NBA 2011-12 Season Thread

[Scipio Afracanis]

Warriors moving Stephen Jackson to Spurs for Jefferson and a 1st rounder.

Camby going to Houston for expiring contracts and a 2nd rounder.(Flynn, Habeet)

[Beorn]

Good moves for Houston, Spurs.

Also, Fischer to Rockets for J.Hill

[Scipio Afracanis]

Big Trade, Nene to Wizards
JaVale Mcgee/ Rony Turiaf goes to Denver
Nick Young to the Clippers( who give up Brian Cook and a 2nd rounder)

Wow.

Lakers got there PG, Clippers go another shooter who will be an upgrade to Foye starting.

A good day for LA.

[Hambone]

wut

I guess that's a good trade for Denver, I guess, maybe, sort of. again, wut.

[King Nud]

Sources say Denver close to signing Wilson Chandler. I guess they are pretty confident otherwise letting Nene go was dumb.

[jukeness]

I wish the Wolves would've got Jamal Crawford.

[mrmouth]

Just a ridiculously good team performance, the type of win that really makes a team gel.

There really are not anymore statement games anymore after leading the league in victories last year, and doing the same this year, thus far. If you were nothing more than an Bulls/NBA fan, you'd enter some cryogenic state and wake for the playoffs.

If anything, this game makes you worry. The Bulls eked out a win against two players. Had Bosh shown up, they lose. Having Rose doesn't change that.

Going back to what I said previously; for whatever reason the players that cannot find their shots most games, tend to do so when Rose isn't playing. It has nothing to do with Rose not spreading the ball. When he isn't playing, there isnt such a regimented play running scheme that they can get bogged down in. The team does gel better.

The lack of secondary scoring in the half court when Rose is playing, is a significant problem against the Heat. It is a makeup problem, and a offensive scheme problem. You don't know what makes the difference when Boozer, who is supposed to be such a large piece of the puzzle, still cannot create his own shot against teams who play defense, let alone the Heat. And we cannot count on the signing to help address that, in Rip, to even be alive for the playoffs.

The Bulls have to hit 10-19 3's to be in a game with the Heat. Sustained overachievement in a 7 game series...

The Heat landed in Chicago at 2:30am, and then actually went out on the town. They heard Rose wasn't playing, and as Lebron said, they didn't take the game as seriously as they should have. They were never engaged, never interested. That happens in the NBA. And while you would like to question their character, it wasn't a factor last year, and it wont be this year.

I just don't know what makes the difference for the Bulls over last year. I'm not seeing it. The Bulls would be a unique NBA champion. You rebound, you hustle, and your best player is your PG, without a whole lot anywhere else. Talent still beats that in the NBA.

Not with this current lineup. I hope to hell I'm wrong.

[RZZZA]

Only thing that worries me this year is Dengs injury. He needs to play like he did last year in the playoffs for us. And he's been playing horrible since his injury. He's basically a 3pt shooter on offense now.

[Scipio Afracanis]

Maybe Rip comes back and is a beast during the playoffs, Maybe Boozer steps up this year and maintains his reg. season performance, Kyle K. stays hot for a 4 game stretch, you never know. Rose could play out of his mind and 1 of the big 3 has an off series...... All it would take is someone stepping up and being Robin to Rose aka Batman.

[mrmouth]

It would take a lot of what we have not seen. Boozer is what he is. He cannot create his own shot against a long team like the Heat, and he doesn't bang inside, which will lead to more traps on Rose, and more turnovers. Rip is supposed to help with that, but even as a playoff signing, he is a complete unknown. Korver is streaky as can be, and it looks like he will also be sitting at times late in games because Jimmy Butler is a significantly better, fundamental defender. So that means upwards of 3 starters will be benched late in games, and when defense counts.

The Bulls are the same team they were last year (bench has actually taken steps backwards), while the Heat have corrected many of their deficiencies, and adding enough to their bench to win, undoubtedly. About the only thing that remains a question is their heart. And it was a questions last year when they stepped up and beat the Bulls. There still isn't enough to overcome the talent difference.

[RZZZA]

No, the bulls are not the same team they were last year. Please explain our 12th ranked offense last year compared to our 2nd/3rd ranked offense this year.

It IS possible to improve without having made any roster moves, you know? Chemistry, morale and teamwork are under rated.

[classical_hero]

Are Phoenix daring to make a run for the playoffs?

[Beorn]

Portland is out of the equation, but Houston and Denver got probebly better. BTW Nuggets have 5 C's (McGee, Koufos, Andersen, Mozgov, Turiaf)...
I think we are en route for the 10th-11th place in the West.

[mrmouth]

No, the bulls are not the same team they were last year. Please explain our 12th ranked offense last year compared to our 2nd/3rd ranked offense this year.

It IS possible to improve without having made any roster moves, you know? Chemistry, morale and teamwork are under rated.

Elite teams in decline? I mean, there are 29 other teams that are going to have an effect. And this year, everything has a large * next to it. If either the Bulls or Heat, or an outsider team, win this year, that asterisk will loom large over a championship.

You are right, the Bulls bench actually isn't as good as last year, so they are not the same team. But overall, the same dynamic that will get them beat in a 7 game series, still exists, with the one exception of the Heat being even better this year.

[RZZZA]

Why even watch if you're so sure of the outcome then? Put some money on it if you're so certain the Heat will win.

[spartan117]

I will make the effort to visit and respond to this thread more, because I certainly do not want to appear as a "drive-by" poster.

If anything, this game makes you worry. The Bulls eked out a win against two players. Had Bosh shown up, they lose. Having Rose doesn't change that.

The Bulls have to hit 10-19 3's to be in a game with the Heat. Sustained overachievement in a 7 game series...

The Heat landed in Chicago at 2:30am, and then actually went out on the town. They heard Rose wasn't playing, and as Lebron said, they didn't take the game as seriously as they should have. They were never engaged, never interested. That happens in the NBA. And while you would like to question their character, it wasn't a factor last year, and it wont be this year.

It is disturbing to witness the trend of what passes as analysis. For all the talk of Miami, much of the interpretation of their playstyle is ridiculously lame and void of any meaningful/insightful observations or analysis. Much of the commentary is summed up by the notion that Lebron James, Wade, and Bosh are super awesome superstars.

As I said before, the Miami Heat are not exactly rampaging around the league trouncing teams left and right. But as expected whenever a Miami game goes against the narrative of a super dominant team (minus the laser like focus on the supposed Lebron James follies in the 4th quarter) it is routinely dismissed as not relevant or revealing. Everything about the game is rationalized away ranging from simply the fault of Miami not taking the game seriously to outright luck of the opposing team.

Is there any possible reason why the Bulls were successful at the three point line? Could it be that Miami's very aggressive defense which frequently deploys traps and often gambles on steal attempts is actually leaving opponents open at the 3pt line? Compounded with their lack of size(as James noted) or eagerness for the fastbreak, their PF/C (especially if they are already getting outrebounded) will require them to focus more on boxing out players and less able to contest three point shots. The breaking out for fastbreak opportunities results in less players staying put to secure the defensive rebound. Granted one reason why Miami can pull this aggressive style of defense better than most teams is because of the athleticism that allows them to recover better than most teams within the same circumstance. There really is a reason why opponents shoot a high % at the 3pt line against Miami.

And the reason why the Bulls won the game was simple really, they limited fastbreak opportunities for the Heat, limited penetration of James and Wade(less fta), rebounded the ball well, and executed well enough on offense to take advantage of the aggressive defensive style that Miami plays to hit their open shots. (By the way which the Bulls had plenty of during their series but the Bulls routinely failed to make those shots)

It is pitiful to see Miami's half court offense, this is the reason why Chris Bosh is so instrumental for their success. The Bulls limited Bosh's ability to score in this game resulting in difficult shots, what you suggest as "showing up" is really just him unable to hit low-percentage shots that James and Wade consistently converted. Wade and James both giving their best Bryant impersonation with the hitting of 15-18 ft jumpshots for much of the game.

And Miami despite all their easy assists on fastbreak points and three point shots register on the lower end of the team assist stats. In their last 10 games they rank 21 in the league and for the year 14th again despite all their easy fastbreak assists and high 3 pt %.

Going back to what I said previously; for whatever reason the players that cannot find their shots most games, tend to do so when Rose isn't playing. It has nothing to do with Rose not spreading the ball. When he isn't playing, there isnt such a regimented play running scheme that they can get bogged down in. The team does gel better.

The lack of secondary scoring in the half court when Rose is playing, is a significant problem against the Heat. It is a makeup problem, and a offensive scheme problem. You don't know what makes the difference when Boozer, who is supposed to be such a large piece of the puzzle, still cannot create his own shot against teams who play defense, let alone the Heat. And we cannot count on the signing to help address that, in Rip, to even be alive for the playoffs. .

Well one reason is they are almost forced to actually utilize Boozer more on the offensive end and so more opportunities for scoring are created. It was disappointing that he was barely involved at all on the offensive end during the 4th quarter against Portland -- by my count 1 trip to the free throw line and 2 shot attempts, one on an attempted putback offensive rebound and all this despite him having much success on the offensive end throughout the rest of the game.

What I want to see is more Carlos Boozer in the earlier parts of the 2nd quarter and 4th quarter allowing for better offensive production during those periods. On the occasion that Thibs actually done this they were pretty successful, but then again Thibs is notorious for his rigidity regarding his rotations.

No, the bulls are not the same team they were last year. Please explain our 12th ranked offense last year compared to our 2nd/3rd ranked offense this year.

It IS possible to improve without having made any roster moves, you know? Chemistry, morale and teamwork are under rated.

No stop it you are making sense, surely such things only apply to reasons why Miami will be so dominant this year but it is not applicable to other teams. Last year, much was made of the differences in Miami's new team roster yet little was noted of the massive changes in the Bulls roster from the year before nor of their difficulties regarding injuries the entire year or even this year.

But then again the notion that the Bulls roster is horrid except for Rose persists among many people including the likes of Chris Broussard or Ric Bucher, who cant seem to comprehend how the Bulls have manage to be consistently successful with/without Rose.

It is downright hilarious on how pervasive the headline was of the Bulls win their first game in the last 6 against Miami. From my count, since the new rosters both teams compiled the record stands at 5-5 with most games decided in the final 2 minutes of the game.

Pretty much the only important thing in basketball is efficiency. 34 points on 29 shots isn't spectacular. I mean it's decent, but not exactly the kind of game that you want to point to when you're calling him a great ball player.

The whole points to shot attempt ratio is a pretty worthless ratio. 34 pts on 29 shots could have meant Rose was 17-29 from the field.

[King Nud]

I'm scared to say it but I don't think the Bulls can get past the Heat this season after all these injuries... Rose will be fine, but it's Deng that's the key to the entire idea of winning it all.

Defenses are actually making a point of banging on his left wrist to make him hurt, of forcing him left and into dribbling with that left hand which is literally useless other than as a guide hand.

He can no longer catch and drive because of the pain that inflicts on his wrist and that has limited him to being a spot-up shooter. 15-51 his last four games.

[RZZZA]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[jukeness]

No change for Jimmy Butler though lol.

[Scipio Afracanis]

I'm scared to say it but I don't think the Bulls can get past the Heat this season after all these injuries... Rose will be fine, but it's Deng that's the key to the entire idea of winning it all.

Defenses are actually making a point of banging on his left wrist to make him hurt, of forcing him left and into dribbling with that left hand which is literally useless other than as a guide hand.

He can no longer catch and drive because of the pain that inflicts on his wrist and that has limited him to being a spot-up shooter. 15-51 his last four games.

The Heat are vulnerable from the 3 point line, Bulls shooters can make them pay and play good D. All it takes is some good shooting nights by 1 or 2 guys and they can do it. Magic live and die by that and have gone to the Finals.(Hedo did have an amazing playoff run though but thats what happens when your the MJ of Turkey)

I think the Heat will take the East but I would not be the least bit surprised if Chi Town is in the Finals because they are that/can be that good.

(True that injuries to key players kind of puts a damper on things though)