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Thread: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

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    Default Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW



    Modding Resource Header

    Title: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW
    Posted by: Aradan
    Modding area: Campaign mechanics
    Required programs: Notepad (or other text editor)
    Summary: An explanation of the process of implementation on the M2TW engine of the 'marian reforms' mechanic.




    Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW



    Introduction

    The 'marian reforms' mechanic is a leftover from RTW. It is a specific event which is triggered once certain hardcoded conditions are met. The status of the event (activated/not activated) can affect building effects through a specific conditional, as well as the factions' bodyguard units through a unit attribute.



    Requirements

    In order to be triggered, marian reforms require:

    1. removing the 'marian_reforms_disabled' line from descr_strat
    Code:
    ...
    start_date    1080 summer
    end_date    1530 winter
    timescale    2.00
    
    marian_reforms_disabled
    rebelling_characters_active
    gladiator_uprising_disabled
    night_battles_enabled
    show_date_as_turns
    brigand_spawn_value 20
    pirate_spawn_value 28
    ...
    2. adding the "italy" hidden resource to any region(s) in descr_regions (if the HR is not already defined at the top of your export_descr_buildings, it should also be added there)
    Code:
    London_Province
        London
        england
        English_Rebels
        232 41 46
        atlantic, explorers_guild, woodsmens_guild, italy
        5
        4
        religions { catholic 85 orthodox 0 islam 0 pagan 13 heretic 2 }
    Code:
    hidden_resources sparta rome italy america atlantic explorers_guild swordsmiths_guild woodsmens_guild teutonic_knights_chapter_house knights_of_santiago_chapter_house crusade jihad arguin horde_target no_pirates no_brigands
    3. adding a new culture with the internal name "roman" (or renaming an existing one) and assigning at least one faction to it
    This is a slightly more involved procedure than editing a couple of lines (though it's not hard), and detailing it is beyond the scope of the present tutorial, so please check this thread out for a walkthrough of how to add a new culture in M2. Renaming one is a similar process.


    Activation


    The marian reforms will be activated when a faction that belongs to the 'roman' culture controls a region with the 'italy' hidden resource and upgrades its settlement to 'huge city'. There will be no message or other visual indication that the activation took place.



    Activation 'by default'

    It is possible to set the marian reforms as already activated at campaign start by adding the "marian_reforms_activated" line at the top of desc_strat.
    Code:
    ...
    start_date    1080 summer
    end_date    1530 winter
    timescale    2.00
    
    marian_reforms_activated
    marian_reforms_disabled
    rebelling_characters_active
    gladiator_uprising_disabled
    night_battles_enabled
    show_date_as_turns
    brigand_spawn_value 20
    pirate_spawn_value 28
    ...


    Effects


    When the reforms are activated, there are two ways they can affect the campaign.

    1. Upgraded bodyguard units
    In order to achieve this certain units must be given the "general_unit_upgrade" attribute in export_descr_unit. Those units must be listed below the regular BG unit of the factions they are available to, otherwise the engine will pick them as the default ones. It is not necessary to have upgraded BGs for every faction.

    Code:
    type             NE Late Bodyguard
    dictionary       NE_Late_Bodyguard      ; General's Bodyguard
    category         cavalry
    class            heavy
    voice_type       General
    banner faction   main_cavalry
    banner holy      crusade_cavalry
    soldier          NE_Late_Bodyguard, 16, 0, 1
    mount            armoured horse
    mount_effect     elephant -4, camel -4
    attributes       sea_faring, hide_forest, very_hardy, can_withdraw, general_unit, general_unit_upgrade
    formation        2, 4.4, 3, 6, 2, square
    stat_health      2, 0
    stat_pri         13, 8, no, 0, 0, melee, melee_blade, piercing, spear, 25, 1
    ;stat_pri_ex      0, 0, 0
    stat_pri_attr    no
    stat_sec         14, 4, no, 0, 0, melee, melee_blade, piercing, sword, 25, 1
    ;stat_sec_ex      0, 0, 0
    stat_sec_attr    no
    stat_pri_armour  9, 5, 3, metal
    ;stat_armour_ex   9, 10, 0, 0, 5, 3, 3, metal
    stat_sec_armour  0, 0, flesh
    stat_heat        6
    stat_ground      0, -2, -4, 0
    stat_mental      11, normal, trained
    stat_charge_dist 45
    stat_fire_delay  0
    stat_food        60, 300
    stat_cost        1, 870, 250, 120, 95, 870, 1, 210
    armour_ug_levels 5, 6
    armour_ug_models NE_Late_Bodyguard, NE_Late_Bodyguard_ug1
    ownership        england, scotland, france, hre, denmark, poland, hungary
    era 2            england, scotland, france, hre, denmark, poland, hungary
    ;unit_info        13, 0, 34
    When the reforms are triggered, the family members of every faction will switch to their upgraded bodyguard unit, if one is available.
    2. Building effects
    This can be achieved by using the "marian_reforms" conditional in export_descr_buildings.

    Code:
    recruit_pool "Longbowmen"  1   0.7   6  0  requires factions { england, } and marian_reforms
    recruit_pool "Highland Archers"  1   0.7   6  0  requires factions { scotland, } and not marian_reforms
    When the reforms are triggered, any building effects with the conditional will become active, while those with a negative conditional will become inactive.
    Last edited by Aradan; March 07, 2012 at 03:55 AM.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Well, what can I say:
    very nice Aradan, a joy to work underneath your shadow in the same team


    Son of Louis Lux, brother of MaxMazi, father of Squeaks and Makrell, house of Siblesz

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    EP!anastasi's Avatar Sōkō yumi
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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Ooh, that's cool and interesting!

    Is it a new "discovery"?
    And is this the only way to get upgraded bodyguard units? (I understand it's not only about this)

    Nice tutorial, thanks Aradan!



    Quote Originally Posted by Aikanár View Post
    a joy to work underneath your shadow in the same team
    Was it very sunny and hot that day?
    Last edited by EP!anastasi; February 27, 2012 at 03:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1988matej View Post
    <snip> i won't preorder to get the dacian's, wont pay for the elephant dlc nor will i settle for a dumbed down game <snip>
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    Hmm - in my political spectrum Nazism is always on the extreme stupid wing.
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    You do make sense.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    From what I've read on the M2 forums, everyone thought they did not work on the engine, so I guess it's a 'new discovery' in that sense.


    Yes, that's the only way to get an upgraded/different bodyguard mid-campaign (without killing a character and spawning a new one with the same name etc) that I know of. This is actually why I looked into this, I was asked to find a way to change bodyguards in-game.
    Last edited by Aradan; February 27, 2012 at 04:56 AM.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    That's great.
    What about other culture belonging factions.
    How can we create army reforms to them?
    We can not have common cuture (roman) to all factions.
    Maybe through an event?

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    The reforms apply to all factions once triggered, you can't have this type of reforms happen at different times for different factions.


    Events are the usual way of simulating reforms, since they can be triggered independently for each faction and based on whatever conditionals you want - and effects/recruitment can be tied to them in EDB. The drawback with events is that the generals don't get upgraded, but you can get around that by allowing armour upgrades for the BG based on events and simulating the 'new' units with a model upgrade of the old ones (assuming the unit type and description are applicable to both versions).

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Quote Originally Posted by EP!anastasi View Post
    Was it very sunny and hot that day?
    It was freezing cold and Aradan had little pitty for my frozen fingers hammering the keyboard to get the code in the file as fast as he demanded ....


    Son of Louis Lux, brother of MaxMazi, father of Squeaks and Makrell, house of Siblesz

    Not everything that counts can be counted, and not everything that can be counted counts.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Great discovery! A lot of potential this feature can give.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    To be honest the only thing the reform offer that scripted events can't provide and I'm not 100% sure about it, is the upgraded bodyguard ability. Everything else I believe can be achieved through scripted events.

    EDIT: I missed that Aradan said exactly the same thing

    Under the patronage of Roman_Man#3, Patron of Ishan
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    "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe." -----Albert Einstein

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Does it require entries in the data\text files and an event pic?

    Because in event_title I have this:
    Code:
    {marian_reform}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS TEXT SHOULD BE REPLACED BY TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE
    And in event_strings it's this:
    Code:
    {marian_reform_body_eastern_european}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    {marian_reform_body_greek}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    {marian_reform_body_mesoamerican}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    {marian_reform_body_middle_eastern}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    {marian_reform_body_northern_european}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    {marian_reform_body_southern_european}DO NOT TRANSLATE: THIS HISTORIC EVENT SHOULD BE REPLACED ON SCREEN WITH TEXT FROM ANOTHER FILE!
    And your link is to the 'Adding a culture' tutorial, not the 'Adding a faction' one.
    Last edited by Gigantus; February 28, 2012 at 10:36 PM.
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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    There is no message when the reforms are activated, so I believe no strings are necessary.

    Yes, I know where the link goes, a new culture is required with the "roman" name, not a new faction.
    Last edited by Aradan; February 29, 2012 at 06:37 AM.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    There is no message when the reforms are activated, so I believe no strings are necessary.
    Would it be possible for someone to make a new one and implement it?
    Quote Originally Posted by 1988matej View Post
    <snip> i won't preorder to get the dacian's, wont pay for the elephant dlc nor will i settle for a dumbed down game <snip>
    "My garden may be smaller than your Rome, but my pilum is harder than your sternum!"

    a great song ... and one more ... ok, one last






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    Fred Putz
    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Putz View Post
    Hmm - in my political spectrum Nazism is always on the extreme stupid wing.
    jimkatalanos

    Quote Originally Posted by jimkatalanos View Post
    Can someone delete this one temporarily?
    It's way too active and I am worried.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Taiji
    Quote Originally Posted by Taiji View Post
    Honestly there is no ceremony while I sacrifice stuff
    Garbarsardar
    Quote Originally Posted by Garbarsardar View Post
    <snip> the behaviour of moderators is a clear example of the corruption that absolute power brings to these hitherto innocent kids. Jom, Hesus, Ishan, Giga, were a merry bunch of fellows until the DeletePostDemon went into them and made them do the unthinkable. Praise the lord. And pass the bucket.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squid View Post
    It won't help, people will believe what they want to believe even when presented with incontrovertible proof to the contrary.
    Magicman2051
    Quote Originally Posted by Magicman2051 View Post
    Clarifying, I don't disagree with what I quoted, I don't agree with it either.
    Aradan
    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    You do make sense.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    You mean a new message? If the game does not trigger one on its own, the only way to do it is with a script.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    You mean a new message?
    Yep
    If the game does not trigger one on its own, the only way to do it is with a script.
    Yes, i understand this, i just imagined that maybe there was already the mechanism but just the message missing? So you wouldn't have to write a script, just put a proper message somehow... Or would you have already noticed if this was the case?
    Do i make sense?
    Quote Originally Posted by 1988matej View Post
    <snip> i won't preorder to get the dacian's, wont pay for the elephant dlc nor will i settle for a dumbed down game <snip>
    "My garden may be smaller than your Rome, but my pilum is harder than your sternum!"

    a great song ... and one more ... ok, one last






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    Fred Putz
    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Putz View Post
    Hmm - in my political spectrum Nazism is always on the extreme stupid wing.
    jimkatalanos

    Quote Originally Posted by jimkatalanos View Post
    Can someone delete this one temporarily?
    It's way too active and I am worried.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Taiji
    Quote Originally Posted by Taiji View Post
    Honestly there is no ceremony while I sacrifice stuff
    Garbarsardar
    Quote Originally Posted by Garbarsardar View Post
    <snip> the behaviour of moderators is a clear example of the corruption that absolute power brings to these hitherto innocent kids. Jom, Hesus, Ishan, Giga, were a merry bunch of fellows until the DeletePostDemon went into them and made them do the unthinkable. Praise the lord. And pass the bucket.
    ~Gort~
    Quote Originally Posted by ~Gort~ View Post
    Irony is one of the few saving graces of humanity.
    irelandeb
    Quote Originally Posted by irelandeb View Post
    What we understand is neglible compared to what we know we don't understand, never mind what we don't know we don't understand.
    Squid
    Quote Originally Posted by Squid View Post
    It won't help, people will believe what they want to believe even when presented with incontrovertible proof to the contrary.
    Magicman2051
    Quote Originally Posted by Magicman2051 View Post
    Clarifying, I don't disagree with what I quoted, I don't agree with it either.
    Aradan
    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    You do make sense.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    can we set the activation of the Marian reforms as anything we want? like kill this faction or capture the X-named settlement?

    and as i understood right the Marian reforms can unlock new recruitable units and buildings , if we set the Marian reforms as requirement of course.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Quote Originally Posted by EP!anastasi View Post
    Yep
    Yes, i understand this, i just imagined that maybe there was already the mechanism but just the message missing? So you wouldn't have to write a script, just put a proper message somehow... Or would you have already noticed if this was the case?
    Do i make sense?
    You do make sense.

    The text for such a message is already there in the files (Gigantus posted the entries above), and one would expect it to be displayed, but the game does not seem to trigger it. So the only work-around would be a scripted message.

    Quote Originally Posted by Toho View Post
    can we set the activation of the Marian reforms as anything we want? like kill this faction or capture the X-named settlement?

    and as i understood right the Marian reforms can unlock new recruitable units and buildings , if we set the Marian reforms as requirement of course.
    No, the reforms' conditionals are hardcoded.

    As said above, the marian reforms aren't particularly useful by M2's standards (being a remnant from RTW and very limiting), except for the upgraded bodyguards.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Fantastic discovery Aradan! Its good to know we can plan upgraded BG units once again.


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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    This will work a treat for the Roman faction in War of the Gods mod, thanks for this find.

    I noticed the entry in descr_strat but never understood how to get the marian reforms to work

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Quote Originally Posted by ToonTotalWar View Post
    I noticed the entry in descr_strat but never understood how to get the marian reforms to work
    You probably thought this doesn't work cause you knew this guy died more than 1000 years ago (from the timeframe of m2tw)
    This is a prime example of how CA lets us re-create history!
    Quote Originally Posted by 1988matej View Post
    <snip> i won't preorder to get the dacian's, wont pay for the elephant dlc nor will i settle for a dumbed down game <snip>
    "My garden may be smaller than your Rome, but my pilum is harder than your sternum!"

    a great song ... and one more ... ok, one last






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    (> < ) This is Bunny. Please help Bunny reach global domination by copying this message and pasting it to your own signature. Thank you!










    Fred Putz
    Quote Originally Posted by Fred Putz View Post
    Hmm - in my political spectrum Nazism is always on the extreme stupid wing.
    jimkatalanos

    Quote Originally Posted by jimkatalanos View Post
    Can someone delete this one temporarily?
    It's way too active and I am worried.
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Taiji
    Quote Originally Posted by Taiji View Post
    Honestly there is no ceremony while I sacrifice stuff
    Garbarsardar
    Quote Originally Posted by Garbarsardar View Post
    <snip> the behaviour of moderators is a clear example of the corruption that absolute power brings to these hitherto innocent kids. Jom, Hesus, Ishan, Giga, were a merry bunch of fellows until the DeletePostDemon went into them and made them do the unthinkable. Praise the lord. And pass the bucket.
    ~Gort~
    Quote Originally Posted by ~Gort~ View Post
    Irony is one of the few saving graces of humanity.
    irelandeb
    Quote Originally Posted by irelandeb View Post
    What we understand is neglible compared to what we know we don't understand, never mind what we don't know we don't understand.
    Squid
    Quote Originally Posted by Squid View Post
    It won't help, people will believe what they want to believe even when presented with incontrovertible proof to the contrary.
    Magicman2051
    Quote Originally Posted by Magicman2051 View Post
    Clarifying, I don't disagree with what I quoted, I don't agree with it either.
    Aradan
    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    You do make sense.

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    Default Re: Implementing Marian Reforms in M2TW

    Nice find Aradan.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    ... the only way to get an upgraded/different bodyguard mid-campaign (without killing a character and spawning a new one with the same name etc) that I know of. This is actually why I looked into this, I was asked to find a way to change bodyguards in-game.
    Rather than killing a character you can send him off map. When you bring him back via a spawn_army you can still use a different bodyguard but he will keep everything else: traits, ancs, battle_model, portrait, hero ability, etc.

    But the script to send off map and bring him back needs to know his name which means that it can only be used on characters that the script 'knows about'. Which is next to useless for everyday randomly-named generals as opposed to heroes, historical figures, etc.

    It would be no good for upgrading all BGs in one or more factions - like these reforms do - but it is another tool in the box. (This TATW submod uses it.)

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