Square formation issues

[Hockeywarrior]

As most of you probably know, the square formation as shown in Vanilla (and Darthmod) NTW is not only historically inaccurate but also not that useful. The biggest issue is that the square formations aren't that deep, only being 2 ranks thick when they should be at least 4 ranks thick. As it is now, square formations are so spread out that they are useless vs cavalry, and it is even more pronounced in Darthmod when the regiment sizes are huge.

Is there anyway that Darth can modify these formations to be more realistic? Are there any existing mods for NTW that fix the square formation?

Thanks

[BrodY]

Are you kidding me? Square formation have saved my ass sooo many times!

[Cay93]

I would agree with both of you on this. Square formations are a bit too spread out and need to be deeper, but they still are effective.

[BrodY]

Well, yes, I wouldn't complain if they were made deeper. Although they're still very effective. Especially vs cavalry (duh...) and actually, in some cases, defending against melee charges, I've discovered. ^^

[DochtorGajo]

Well, just saying, square vs cavalry look impressively good in this mod. Most of the casualties actually come from fire as it should be and not in close combat and gamewise they arent that overpowered. And there arent that many horsemen dying from heart attack as in NTW 3 for example, there you can loose third of your men just because you clicked enemy unit to charge it, while in darthmod it seems much better. (Maybe just my feeling, as they generally also ram into formation with some horsemen running whole the way to the other side. )

I ran few tests to compare the two mods and there are much more positive things in the way cavalry vs squares work in darthmod, than in NTW3, but maybe the best would be the combination of two. To sum up, if I use 5 units of infantry, basic foot plus one guard unit vs 10 units of combined dragoons, cuirassiers and guard lances, both with generals, in darthmod you loose, if you get into squares at the last moment and win marginally, if you are already in prearranged formation and I find it to be really good, given the numbers involved (1:1 ratio), and the fact, that I pitted best cavalry against ordinary infantry. In NTW 3, almost the same type of units, you get much more horsemen and for greater price, but results are really disappointing, given how they cherish their so called realism.

In any way you can beat off 10 units of very good cavalry, numbering twice your numbers with like 300 casualties, even if you form squares on the run with 5 infantry units of combined cost of maybe 3000 vs 12000 for cavalry and engagement itself looks as far from realistic as you can get: most (maybe 50 percent plus) guys die thrown off their horses and not in actual fight, they only fire like one or two volleys, the rest of casualties are in some form of killing someone with bayonet through telekinesis.

But all in all one thing, that darthmod might use from it is the way cavalry loses morale rapidly, when confronted with square, thats about the only good thing it could take from it and a little more formation resilience to horsemen breaking into square. (But not much or theyll end up comically, as in NTW3, where you can see infantrymen PUSHING BACK charging cavalrymen if they meet head on, I dont really understand, what causes, either manipulation with mass of different units, or the fact, that charge bonus of infantry is on average 4x that of cavalry? Dont know exactly, but it certainly look less realistic than horsemen plunging into infantry in line)

So not to sound completely off topic, maybe the way in which and reason why cavalry cant push into infantry in NTW3 could be looked at and some balance found, so that they cant smash 10 lines of infantrymen away like it is now, but wont end up as horribly as in the former mod being pushed back and unable to make even a little headway into enemy lines. When correctly balanced, it could be just enough to make two line square impregnable to cavalrymen running inside, but wouldnt make all the oddities to happen like loosing 30 men to nothing, being simply just thrown off their horses on clicking to charge, which is annoying and nonsence. It might also by itself, or by some other morale tweaking make cavalry run away after few moments of assulting suqare, so that they have to charge again and again, piling up their casualties, but not making it impossible for elite cavalry, especially if several units attack one to take on single unsupported square. (They had no miraculous anti cavalry properties, determined to stand and fight, they would work against bayonet charge just as well as against cavalry and they needed mutual support and support from cavalry and artillery to be perfectly effective and impregnable)