from ex-RK’s territory would gain shelter in Rivendell, and possibly persuade Elves to go to war with Adunabar to help the RK, or just reclaim their former lands and annex them to elven lands. Reason would be their dissatisfaction with their former governments – both RK’s (failed to prevent division of their territory, and protect them from the Cult) and Adunabar’s (for obvious reasons if they remained loyal to “Dunedainic ways”...).
    Nice concept. Not sure if we're gonna use it, but it will be considered.

    What kind of units will Dwarves be able to recruit in non-mannish settlements? I guess local lower ranking units. What I would like to know, will there be some sort of Dwarf-friends as is the case with the Elves?
    In non-mannish lands Dwarves recruit what any non local faction can recruit; Woodmen/Hillmen (depending on the province), and only after the local population has been expelled and replaced with mannish settlers. Instead of Elvellyn Dwarves get recruitable mercs.

    Looking at the new cultic units, some of their face masks look to me a bit like that of Hannibal Lecter. Is it on purpose, or is it the odd chance? Not that I’m complaining, just I can’t decide is it pure genius or you are trying to tell us something in a subtle way...
    That look is 'homage' to Herumor, aka the Mouth of Sauron. And, who knows, those Cultists do unspeakable things...

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    Blatta Optima Maxima's Avatar Definitely banned
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    Default Re: The Official WIP Features Thread

    Are they a low-tier unit in DoM? If they are, please remember that mail was very expensive. In fact, they have so much mail they could easily pass for the retainers of nobles if they went to Europe, or landed knights!

    They look elite, basically.
    Last edited by Blatta Optima Maxima; May 06, 2012 at 01:43 PM.

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