Suggestions

**dfool06** · January 03, 2012, 07:59 PM

I humbly suggest the following again;

ROHAN

ROHAN
1. New unit PEASANTS/EORLINGAS
-cheap very very early infantry armed only with pitchforks or any other crude farming tool. With very very little to no armor.

- now some might argue that we already have the Eorling militia for that role. Here is my reason why I strongly believe that Rohan should have this unit. There is a difference between the 2, militias are conscripts while peasants represents the simple common folk who voluntarily decided to take up arms, band together to defend their homes.

- by adding this unit to the Rohan unit rooster they will represent the kind of culture the Eorlingas live. Rohan is a wide land that at times maintaining peace and order is a bit challenging. Authorities or help may be hours or even days away. The land and circumstances turn the men of Rohan hardy and are always ready to defend their homes by them selves. This will also represent the kind of spirit the Eorlingas have, that they are willing to fight down to the last man, if needed be.

In addition to what I have posted earlier may I add this idea (If its ever possible that is) to futher reinforce my argument as to why Rohan needs to have peasant units. I humbly propose that this unit should consist of different unit models (I think M2TW kingdoms support this) like very young men and very old men to implement the famous line "most have seen too many winters or too few" into the Rohan unit rooster. Young men could look like they have no beards and have black or blonde hair still and beardless while the old men can have grey to white beards and hair. If its ever possible as well they can have different heights. But I don't know if the game engine can support this

.

GONDOR
1. NEW UNIT: DOL-AMROTH ESQUIRES
Barracks tier 1 AOR unit. Armed with maces and shield (inspired by the Edessan esquires in the Crusades Campaign). Have armor piercing abilities and can have very low unit pools or very long recruitment time. There are Knights in Dol-Amroth so it is only logical and natural to have the Esquires. They are the knights in training, the young bloods and future of the Order of the SWAN KNIGHTS. In times of war when there are not enough men, lords can call every able bodied man to arms and that will include esquires

yes?

2. New Exclusive mercs (Gondor and Rohan only): Gondorian knights
Only recruit able in the lands like Belfalas, Anfalas, Edhellond, Lebbenin and so on. They represent the other knights found in the different Fiefdoms of the south western lands of Gondor. Heavy cavalry unit armed with spear and shield. What only Dol Amroth have knights? In My Humble Opinion (IMHO) even if its not mentioned in the books there are other knights that exists from other places aside from Dol-Amroth.

About the Guards of Osgiliath unit;
IMHO their current unit model seems a bit out of place. They have this like eastern and elven mix look going on. I think this unit should have a model change. During the Third age Osgiliath is nothing more than a ruined abandoned city that is in constant conflict. The only inhabitants there would be the garrison of soldiers and being in the every front lines against Mordor IMHO the Guards of Osgiliath should have a more Robust look than have to look/ have uniforms that can rival the very well equipped Fountain Guards of Minas Tirith. The fountain guards are based on a Citadel, a well advanced city while the Guards of Osgiliath should have well worn out armor.

**Jaldithas** · January 04, 2012, 12:17 AM

I like this idea

but I would love rather some new units to factions such as Harad,Eriador or dwarves

**stochastic** · January 04, 2012, 12:28 AM

Thank you for reading my suggestions!

1) For both elf factions:

I would make them even more powerful with even smaller unit sizes myself, ie archers down from 60 to 40, increased accuracy on elven arrows, +1-2 attack +10 range on every unit. For warriors from 60 to 48, +2 defence skill increased lethality (if M2TW has a lethality stat like rome does) same goes for silvans. I like the feeling that elves are rare and few in numbers. (talking unit sizes on normal)

2) Make Ents a recruitable unit. The way it works now is neat i guess once you look up how to recruit ents in a FAQ but for players who prefer not to use FAQs but still want to play with the fun and cool units this would be nice.

3) Revamp the script that creates units when besieging settlements.

This has been one of the strangest things about TATW and one of the hardest to get used to. I still don't understand it...

What I have noticed so far:

-It always triggers the first time a settlement with the script is besieged
-It sometimes triggers mid siege
-It sometimes triggers during when you select assault such that there are more units present than were on the campaign map when you clicked assault.

Other than triggering on the first besieging it's unpredictable to me and often foils any attempt to take the settlement such that any normal tactics are out the window.

A typical experience is this: I besiege Isinguard and more troops than I can defeat are mysteriously summoned into being. I withdraw and the computer sends half of this inexplicable army after me weakening my forces. Having defeated this magic army I send my reduced force back to lay siege, nothing is summoned to my joy but unfortunately with my reduced forces I am going to have to wait this siege out now. 5 turns into the siege 6 new units are summoned magically (many of which are better than can even be recruited) and I get frustrated and leave having lost several units, strengthened my opponent rather than weakening him, and spending about 20k in unit upkeeps in the process.

This feature is good for AI vs AI because it prevents them from taking each other over too quickly but frankly it doesn't really make the game harder it just changes the order in which you have to take AI settlements, leaving certain ones until you have decent 20-stack armies which is easy to get after taking over all the nearby non-scripted towns. Franky the problem with AI difficulty is intrinsic to total war, the only way to make the game difficult in ANY mod has generally been to basically cheat for the computer and when you don't follow ANY of the rules of the game it's not as fun.

My suggestions:

a) If it is possible, start the computers with special garrison units which have 0 upkeep and 0 movement which will stay and protect the key cities making them harder to take but not giving the AI massive free roaming armies. Alternatively maybe they can just be scripted not to move

b) make the settlement siege scripts only trigger once per 30 turns

c) I don't know how it works exactly but increase the degree to which key settlements affect auto-resolve battles such that it's hard for computer players to take them, and place fast firing arrow towers etc. in them so that they are hard to take on the battlefield too.

Sorry if it's coming off a bit unappreciative I really appreciate the mod!

P.S. I play OoG my favorite non-elven faction >.<

**Descendent of Kings** · January 04, 2012, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by dfool06

I humbly suggest the following again;

ROHAN
In addition to what I have posted earlier may I add this idea (If its ever possible that is) to futher reinforce my argument as to why Rohan needs to have peasant units. I humbly propose that this unit should consist of different unit models (I think M2TW kingdoms support this) like very young men and very old men to implement the famous line "most have seen too many winters or too few" into the Rohan unit rooster. Young men could look like they have no beards and have black or blonde hair still and beardless while the old men can have grey to white beards and hair. If its ever possible as well they can have different heights. But I don't know if the game engine can support this

.

GONDOR
1. NEW UNIT: DOL-AMROTH ESQUIRES
Barracks tier 1 AOR unit. Armed with maces and shield (inspired by the Edessan esquires in the Crusades Campaign). Have armor piercing abilities and can have very low unit pools or very long recruitment time. There are Knights in Dol-Amroth so it is only logical and natural to have the Esquires. They are the knights in training, the young bloods and future of the Order of the SWAN KNIGHTS. In times of war when there are not enough men, lords can call every able bodied man to arms and that will include esquires

yes?

2. New Exclusive mercs (Gondor and Rohan only): Gondorian knights
Only recruit able in the lands like Belfalas, Anfalas, Edhellond, Lebbenin and so on. They represent the other knights found in the different Fiefdoms of the south western lands of Gondor. Heavy cavalry unit armed with spear and shield. What only Dol Amroth have knights? In My Humble Opinion (IMHO) even if its not mentioned in the books there are other knights that exists from other places aside from Dol-Amroth.

About the Guards of Osgiliath unit;
IMHO their current unit model seems a bit out of place. They have this like eastern and elven mix look going on. I think this unit should have a model change. During the Third age Osgiliath is nothing more than a ruined abandoned city that is in constant conflict. The only inhabitants there would be the garrison of soldiers and being in the every front lines against Mordor IMHO the Guards of Osgiliath should have a more Robust look than have to look/ have uniforms that can rival the very well equipped Fountain Guards of Minas Tirith. The fountain guards are based on a Citadel, a well advanced city while the Guards of Osgiliath should have well worn out armor.

First off, a lot of good stuff! Keep it coming!

About Rohan...neat idea but gameplay-wise totally useless. You'd have to make them weaker than Eorlinga Militia and then they couldn't stand against anyone so you'd never use them anyways other than for fun.

About Dol Amroth Squires...totally agree. Makes a lot of sense.

About Gondorian Knights...to me the current Gondor cavalry fits that bill (not talking about cavalry militia).

About Guards of Osgiliath...agree to a point. In one thread I saw a suggestion for a Veterans of Osgiliath unit which I really liked. I think someone even made them for a submod, I remember seeing an image and looked great. They'd represent the men who guarded ruined Osgiliath and thus have worn out armour and such. The actual unit GoO though are unlocked when you've REBUILT Osgiliath. No longer a ruined city and once again the glory of Gondor, so yes I agree they should be retextured but actually made to look more well kingly I suppose. Perhaps just a darker blue is all they need, just the current bright royal blue isn't really doin it for me lol.

**Adjudant-Major** · January 04, 2012, 03:14 AM

Why not use the new beautiful custom settlement of Dol Guldur as a temporary (?) representation for Carn Dûm as well ?

All that is needed is to change it's faction_creator from portugal for norway (and a simple reskin of the rock_mountain to make it less green).

Other ideas presented here.

**yber7** · January 04, 2012, 04:21 AM

Another suggestion: Would be possible to make trolls affected by stakes? Because it looks a little weird a troll charging against a unit of archers and passing through the stakes without one loss.

**lolIsuck** · January 04, 2012, 04:28 AM

I don't think so, they are infantry and stakes are only effective against cavalry. (and no, they won't be made cavalry)

**yber7** · January 04, 2012, 04:52 AM

I was guessing if there is a way to change te killing rate for a unit, si we could make them cavalry and make that one or two die when charging agains stakes. I don't want to kill them all with stakes, that would make the game too easy.

**lolIsuck** · January 04, 2012, 04:57 AM

I don't think you can alter the kill rate, normally they all die so I think it's hardcoded. Also, if you make trolls cavalry their performance and behaviour will change, they would charge flanks instead of straigth into the center what trolls would do, making trolls cav has been discussed many many times

**yber7** · January 04, 2012, 05:08 AM

A OK, just asking. I'm new to the forums, so I didn't know that.

**Bungo Baggins** · January 04, 2012, 05:44 AM

Originally Posted by stochastic

Thank you for reading my suggestions!

1) For both elf factions:

I would make them even more powerful with even smaller unit sizes myself, ie archers down from 60 to 40, increased accuracy on elven arrows, +1-2 attack +10 range on every unit. For warriors from 60 to 48, +2 defence skill increased lethality (if M2TW has a lethality stat like rome does) same goes for silvans. I like the feeling that elves are rare and few in numbers. (talking unit sizes on normal)

Unfortunately the lethality value does not seem to work for M2TW.

Apart from that you should check out my submod.

3) Revamp the script that creates units when besieging settlements.

It's called garrison script and by now there are probably more tutorials about its removal around than threads that discuss the killing of trolls and mumakilks.

The easiest way would probably be to install Baron Samedi's Submod.
Then you can choose if you want to play with garrison script or not at the start of your campaign.

**pestkop** · January 04, 2012, 06:36 AM

Let´s throw in my 2 cents: I was thinking about the problem of some factions not having enough unit cards lately (like ootmm). So I thought what if they would implement more weapons instead all sorts of far fetched ideas like black numenoreans for oog or ootmm. For instance mace units and warhammer or hammer units are rare. The only ones I can think about are hobbitry in arms (some have elongated warhammers) and that ap heavy rhun axe and mace unit. What if..... hobbits are given clubs and pitchforks (which would be more lore accurate imo --> bandrobras took hit of a goblin captains head with a club!) then you have a whole scala of new weapons to give to other units, either orc or human, so not everything looks the same. What also would be a nice idea for ootmm would be heavily armoured goblins with spiked clubs/maces like you see in (yes I know very old school) lord of the rings the two towers for ps2. They would have an armour piercing trait which would help ootmm a lot + they just look cool.:p Last suggestion I can think of is removing the snaga's for isengard and give them dunland archers and isengard sappers: who look like the guys in the movie that thrust the ram and carry the bomb at the battle of the Hornburg. Give them good armour and only a short isengard hacking sword and give them high defence stats and low attack stats and maybe (and this would be really cool) give them abillity to sap (don't know if this is possible) to MIMIC the use of bombs. Then you have a versatile and reliable new heavy infantry unit for a low tier isengard army which would really enhance the feeling of playing isengard (a heavily armoured orc faction). A bonus is removing the snaga's so ootmm would become more unique. Well, those were my ideas, i hope anyone likes them!:p Cheers

**lolIsuck** · January 04, 2012, 08:14 AM

Originally Posted by yber7

A OK, just asking. I'm new to the forums, so I didn't know that.

no problem, at least you didn't make a new thread about it and wrote it in all caps with a title with 4 spelling errors in it

**whitewolfmxc** · January 04, 2012, 08:29 AM

Also perhaps there should be a script where not every unit that lost the siege (defender) is magically gone , if the game ended before everyone was killed , there should be a script (or actually when during turns its being sieged it should have a script to try to escape / breakthrough that works) to allow the general and remaining units to escape the settlement (but with some losses too obviously) , it adds a lot more dynamic to the game (also not forcing human players having to fear good generals just to hold a town . because it needs a governor too while its easy target for AI)

**lolIsuck** · January 04, 2012, 08:33 AM

That would be very cool, it's something that has always annoyed me but I don't think it is possible

**Mhaedros** · January 04, 2012, 08:33 AM

I think it's hardcoded, but it'd really be nice

Ninjaed

**Adjudant-Major** · January 04, 2012, 08:38 AM

There are issues I noticed when playing a battle in "Carn Dûm" - concerning the terrain, the custom settlement brings, of course, the hill it stands on, which appears to create strange cliffs around because Carn Dûm is placed in the mountains. These "bugs", much smaller, can be noticed also around Dol Guldur - especially the road that leads to a wall, climbs, and continues. Plus there are two "natural looking" stone walls at the edge of the custom hill. I think these minor issues can be removed by terrain adjustments, especially the height map will certainly have to do something with it. Anyway, besides this minor issue, Dol Guldur seems working well as Carn Dûm, certainly better than the vanilla teutonic citadel.

**Emperor of Hell** · January 04, 2012, 10:08 AM

The capital movement cost should be removed when you loose your capital, it's a bit unfair. I'm not sure that's possible actually.

Also I think you should be able to change your capital once for free in turn 1. That is possible at least.

General suggestions for the next version(s). More armor upgrades, generic settlements, custom settlement. Perhaps splitting the Silvans.