Roma Surrectum 1-turn - should it be like this?

[ur-Lord Tedric]

very Impressive, I must say this is the most detailed Roman "AAR" ever written!

Thank you, I just hope it's enjoyable for anyone...

More importantly, I'm taking the extra time and notes because I promised dvk' & tone that I would 'play-test' a Roma 1-turn - I'm just taking my test seriously!

I'm particularly happy that I've done every battle (and therefore found 2 map glitches that dvk's been able to address) and watched the traits & retinue systems carefully and been able to query and tweak - all of which will appear in the 2.6 patch.

[CTD_or_Bust]

Update?

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Update?

Thank you - I was planning one on a 5 year update cycle (so 6 years from the last) to keep it regular, and that's only a turn away. Things have been delayed a bit as I've discovered a few potential issues and I've been spending time myself looking at sections of the scripting.

It can only make things better if the testing is exacting. It's late Summer 635 as I write, I'm just re-loading the game. With luck - tomorrow - at the end of W635! Effectively the first 100 years!

[Dramatic Cat]

Is there a TL;DR Version of this?

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Is there a TL;DR Version of this?

Well, no - that would rather obviate the point.

TBH - if anyone thinks it's too long to review, then they're probably not interested in the style of play anyway, so it's a bit Darwinian.

It's also because I'm testing and looking at everything that I'm taking the time to take notes that means I can write it up. But it's also because I think it's fair to say that I'm rather playing RSII to the 'max' as well. In doing so I'm asking the question of the title and hoping people will decide whether they like all of it and/or we find out those elements that can be offered as choices (cf the reduced Garrison Script that dvk'/the Team are hoping to offer in the revised patch).

[xXEsotericXx]

I thought I would start with my setup, for that may be useful for some – for I don’t (touch wood and spit) suffer CTDs any more – unless there’s a genuine problem.

I have an older PC, which has been tweaked and is now dedicated to RTW alone. One of the things I have found is that being unconnected to the internet and having, therefore, no Anti-Virus software to get in the way, makes things so much more stable. Having analysed the behaviour of many CTDs and everyone’s comments I came to the conclusion that RTW just acts too virus-like in the way it saves and modifies files for some modern AV systems – it was written in a gentler age! So:

- Intel P4 running at a genuine 3GHz (the faster processor the better, for the main CPU has to do all the work, RTW being written before programs could use modern graphics cards)
- 2Gb of RAM (it’s enough)
- 512Mb 8x AGP card (the memory is enough, but PCI-e would indeed be better for speed)
- Win XP SP3 (installed and updated once by the PC-man and then delivered virus-free with no further updates – remaining standalone)
- RTW Gold Edition (having a disk is too convenient) with both Original & BI

Not everyone can have the luxury of a ‘spare’ PC, but if you can and you do suffer CTDs, then cleaning it up, particularly if upgrading to a new one, and keeping it just for RTW and standalone, will help tremendously. In those 170 turns I have had 3 CTDs only: 2 because of the map that dvk’ has already addressed; and one, I am sure, because of the effect of an earthquake on the AI army that left the units unusable. Other than that – none! The patch, BTW, I am happy doesn’t introduce any new ones. I am confident that nearly every CTD that people experience is down to the original .exe’s or something else their PC is doing/preventing.

I

As we last spoke about it, now u know what i mean, but dont upgrade just for 1 game .... and i agree with the earlyer post , i wana see some pictures , events are nice 2 look at , good luck on your post!

[Ferdiad]

Is there a TL;DR Version of this?

It more for dvk and the team rather than us.

[ur-Lord Tedric]

It more for dvk and the team rather than us.

Well, no.....

Whilst it is indeed tracking a lot of detail that the Team can use to see if their vision is being met and indeed it does stem from the testing I'm doing; I'm actually writing it as a vehicle to induce comment and debate on all elements.

It's called 'Roma Surrectum' - so I'm trying out Rome and detailing the 'Surrecting' - to see if what happens is what people are after?

Little comment must mean that everyone's happy?

And, because I know Ferdiad likes them too, I shall see if any piccies are noteworthy......

[Ye Olde Fahrt]

Regarding pictures, it would be really nice to see how the 'world map' in the lower left corner of the strat map looks like say every ten years or so. It would nicely picture the surrectum part as well.

Do you think you could take those snapshots from your saved files? 100 years, 10 snapshots ...

I have thoroughly enjoyed your blog and it actually inspired me to try my first RS 1-turn campaign

[CTD_or_Bust]

I enjoy reading your reports very much. As I don't pay attention to the details in the way you do and speed through my games it is both informative and entertaining to read your reports. I'll be checking back tomorrow and I can't wait for you to get to the Civil War. Not just for entertainments sake either- both my encounters with the Second Rebellion script have resulted in a lot of bugs and I'm still trying to narrow down why they are occuring before I report any in detail.

Your reader

[ur-Lord Tedric]

......
Do you think you could take those snapshots from your saved files? 100 years, 10 snapshots ...

Well, especially as I've just reached the 100 year point, that's a perfect moment - so I shall indeed gather all 10!

The report is a little delayed as I've spent the last couple of days doing a few other things and also trying to help dvk' hunt down some bugs I too am finding - I hope not giving him too much work, although I think I've partially solved one of them - we'll see.

I shall hopefully be able to finish compiling it in the morning.... :-)

[Ye Olde Fahrt]

Sounds great !!!

Perhaps you could put a couple of lines together per picture as well: what was your plan at the time and how it then actually panned out

[ur-Lord Tedric]

My apologies for the tardiness in the latest update (and there will be a slower update schedule from now on as I really must do some ‘real work’!), but I’ve also been bug-hunting, all to make it better.

The time is now the Winter of 635AUC and 100 years have passed. In the next post there are a series of slides to show the progression of the Republic-Empire (technically not the last yet).

With the Romans now being able to take a more aggressive stance, it seemed to give the enemies on the frontier a reason to pause. Only on the Illyrian front do continued waves of Macedonian armies appear, but they are now easier to deal with. As noted previously, the ending of the war with the Gallaeci released all the old Republican and Allied troops to enable the conquest of Gaul and deal with the warlike Averni, along with the partially raised new legions, whilst then being able to transfer the more experienced first numbered legions raised towards Greece and Macedonia. Having noted the Greek States military might and the massed armies waiting in Southern Greece, this was a factor in the current plans.

In Africa, things were fairly simple. I took the opportunity of the Ptolemaics having lost Kyrenaike-Esperia to the Greeks to attempt and succeed in gaining a Ceasefire. This allowed the XI Claudia to leave early, whilst the III Augusta arrived and finished their preparations. As soon as this was complete they undertook to march along the desert coast with their siege engine and assault the lone Greek outpost. Euhesperides was taken under the leadership of a ‘Pontius Pilot’ no less! The new border with the Ptolemies was established and peace has come to Africa – for the moment...

The Gallic campaign had started well, with the seaborne assault from Caldunon on Aginnon, but, as noted, plague was found in the settlement. At this time the plague in Italy finally abated, but that in Aginnon flared up and infected the whole army, thus leaving them contained in the city. The commander then succumbed to the plague, once more seeming to cast poor fates on the Vexillum of the XIII Gemina. Hopefully the new commander, the third, will finally be luckier. With that front stalled, it was hoped to keep the Averni on the defensive by hitting them with the ‘old one-two’!

The I Germanica, raised to strength, but without their future auxiliaries and using older Allied troops struck out from the NW Alpine pass and assaulted the old Helvetii settlement of Eburodunon as it had a smaller garrison. That in Rhaetia was much stronger and so, leaving a strong garrison and moving in a new Governor, the I Germanica then moved East and invested the settlement, which remains under siege at this time. The X Gemina, having been brought to full strength with a complement of auxiliary troops, moved up from Transalpine Gaul to threaten the Averni forces in the centre and invited a dual-pronged assault at one of the river-crossings there. It was a vicious and prolonged fight amongst the trees (these are always hard to view and control, relying on legionary stamina), but the force attacking from the rear was small and possible for the auxiliaries to deal with, before returning to the fight at the ford and helping the legion deal with the remaining enemy.

In the mean time it was noticed that the Averni had moved their Capital from Gergovia to Lugdunon, which suited the desired plan ideally. The X Gemina, having been brought back to strength took the Gallic siege engine (one now produced for each front) and struck North into Avernia, taking Gergovia’s relatively small garrison. A Spy & Assassin were rapidly moved in, which proved a wise course as Averni agents have been keen to enter and create as much unrest as possible.

The plague in Aginnon finally ran its course, but I suppose it fell mainly on troops now wasting out. Brought back up to strength, the revitalised XIII Gemina lead Republican force moved out and invested Lemonum with its larger garrison, whilst a small one in the Biturigian province invited the X Gemina to strike out once more and take the settlement. The period thus ends on that front with Lemonum cut off from the last 3 Averni settlements. However, there was a final twist in the tail. At the beginning of the final turn (W635) of the period a new war began (the Diplomatic Announcements having been very quiet for many years) – the Cimbri attacked the Belgae. At the same time it was noticed that the resurgent Boii had also moved against the last remaining Free Peoples, the Volcae, in their quiet forested province, which it had been hoped to leave alone as a buffer to the Cimbri. It looked as if war along the Upper Danube and the Rhine area was inevitable. Perhaps, if the Averni were defeated and the Belgae’s alliance thus broken, it might be possible to acquire a new ally in this area. A Diplomat has started to monitor the situation and proffer gifts.

Before dealing with the Macedonian war, it is worth noting that this period saw the first incidence of some traitorous Generals. Firstly a pair rebelled in central Spain (they were travelling together, one younger on his way to take up an under-Governor position, and an older (zero Loyalty iirc and in the senior position) transporting Retinue. They also were joined by a 1u force nearby. These were easily dealt with by the Spanish Reaction Force(s), but the rebellion triggered General Sextus to appear outside Capua with his Socii Rebellion army. This situation repeated itself 18 months later when another pair of retirees became traitors West of Arretium. Retiring characters are now separated into different loyalty streams and their retirement villas allocated accordingly. The General Sextus incidents should now no longer occur either.

In Illyria-Dalmatia, the long-running defence conducted by the VII Claudia was ameliorated by the arrival of the, nearly as experienced, VIII Augusta, who then split the defence accordingly and allowed both legions to be fully supported once more after a series of battles against the Macedonian hordes. The situation was then drastically improved when the XI Claudia, brought back from Africa and brought to full strength with auxiliaries was transported direct across the Adriatic to take Dyrrachium back. With Macedon suddenly on the defensive (many troop movements were observed), they were even able to take advantage of a weaker Edessan garrison to add Ano Makedonia to the fold. The situation ends the period on that front with Macedonian armies still moving between Singidun in Gaia Skordison and Aquincum in Pannonia Inferior and threatening the Illyrian Border. The next move will be to hopefully strike towards the Danube, but with the knowledge that war with the Boii will be inevitable.

[ur-Lord Tedric]

100 Year Strategic Review:

What was the plan? I suspect I’m a bit True Roman myself in outlook as, certainly pre-Empire, there was more of the opportunistic and reactionary form of empire-building; so I’m a bit reactive to the extant threats, rather than truly seeking expansion. Therefore, at the beginning it’s all about dealing with Hannibal/Carthage and the Socii Rebellion. I know then that I will have to continue to deal with Carthage, by frustrating their attempts to take Sardinia and trying to invade Africa before the Gallaeci, if that occurs.

I also knew that the treacherous Greeks would probably attack out of Syracuse. Other than that, the war with Macedon would continue anyway. The defensive nature of the Alps and the restriction on entry paths, however, entice me to try and secure the Celtic Regions of Northern Italy, which will, sadly, ruin relations with the Boii! Knowing that the Greeks will likely cause me grief, means I can take Massalia, however, which is on the way towards Spain. Not only will I almost definitely end in war with the Gallaeci, but Spain is a strategic conquest that is only too sensible. Gaul will almost guarantee to follow as war with the Averni is pretty inevitable. So:

W545 – the Socii Rebellion is dealt with, Hannibal subdued and the Carthaginians ejected from Genoa. Dyrrachium s lost almost immediately to the Macedonians; both there and Emporiae effectively abandoned to bring troops home and deal with things as quickly as possible.

W555 – The Greeks come out of Syracuse and are dealt with; the Gallaeci go to war with Carthage (I don’t have FOW disabled normally – so all these pictures have been interesting for me too!) after making war, taking Emporiae and making peace again; and I move to take the Balearics; the Greeks dish up Sparta before I could ever help and I can now see the start of their Asian conquest.

W565 – Massalia is taken and the subjugation of N Italy occurs; the Carthaginians fight valiantly in Gadir it seems; whilst Dacia was having a good time – and I ally with them.

W575 – Macedon start to expand; I decide to take Illyria and the weak Greek colony in Dalmatia to restrict their involvement and limit things to Macedon only. I am building up to invade Carthage, not knowing how far the Gallaeci have advanced.

W581 – This one a little out of sequence as it’s the one just before the Cimbri invasion. That took 8 ‘interesting’ years to deal with the 7 stacks (now reduced to 4) and I just forgot to keep W585! The invasion of Africa is a success; I enjoy Carthage’s attempts to retake their capital, whilst resisting the Gallaeci forces. The Dacians start to get squeezed, but there is little I can do

W595 – Africa is consolidated, Lepcis-Magna revolts, thus killing off the last of the Cathaginians; the African forces begin to move West, whilst the Reforms are prepared for. Dacia is crushed by Macedonia and the Scythians.

W605 – The Reforms have occurred. The first numbered legions start to recruit to allow the older forces to think of moving West, with the taking of Narbonensis and the recovery of Emporiae and road-buolding efforts.

W615 – The Gallaeci are kicked from Africa and the link-up of the Republican and Allied forces achieved along the coast. The Ptolemaic’s appear by surprise, having taken Lepcis-Magna and attack the border forts. Meanwhile, and throughout, forces defend against minor Averni attacks and major Macedonian armies.

W625 – The war in Spain continues; the Ptolemaics are pushed back and out of Lepci-Magna, thus securing the African region. The Boii are resurgent after Sarmatia make war on Scythia.

W635 – The ending of the war in Spain releases major forces. The conquest of Gaul is well underway. Macedonia is a little on the defensive, although I am attempting to stay away from the mighty Greeks at present. The Cimbri have just declared war and the Boii are besieging the Volcae. The major Eastern wars seem to carry on with little change, a 3-cornered war between Greece, Ptolemaics and Selucids; whilst the latter also have to deal with Armenia and the Parthians. Rome and the Ptolemaics has ceased and I took advantage of the Greek re-acquisition of Kyrenaike to move a bit further East.

[Ye Olde Fahrt]

Brilliant!

[CTD_or_Bust]

I love it, between the first and sixth screens Rome expands, as you put it - in a "opportunistic and reactionary form of empire-building". Screens 7-10 show a tidal force devouring Iberia and washing over Gaul. Excelleeeent.

It was very nice to go back and re read your reports corresponding with the minimap and seeing the background story. I'm in such a rush to blow down everyones walls and steal their goats that I have never seen such an awesome expansion by the AI. What's more, it's so naturally driven instead what I'm used to (Factions expanding dramatically away from my allies and Rome). Really, top notch stuff, not the least of which being the great report on how it goes. Probably the most amusing to me is Boii having any success at all. Normally they're just a five or fewer settlement speedbump between myself and bigger triumphs. It's great to see them offer a promising fight when the time comes for a change!

However I am most curious about what drives the AI to change it's capital. I've noticed it happen in logical ways to Anatolian based factions, for example when their capital is besieged by an overwhelming force. But sometimes I can't see a clear reason why. Very interesting stuff.

(^_^)b Thank you again for sharing these publicly d(^_^)

[First Citizen Gallienus]

Interesting little Greek Empire there in Asia Minor.

[CTD_or_Bust]

I've seen em do that before. It's impressive how they just eat up everything

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Well, it seems that having been able to do a full review to this point has been somewhat fateful - as this particular campaign will have to come to an end; but it's also an opportunity.

The Open Beta, the other testers and this one have, of course, thrown up a number of issues, which is all to be expected. The necessary changes, however, that dvk' is working hard on, will produce a new update that will not be .sav game compatible. I shall therefore start again! This time with a full 100 years as a direct comparison.

This last test kept the growth of Akragas under strict control, but the reforms hit naturally (as I didn't otherwise artificially delay them) at 65 years. This time, as soon as I can also have the supporting infrastructure available, I intend to have the reforms as soon as I can make it happen (all pop growth encouragement and low taxes!); and then use the Late Republic legions for the first time and in considerable numbers; moving more slowly to the numbered ones, but overall faster as I too have now succumbed to their allure.

This time I shall keep an eye out for good pictures, but shall include the Map at every 5th year. So we'll see what's happened by 540AUC......

[ur-Lord Tedric]

New Campaign – early 2.6 Testing

After a wonderful amount of hard work by dvk’ and an impatient weekend from yours truly continually pressing refresh just in case..... The early testing of 2.6 (with many incorporations from the 2.5 Open Beta already) has begun:

I had spent a little while pondering what I would be doing at the beginning, but was not entirely ready for the whirlwind of action that began the campaign, although it has been rather satisfying.

The tail end of the first summer (S536) was spent preparing troop movements and building a couple of ships (Caralis and Dyrrachium) as well as using most of the ready funds on the Large Foundry in Roma itself. That Winter saw Nepos and the cream of the army in Italy left alone by the shores of Lake Trasimene, whilst Hannibal and his army besieged Arretium, with Maharbal and his troops moving East to subject Ariminum to the same fate. Nepos, with a few reinforcements, then moved to immediately relieve Ariminum and routed Maharbal’s army, a third of them surviving to retreat to Genoa. He then moved off South down the Adriatic coast, rather hoping that Hannibal wouldn’t follow. Meanwhile: most of the Sardinian troops were moved to Sicily; those from Dyrrachium were extracted to the mainland; and the forces from Emporiae were embarked, whilst the admiral played ‘dodge the Carthaginians’.

The summer of 537 was an eye-opener. Capua and Tarentum rebelled, with 3 rebel armies (Gen Sextus with 20u NW of Capua; Gen Spurius with 11u outside Capua; and Gen Titus with 13u (including nasty pikemen) outside Tarentum. A small Brigand (3u) force turned up SE of Cannae as well! Hannibal lifted the siege of Arretium and moved East to reinstate the siege of Ariminum. After attacking the ousted Governor of Capua, who retreated to Rome, Gen Spurius moved to the environs of Cannae. The Faction Leader was declared Dictator.

Having reorganised his slightly battered army, Nepos excelled himself and gained great credit. Moving first down the coast to destroy Spurius, he then went on the clear the Brigands, before crossing the bridge into Calabria. Joined by some of the local garrison forces and those troops brought back from Illyricum he then went on to smash Titus’ force and the Garrison of Tarentum in a drawn out open field battle! The ousted governor of Tarentum was able to retake his city without further loss. From such an inauspicious beginning, although many troops had been lost, the rebellion was down to one army and one settlement almost immediately. The troops from Sardinia and Sicily arrived on the mainland and those from Ceretania off-loaded at the port of Arretium. A silver lining to all the troop losses was the increase in funds available to allow infrastructure upgrades!

The winter saw Rome besieged by the remaining, largest, rebel army. The Averni made overtures of peace, whereas Macedon refused a ceasefire. Sparta and the Ptolemaics became allies and Carthage and the Galaleci signed a ceasefire (I think they were silly). P Cornelius Scipio the Younger took the Sardinian and Sicilian forces to invest Capua, whilst Nepos rendezvoused with the returning Spanish forces to create the last full army of troops Rome possessed; marching to the relief of Rome. During the battle, the archers and slingers were withdrawn after their ammunition ran out, which enabled the Faction Leader and his successor to take the field in Rome’s hour of need. During a very hard fought battle, when a routing spear unit reformed suddenly and engaged the pursuing Leader, he was unfortunately killed, but not before he had seen the tide of battle turn. Ultimately 1781 were accounted for, but with 664 losses – Rome could no longer field a full legion...

Luckily, but not for the inhabitants, Hannibal took Ariminum in the summer of 538. Less fortunate, perhaps, Annobel Osa sallied from Genoa to besiege Arretium. On the plus side, Scipio retook Capua from the rebels and thus ended the Socii Rebellion after just over a year; and then took all the remaining roman strength to immediately relieve Arretium once again, destroying Osa convincingly. The Roman Army could now start to be rebuilt, if only there could be a short pause.

That winter saw more action by the Spartan diplomats as they allied with Scythia. Meanwhile the Romans made peace with the Cimbri and established trade relations. The threat to Italy was not nearly as dire as before, but Hannibal remained in Ariminum with 8u; Gen Abdosir was outside Genoa with 11u; whilst Maharbal was inside with 5u. The army continued to recruit back to strength. The next summer (539) saw the Carthaginians make a mistake. Gen Abdosir moved into Genoa; and they made no other moves. Just over a legion-and-a-half were now available and they were immediately deployed: a legion to besiege Genoa; and the remainder to invest Ariminum!

The final 18 months to the winter of 540 was a pleasant change. Three quiet seasons of building and reconstituting whilst the sieges continued. Sparta continued their diplomatic moves; allying with both Pergamon and Pontus (perhaps this time they might last long enough for Rome to help!). Meanwhile Rome gained a surprise alliance with the Gallaeci, both sides wondering how long it could last. In the final moments, Macedon made her move and the weakened forces of Dyrrachium were besieged.

As can be seen from the maps, relatively gentle moves have been made elsewhere to consolidate positions as the factions jockey for position. Perhaps Sparta and her new allies will be able to resist the mighty Greeks for a while...?