Resupply train / supplies
Greetings.
Fisrt of all, i would like to congratulate the Dots team for their unwavering commitment to historical accuracy.
The following is an idea regarding one of the most important issues to a successful army (nd campaign)and that is to say: logistics (precisely supplies). Sega didnt take in account the importancy of supplies for an army and thus severely undermined the accuracy of military campaings especially in hostile territory.
A) Supply as a general trait.
As you know, mods like BYG grim reality use supply as a general trait (A.1 See note) and most importantly BYG created more than one supply trait level (A.2 ), a general could easily lose its full supply trait while in a hostile territory especially if commanding a numerous army and a general could have his supply trait upgraded by fortyfing in friendly territories as well as embarking on ships (A.3), but to have his trait upgraded he would have to spend money since he would be buying supplies (A.4). The entire system of supply traits can be worked out to match Dots standards.
At this moment, i have an important question: is it possible to lose troops by traits, for instance the trait poor supplies would make some of your troops to defect or even die?
If the answer is negative, its still possible to work around it but it would be more direct and realistic if the answer is positive.
Notes for A:
(A.1): EB1 had a supply trait that affected moral, as we can see the supply feature was taken in account by the EB team albeit their efforts were hampered by engine limitation.
(A.2): Full supply, half Supply and so on, also the consumption rate of the supply trait is affected by the size of the army.
(A.3): Embarking on ships is a very important feature.
(A.4): Certainly every campaign had to be supplied and spent money in doing so, one of the reasons why war is so expensive.
B) Resupply train
BYG mod created an ancillary known as the resupply train (B.1). The resupply train main effect would be that of allowing a given general to reach full supply status. For instance, the supply traits would range from A to E, where "A" is no supplies and "E" is full supplies; a general that has the resupply ancillary would be able to reach the "E" status while a general that do not hold the resupply train can only reach "C" status. (B.2).
Therefore, before embarking on a campaign a given general (B.3) would have to get in a friendly city and buy supplies. Please refer to (B.4) as another interesting idea if possible. I will address acquiring supplies in another chapter.
B1) Assigning the resupply train.
There are certainly a number of ways to assign the resupply train. My thinking goes in the following line:
Take the Roman republic as an example, the resupply train could be assigned whenever a senator is elect as consul or praetor. Here, i have another question: is it possible to lose an ancillary? If possible, when the character is no longer proconsul or propraetor he would automatically loose the resupply train.
If the answer is negative, it will be a minor setback that will be dealt with in the acquiring supplies chapter.
Another option is assigning a resupply train for every general. I am well aware that this option would have some in game issues that will be dealt with in the acquiring supplies section as well as the in game issues section.
Notes for B:
(B.1): In BYG the resupply train make it easier to acquire supplies as well as maintaining them, in my idea the resupply train would have further effects. In BYG, there`s only one resupply train per faction which is not a good idea for Dots (my belief).
(B.2): Such idea linking the resupply train to a given trait is probably feasible if we take in account the professional staff feature of BYG.
(B.3): Taken that he has the permission to embark on a military campaing against a foreign kingdom. I, for one, believe that the Dots team will use a feature that allows only a certain number of generals to do it (a roman emperor for instance) since this has already been proved possible by other mods.
(B.4): Let's say that the supply trait grade goes from "1" to "8", "8" being full supplies and "1" no supplies. The average speed that you could purchase supplies would be "1 notch trait" per turn, so if your trait is 3 you would need 5 turn to get to "8" but if we can link the average speed on which we can purchase supplies to the level of agricultural development of a given region, in a developed region we would be able to purchase "2" per turn. This would certainly add another level of strategy to the game.
C) Acquiring supplies.
First of all, i need to make some considerations regarding the supply trait system.
C1) Adopting system where only some general shave the resupply train.
In this system every general (that doesnt have supplies at level 4) would automatically purchase supplies until it reach level "4" and the expenses would be paid by the treasury.
Generals with the resupply train would purchase their supplies from "4" onwards and the expenses will be paid by the treasury.
C1.1) Where to purchase supplies.
Its possible to purchase supplies when fortified in a friendly territory (C.1), in a city or in a supply ship. (All these features have been proven possible by BYG)
Purchasing in cities (please refer to B.4) should cost X gold.
Purchasing in homeland forts should cost 1,5X gold.
Purchasing in naval units should cost 2X gold. (C.2)
Resupplying (to some degree) by defeating an enemy army ( capturing the camp) or taking an enemy city by assault.
Foraging.
Notes for chapter C.1.1:
(note C.1): Concept of friendly territory.
The sea is considered neutral (afaik). Our own territories are obviously friendly. The question is: is it possible to resupply when fortified in allied territories?
If the answer is positive, allied states will be very useful. Imagine the following situation, you are the romans and you want to attack mesopotamia, you could establish an alliance with the crusader states take two generals and estabilish a fort in their territory. One of the generals will campaign in mesopotamia while the other will keep stocking supplies when the general campaigning sees his supplies low the other general can relieve him. Other possibility is to retreat for the crusader states territory and resupply there in case you take a single general.
( note C.2) The idea is to introduce another strategic factor.
As we know, its possible to resupply in naval units, this situation alone is very important strategically since naval superiority will allow the player to resupply his armies nd in case you dont have naval superiority will be very difficult o conduct far away sea invasions.
Nevertheless, since the costs of resupply at sea (2x) could propel the player to take Cyprus and use it as a base to resupply or maybe ally himself to the romans and resupply in a fort there.
C.2) Scutage tax and buy supplies.
In BYG the order to tax the nobles was tied to the king, if possible, we could tie the order of buying supplies (for the general holding resupply train) and we could stop buying the supplies with that given general by clicking once again. Buying supplies represent the preparations before embarking on a campaign.
C.3) Time to resupply.
One notch per turn in cities. (See note B.4)
One notch every two turns in forts and ships.
D) Consumption rate
Factors that affect the consumption rate:
Army size.
Time (D.1)
I believe that supplies should not be consumed while in home territory (D.2) and fortified in friendly territories (D.3) but should be consumed when on ships.
Notes for chapter D:
(D.1): Applied only in situation when the supplies are consumed. Time represents that supplies are not eternal (food goes bad).
Could be something like that:
Consumption rate for turn 1: X
Turn 2: X
Turn 3: 1,25X
Turn 4: 1,25X
Turn 5: 1,5X
Turn 6: 1,5X
Turn 7: 1,5X
Turn 8: 1,5X
Turn 9: 1,75X
Turn 10: 1,75X
Turn 11: 2X
Turn 12: 2X
One of the reasons for this feature is to make the idea of supplying in a city in Spain (and 1x cost) for invade Syria without having Cyprus (or maybe an alliance with the romans) less tempting since your supplies will be being consumed on the seas and your costs to supply on the ship soar. If you take Cyprus, you will have a far more solid and economical base to the invasion of Syria.
D.2) If and only if your home territory have a certain order, in a way that you wont conquer an enemy city and immediately be able to resupply or at least resupply in much slower pace.
E) Supply effects.
Depends on the answer for the question of chapter A.
Nevertheless, what is certain is that being low on supplies should bring terrible effects. I case the answer for the question raised in chapter is negative a way to work around it is:
Grade 1 to 8, "1" is no supplies and "8" full suplies.
Effects:
8: -0 moral
7: -0
6: -0
5: -0
4: -0
3: -2 (increase chance of rebelling)
2: -6 (increase chance of rebelling)
1: -10 (increase chance of rebelling)
The consequences of being low on supplies must be drastic because thats what happened in history.
F) In game issues:
First, the AI should not be affected by these features for obvious reasons.
Second, it regards the system to assign the supply trains as well as paying for the supplies nd being able to decide the amount of supplies purchased.
Thx
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Originally Posted by Resurrection
great idea, personnally i never liked the whole "general buys this much ressource and another one only this much" ! And giving the AI the same need to have this supply cart is just fantastic I mean ok the player is supposed to be smarter then the AI but when using BYG's submod every time an army not commanded by a general ends outside city walls they WILL desert and become rebels while it's possible for the ai to stack random small armies all over your territories dealing devastation without generals present.
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