Bushido, how old is it actually?

[stumpndum]

So i was trolling the internetz like a boss and started looking at samurai stuff from wikipedia, misconseptions about samurai's google search and yadda yadda yadda.

So anyway a lot of the stuff i see paints the samurai a lot like european knights, a bunch of thugs hired by the ruling elite to piss all over the peasents. So yea i started looking more into the bushido and i came a bunch across a whole bunch of conflicting reports about the supposed "way of the samurai" and the dates are bloody everywhere!

So can someone explain to me exactly when they started doing this bushido thing and if samurais were a bunch of hired dicks that occasionally did stuff out of loyalty, much like knights?

[american samurai]

So i was trolling the internetz like a boss and started looking at samurai stuff from wikipedia, misconseptions about samurai's google search and yadda yadda yadda.

So anyway a lot of the stuff i see paints the samurai a lot like european knights, a bunch of thugs hired by the ruling elite to piss all over the peasents. So yea i started looking more into the bushido and i came a bunch across a whole bunch of conflicting reports about the supposed "way of the samurai" and the dates are bloody everywhere!

So can someone explain to me exactly when they started doing this bushido thing and if samurais were a bunch of hired dicks that occasionally did stuff out of loyalty, much like knights?

A simple explanation would be that the samurai class came from rich land owners who took over defending Japan when the government at the time proved unable to handle the job. Did knights really do "stuff" out loyalty?

If you really want to get a grasp on the subject I would suggest reading some books on the subject.

Here is a list of books, some quite old some recently written, most have a preview that allows you to read some part of the book. Most of these can be purchased used for quite a bit less than when first sold.


The manufacture of armour and helmets in sixteenth century Japan: (Chūkokatchū seisakuben), Kōzan Sakakibara
C. E. Tuttle, 1964
http://books.google.com/books?id=s2o...ed=0CCMQ6AEwAA


Samurai 1550-1600, Anthony J. Bryant, Angus McBride, Osprey Publishing, May 26, 1994
http://books.google.com/books?id=TPw...gusoku&f=false


Handbook to life in medieval and early modern Japan, William E. Deal, Oxford University Press, Oct 3, 2007
http://books.google.com/books?id=i0n...gusoku&f=false


Samurai: The Weapons and Spirit of the Japanese Warrior, Clive Sinclaire, Globe Pequot, Nov 1, 2004
http://books.google.com/books?id=IQ3...gusoku&f=false


Japans ancient armour, Hatiro Yamagami, Japan. Kokusai Kankōkyoku, Board of Tourist Industry, Japanese Government Railways, 1940
http://books.google.com/books?ei=__0...#search_anchor


Early Samurai: 200-1500 AD, Anthony J. Bryant, Angus McBride, Osprey Publishing, May 23, 1991
http://books.google.com/books?id=FxT...armour&f=false


Samurai: a military history, Stephen R. Turnbull, Psychology Press, Apr 11, 1996
http://books.google.com/books?id=RMB...0armour&f=true


Secrets of the samurai: a survey of the martial arts of feudal Japan, Oscar Ratti, Adele Westbrook, Tuttle Publishing, 1991
http://books.google.com/books?id=ZFf...ane%20&f=false


Arms and armor of the samurai: the history of weaponry in ancient Japan, Ian Bottomley, Anthony Hopson, Crescent Books, Jul 20, 1993
http://books.google.com/books?id=csU...ed=0CDoQ6AEwAQ

The Watanabe Art Musuem Samurai Armour CollectionVolume I ~ Kabuto & Mengu Trevor Absolon 2011
http://books.google.com/books?id=8AP...samurai&f=true


Samurai, warfare and the state in early medieval Japan (Google eBook), Karl F. Friday, Psychology Press, 2004
http://books.google.com/books?id=eyM...amurai&f=false

[Ying, Duke of Qin]

The wiki article actually does a fair job of assessing this concept.

The reason why I've also resorted to link-bombing is because like any code of conduct, it is difficult to assess just how most people would have reacted. Like chivalry (Your interpretation of knights as "hired dicks" is pretty grossly generalized in my opinion), I'd say it runs a spectrum, ranging from the stupidly honorable to the honorably stupid to the I-just-want-to-stab-things. Were there samurai who were just "hired thugs?" and "dicks?" Yes.

Were most samurai hired dicks? Hard to say. Do you count all members of the "bushi" class as samurai? Are you counting in ronins? What about the dogou, who were basically armed peasants? What about bandits who had the right to carry swords or nobushi?

You could probably make a fair argument about any of the situation I've presented. Hence, I don't think there's an answer to your question.

[TomteOfDoom]

In the 17th century Yamaga Sôko wrote a couple of books about ethics based largely on confucian values, and the content of these books made a lot of sense to the autorities of that time, so it was soon adapted as an essential part of education and doctrine, and as such applied to the samurai caste. This was what would become known as bushido. The ideals presented in Sôko's work ofcourse had some similarities to values already familiar to samurai or Japan at large, but it was his heavy-handed emphasis on unflinching loyalty to ones superiors that bestowed it with such authority. Now, bushido still was not an enforced book of laws, but it touched on many subjects that were already judiciary, and the idea was that it would foster a morality that would strenghten the adherence to the established power. That it did to some extent, one might argue.

Bushido did not exist prior to the 17th century. What did exist was laws, local or nation-wide, there existed house-codes imposed by leaders towards their clans, expected to be followed in varying degree and enforced in varying capacity. There also existed religion and culture, needless to say. Confucianism, buddhism, taoism, shintoism, folk lore, etc. The principles and values brought out by these sources all influenced the idea of noble behaviour, and to a lesser degree the rate by which samurai or others adhered to it.

In short, if you want to know what is the way of the warrior, it depends entirely on what warrior you ask. Did they adhere to their values? As much as they could bear I'd say. It's pretty universal that a man wants to stand by his words, we are proud and want to seem noble, but during war (which is indeed the specific purpose of warriors), survival and gain generally trumps notions of chivalry. Hence, a "noble" warrior is likely not a good one. And I think a shrewd military man would simply hold to a code that allow him to conduct his business without the pain of shame and remorse.

One of my favourite samurai quotes is this: "The warrior may be called a beast or a dog; the main thing is winning." It was written by Asakura Norikage, 1477-1555. This man lived through the onin war and the most turbulent stages of the sengoku jidai. He was one of the most valued generals of his clan, so I'd wager he knew of what he spoke.

A typical sengoku samurai, a typical sense of "bushido".

[Yoshitsune1189]

Most of the mythology surrounding samurai (and ninjas too I think) was Edo period creation reflected back on the historical warfare period I suspect

[lawandorder82]

You live by the sword and die by the sword

[Robin de Bodemloze]

Most of the mythology surrounding samurai (and ninjas too I think) was Edo period creation reflected back on the historical warfare period I suspect

The Hagakure certainly was fantasy writing loosely based no half-truths. The modern depiction of samurai though are a combination of Edo period glorification of the samurai (because contemporary samurai were dying of hunger and poverty as they were not allowed to go into a different line of work), and post-WWII revisionism by the Japanese government because it needed to distract the people and give them something to be proud of.

[lawandorder82]

The kamikze pilots were old samurai

[Robin de Bodemloze]

The kamikze pilots were old samurai

In a figurative sense they embraced the samurai axiom of death before dishonour (of defeat, capture, amongst other things), but I don't think there was a evidence suggesting kamikaze pilots had to be of samurai lineage, or that all (or even most) kamikaze pilots were of samurai lineage in practice.

[lawandorder82]

i have books that say some followed bushido and samruai ideals

[Robin de Bodemloze]

i have books that say some followed bushido and samruai ideals

They all did - hell they killed themselves for their army. That doesn't mean they're samurai. The samurai class effectively disappeared after the Meiji Restoration. Now whether the Kamikaze were samurai in terms of lineage is pretty hard to prove conclusively without some massive census/genealogy exercise.

[lawandorder82]

nice robinz alot of them died for the riseing sun they even chanted banzi to psyche each other up

[stumpndum]

Thanks for all the replys i think i get it now but as for kamikaze pilots they werent samurai's they're a bunch of s doing anything to prolong a war that they couldn't win so they could get more favourable losing conditions which earned them two nukes up there ass i have nothing but contempt for them

[Dirtnapninja]

From what I understand what we call Bushido is the invention of Japanese Christian Ex-patriot living in the united states who wanted to give the Samurai a code of honour similar to his notions of European Chivalry. So he wrote a highly romanticized history of the Samurai wherein he invented a code of honour he termed 'Bushido'. The actual word itself was so obscure the author thought he invented it. The samurai themselves, in the ages when they actually fought were as duplicitous and exploitative as they come, squeezing what they could from the peasantry and taking what they could from weaker neighbours.