The Official WIP Features Thread

[Ryoga84]

No, I meant, if non-mannish faction decides to keep the non-mannish inhabitants, and manage to stabilize it (bring order, and maybe earn trust of the people) wouldn’t they defend their homes from invasion from the third side? Now, it seems that they would stand idle, and watch their overlords defend their territory (they are unrecruitable by other faction). Thus came my impracticable idea about home guard units (non-manish). I’m explaining what I originally meant. It is still impossible...

That would mean having Hobbits recruitable by, say, Dwarves or Elves. What if Dwarves have occupied and pacified the Shire, but there are still Hobbits in Westmarch or Buckland? Would the Shire Hobbits fight for Dwarves while they are still at war with their kin? Doubt it.

(sorry for the poor English)


After reading this

Fiefs

Each region may be organised into one or more fiefs (eg Gondor has the fiefs of Pelennor, Lebennin, Lamedon, Belfalas, etc), each fief including one or more provinces. There is a lordship title for each province and for each fief, with appropriate benefits. Lords that stay in their fiefs will receive extra benefits.

I got a suggestion.
Let's say, there is a Fief of the Shire (Hobbiton, Westmarch, Buckland, others?).

When Dwarves (or Elves) occupy a Shire province they can build a "protectorship" building.
The protectorship building essentially
-drain some money from the province taxes
-make impossible to build faction military buildings (and "mannishing" the province)
-raise a little the province's order ("we are giving you a self-government, so stay put!")
If the Dwarves take all the Shire they got the Fief of the Shire.
Then all the Shire "protectoriship" building can produce some low-level troops (alike the Cult reform).

I don't really know much of modding, thus maybe the concept isn't applicable.

I can add some more:
-The leader of the Shire got the Fiefdom of Shire as background, even if he don't own all the Shire, maybe locked on him per script (is possible?). This way you need to destroy the faction before earning the title.
Same for Elves and Dwarves (there is only 1 faction each?).
If Elves are 2 o 3 factions there is a possibility of "Elves killing Elves", so maybe the "Fiefdom of the Galadhrim", "Fiefdom of Mirkwood" and "Fiefdom of the Gray Havens" can be useful. If there is only 1 faction of Elves, than "Fiefdom of the Eldar Lands".
And Dwarves got the "Fiefdom of Erebor".
As a sidenote the Dwarves concept can be expanded. They always dreamed of revive their lost kingdoms... so, what if they can "clean" the Gray Mountains, Blue Mountains and Moria?
(I'm not saying they become right away proper "homeland", but with time and a gargantuan population investiment (not easy for Dwarves) )

-The "protectorship" building can be upgraded, improving the province order and the troop raised. For example, at an Elf level 1 protectorship you got Elf Hunters (no armor, knives and short bows), at level 2 no more Elf Hunters and Elf Militia (armor and sword) and Elf Archer Militia (armor and bows), at level 3 something even better (BUT definitely not good like a proper Elf troop).
The protectorship is, of course, more expensive than scrapping the local population, and is only a "civilized" way of dealing with other races (meaning the AI will be not prone to make protectorships).

-Maybe the production of local troop can be enabled (per script or whatever) only if all the provinces of the fiefdom are "protectorship"-ped


just my 2 cents

[Aradan]

If the 'protector' scheme was used, it can only work for non-mannish factions and only for one of them (game limitations), so the obvious choice is Elves or Dwarves becoming protectors of the Hobbits. However, that can lead to weird situations, like Elves and Dwarves fighting and Hobbits, being part of, say, Dwarves also fighting against Elves...

[Ryoga84]

If the 'protector' scheme was used, it can only work for non-mannish factions and only for one of them (game limitations), so the obvious choice is Elves or Dwarves becoming protectors of the Hobbits. However, that can lead to weird situations, like Elves and Dwarves fighting and Hobbits, being part of, say, Dwarves also fighting against Elves...

Uff, damn game limitations

[Jagmodo]

I didn’t pest you for some time (, well few days at least ) so... I am curious about one thing. Did non-human factions already in start have all territory that their race occupies? They can’t expand or colonise new territory with their people, right? It is perfectly sensible for Elves because of their extremely dwindling size and new strong reliance on humans. Likewise for Hobbits because of their more or less pacifistic and non-migratory lifestyle. However, Dwarves to me look like somewhat different. They still look to me capable to colonise some of the settlements, and they seem to have good motivation too. At the start of the mod Gundabad is a rebel settlement, right? Quite a good motivation for the Dwarves to capture it, I think. I guess that is populated by the Orcs at the start of the campaign, but it looks like a sacrilege for Dwarves if they would populate it with men. (I assume I don’t have to explain why...) Also, there could be other mountainous regions (you said that there would be some provincies/permanent forts on mountains) that dwarves could reclaim for themselves ( - meaning no human repopulating). I don’t have in mind unreasonable expansion on all regions, just some specific mountainous regions. I don’t have in mind extreme population boom too; you could limit their new cities population growth.

[Aradan]

Dwarves do not start with all the 'Dwarven Lands' under their control. Gundabad is not a settlement though.

[Blatta Optima Maxima]

Now that I look at it, Gundabad seems to be a very Middle Eastern (Iranic) name. Gund-ābād, abode of the army.


ETA: I wonder if it's intentional, or just a coincidence. We must remember that that's where the Orcs of the Misty Mountains gathered their armies.

[Thangaror]

Gundabad probably is a Khuzdul name.

[Blatta Optima Maxima]

Yes, I know, I just told you what it sounds like to me.

[Aradan]

'Gundu' means underground hall/cave/excavation in Khuzdul, so I don't think Gundabad is supposed to mean 'abode of the army', no. Probably an altered version of the original dwarven name.

[Jagmodo]

You are completely right (in fact I wanted to say the same thing, but you were faster). However, Tolkien didn’t invented he’s languages out of nothing, but pick influences from other languages (as you certainly know). So, Blatta Optima Maxima could be right in some way, but I would aim more north (Scandinavia?)...

Gundabad will be wonder, then, right?

[athanaric]

Now that I look at it, Gundabad seems to be a very Middle Eastern (Iranic) name. Gund-ābād, abode of the army.

Hah, someone else noticed that, too.

IMO it's a sub-conscious wording though, if at all. We have to remember that Tolkien grew up in an Empire which had place names like Allahabad. As an educated man, he undoubtedly has encountered these.

[Aradan]

You are completely right (in fact I wanted to say the same thing, but you were faster). However, Tolkien didn’t invented he’s languages out of nothing, but pick influences from other languages (as you certainly know). So, Blatta Optima Maxima could be right in some way, but I would aim more north (Scandinavia?)...

Gundabad will be wonder, then, right?

Khuzdul is based on the Semetic languages actually.


Nope, Gundabad is not a wonder, it's a permanent fort.

[Blatta Optima Maxima]

Khuzdul is based on the Semetic languages actually.

It is. Unfortunately, Gund Ābād has nothing to do with semitic languages.