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Thread: End-game Questions.

  1. #1
    NobleNick's Avatar Artifex
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    Default End-game Questions.

    I am playing as Scipii on H/H. I started a short campaign and got beat by the Egyptians. The game gave me the option to convert to a long campaign, which I did.

    Now I have 50 settlements. Before I captured my 49th city, I did a big logistics program and built up about 6 full stacks of high grade military between Capua and Rome. I also pre-positioned 4 other armies where they can immediately sieze 2 Julii and 2 Brutii settlemnts if (when) civil war breaks out. I was expecting the Senate to call for the suicide of my faction leader when I captured the 50th city; but when I did... silence.

    So, 2 questions:

    1.) What do I need to do to get the Senate to initiate civil war?

    2.) Like I said, I have a force of about 120 units near Rome, under the command of the Faction Leader, Faction Heir and 3 other generals (one stack has no general). The units are roughly equally divided between Legionary Cohorts, Archer Auxilia and Legionary Cavalry, with a sprinking of regular and heavy Onagers. Everything (even the archers) are gold sword / gold shield / and at least 2 bronze chevrons. Rome has 2-1/2 stacks (about 50 units) of mixed quality troops. The Senate and the masses seem to like my faction. If the Senate will not initiate civil war, is there anything else I should be thinking about before attacking Rome?

    Thanks for the help!

  2. #2

    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    well a way that you could start the civil war is to recruit an assasin and put it on a suicide mission. trying to kill another roman leader that normally works.

    Other than that you need the people to love you or the senate to hate you. for the people just carry on taking over more provinces and im not too sure about the senate maybe ignore any missions they give you.
    Never knock on Death's door: ring the bell and run away! Death really hates that!




  3. #3

    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by NobleNick
    1.) What do I need to do to get the Senate to initiate civil war?
    Dude, this question has been asked for over a hundred times in this section. Come on, do people never learn? You're a civitate!
    In patronicum sub Tacticalwithdrawal
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  4. #4

    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Get enough support from the people and the Senate will view you as a threat that should be 'taken care of'. Also, if you have the support of the people, you could just attack the other romans.

  5. #5

    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Easier way : kill (assasinate) a member of one of the other families or the senate and things'll get started.

  6. #6
    Severous's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Given the number of regions you control I would have thought you would have had the 'chance for power' message by now. Mine came around 30-35 in my Julii and Brutii campaigns.

    And as for the senate...maybe your military might near Rome has intimidated them? They dare not outlaw you .?

    Assassin idea would be my first bet...thats how Civil war kicked off in my Julii campaign. In Brutii campaign I allowed Gaul cities captured on senate missions to rebel back to gaul control. That seemed to trigger low senate ratings and then the suicide demand.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Baron
    Noble Nick....You're a civitate!
    A good one in my humble opinion
    Last edited by Severous; May 18, 2006 at 03:26 PM. Reason: typo correction
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  7. #7
    Gaius Baltar's Avatar Old gods die hard
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    You can also assasinate a diplomat, that will also trigger a civil war.

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  8. #8
    NobleNick's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Baron
    ...Come on, do people never learn? You're a civitate!
    Yes, I am. And I am also a noob at RTW. I guess I am a Civitate because someone recognized that I know the king's english and can string a structured thought into print. If my conduct is unbecoming of a Civitate, I'm sure my sponsor will let me know. If I fail to heed his counsel, we have an established process to deal with it, and another section of the forum in which that process should play out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red Baron
    Dude, this question has been asked for over a hundred times in this section.
    Actually, I only count 13 threads in this forum and child forums with the phrase "civil war" in the title, and 2 of those are clearly not related to the question I am asking. After reading some of those threads, I was more confused than when I was before I found them. I am sure there is more material outside this section of the forum, but it is tough to access it when searches turn up screens like this (pic edited to hide URLs of the guilty) ....



    * * * * *

    Back on topic: Thanks for the help, guys. (You, too, Red Baron. I've read at least one post by you on this subject, in another thread; which, unlike many others, I found to be helpful.)

    Acckk! I've been trying all game to INCREASE my standing with the Senate! So I should have been trying to tick them off?

    @ Severous - I've gotten messages maybe eight times that say something like (very loosely translated, mind you): "The common people adore you. Can true power be very far away?" Is that it? I knew that I needed to have the will of the people, and I assumed that message was evidence that I had what I needed. But when I look at my popularity rating, it is only up around 7 or 8.

    I also knew I needed the Senate to ask for my head, and I thought that this would happen when I got 50 provinces. Obviously, I was wrong on the latter assumption. Also, I noticed that my popularity in the Senate was something like 4 (which I thought was bad at the time, but now I realize was a good thing).

    O.K., so my options are:

    1.) Take those 6 stacks near Rome, go dish out some terrible pain to what I have left of Egypt, and hope the Senate gets jealous.

    2.) Train a bunch of assassins and send them at senators.

    3.) Do the assassin thing on Julii and/orBrutii diplomats.

    4.) Tick off the Senate by blowing off their missions or letting cities rebel, etc.

    Anything else?

    Assassination looks to be the fastest way, and I want to get this game finished. (Man, I can understand why some people only play through mid-game!) But I am also thinking it might be nice to play as Egyptians; and I still haven't forgiven them for stealing my short victory when I was to noob to realize I was in a race with someone.

    Hmmmm.....
    Last edited by NobleNick; May 18, 2006 at 04:23 PM.

  9. #9
    Lusted's Avatar Look to the stars
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    You just need to get yourself very popular with the people, and tick the senate off, once they get made enough at you they will ask for your head. Refuse and the civil war will begin.
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  10. #10
    John I Tzimisces's Avatar Get born again.
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Or, if you are popular enough and have recieved the message saying A Chance for Power (or somesuch), just attack them.

  11. #11
    Gaius Baltar's Avatar Old gods die hard
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Oddly enough, you want your assassins to get caught. Doesnt help if they succeed and get away...

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    Pillaging and Plundering since 2006

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  12. #12
    orange slice's Avatar Ducenarius
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by NobleNick
    1.) What do I need to do to get the Senate to initiate civil war?
    Well if you have enough popularity you could attack them if you want. Or you could send a spy or assasin in and hope he gets caught or attack something that will give you the lowest % rating. And if you don't want to do any of this you could wait for them to ask you to kill your faction leader.




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  13. #13
    NobleNick's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    I decided to go for Egypt: Shipped 4 of the 6 armies in the area of Capua out to the dunes. They had no sooner got there when a city rebelled and, you guessed it, The Senate asked for suicide. Acckk! I accepted (faction leader died) and immediately started 2 of the 4 extra stacks back towards Capua. Meanwhile the rest took back the rebel city and captured 2 more Egyptian cities.

    I continued racing the two stacks back to join the other 2 stacks near Capua, and continued building yet another stack using the combined production power of my five production cities near Messana. But it was not enough. Another city rebelled, and the Senate asked for suicide, again. At this rate I would have to kill 3 generals before I could be set; so I bit the bullet and refused. That same turn I took the Julii city on that island east of Rome (giving me 53 cities), rearranged the stacks near Capua to give my general a full stack of 17 full units of fully upgraded (gold/gold/ 2-chevron) Legionary calvary plus mercenary missile cav, Samnite Mercenaries and the general himself, and laid siege to Rome with both stacks.

    The S.Q.P.R. attacked my twin stacks with their 2-1/2 stacks of mostly Hastati/Principe/Cohort (heavy on the Hastati). I was given command of the horses, while the AI took control of the other stack that included about 12 full units of fully upgraded (gold/gold/2-chevron) Legionary Cohort, 6 fully upgraded (gold/gold/2-chevron) Archer Auxilia (yes, this is possible in vanilla 1.5. Ask me how.), a general, and I forget the last unit. It was a fun battle; but, having had MUCH practice thrashing full Gaul stacks of heavy infantry with half stacks of heavy cav, the outcome was not in doubt, even in the pre-battle setup. I was surprised that it was as easy as it was: Only took about 17% losses, even with the "help" of the rat-brained AI running my Cohorts.

    I got the victory screen; but I am still wondering: Were the "popularity with the masses" messages I got, the ones that would have allow me to pre-emptively attack Rome? I imagine that they were; because how else would I have gotten victory, even if my attack was not pre-emptive? If someone knows the answer for sure, please speak up.

    So, having completed 3 short campaigns (N/N Julii, N/H Brutii, and losing the H/H Scipii), taken part in one completed VH/H Carthage succession campaign, and finally having won my first long campaign (H/H Scipii, converted from the lost short Scipii campaign); I hereby officially renounce my "noob" status. Thank you to all who gave advice to help me figure out what to do.

    Now I have started on a long H/H Gaul campaign. (I am trying out the Huge army settings. This could be a short experiment, depending on the "ummpphh!" left in my machine.)

  14. #14
    Severous's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Non Noob status seconded.

    Chance for Power message:

    Came from my Julii (m/m) campaign.

    In my Bruitii campaign (H/H) it occured Winter 257BC when I had 30 regions and popularity was nine with the senate (it dropped to 8 next turn and never went up agin). Popularity with the people is the most important I think. That was 7 and went up to 8 over the turn end when the message occured.

    If you have not seen the message NN maybe it was missed among all the others that pop up at end of turn ?
    Regards
    Severous

    Did my part in a Franks BI Succession campaign:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=118689
    Played a Mod called "End of Days" Picture based AAR is here:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=116509
    From last year. Final turn of vh/vh Egyptian campaign
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=54262

  15. #15
    NobleNick's Avatar Artifex
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    Default Re: End-game Questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Severous
    .Chance for Power message:

    Came from my Julii (m/m) campaign.

    If you have not seen the message NN maybe it was missed among all the others that pop up at end of turn ?
    Thanks, so much, so posting this, Severous. Now I know what this fabled screen looks like!

    My memory isn't the best thing on me; but I do meticulously go through all the end of turn messages; and I don't remember this one ever popping up. Maybe it could have in the early game and I just didn't recognize what it was. But, IIRC, my faction leader's name was used as a swear word by the common people in the early game.

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