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Thread: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

  1. #1
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Anyone else finding the 2x Unit size of Darth Mod to be excessive?

    My computer can handle it, but the small castles means it's almost impossible to line up your units and prepare for battle as they are all hugely overlapping.

    Even regular battles on the map once you have a full stack it's hard to manage formations as each individual unit is so wide.

    Anyone found a healthy medium for unit sizes?
    Can I reduce unit size in the middle of a campaign or I have to start again?

  2. #2
    Elta's Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Personally, I got tired of seeing full stack VS full stack.

    So what I did was make the upkeep of every unit four times more.
    Of course it doesn't make for a perfectly balanced game, but it's a step in right direction (In my view)
    I made general's bodyguard unit smaller as well.
    Last edited by Elta; September 18, 2011 at 03:09 AM.

  3. #3
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default

    Probably a good idea.

    One problem never resolved in all TWs is the inability to effectively use reinforcements. Either the ai controls them and stuffs up, or they trickle in only when a unit is wiped out.

    It's also a pain when defending a castle really as the defender you should be at the advantage but you can only have 1 stack in the castle vs many enemy stacks outside.

    How did you increase upkeep? Which file do I edit?

  4. #4
    Elta's Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    I used the Hex editor, I still got a lot of random crashes though

    I haven't done any serious modding since M2

  5. #5
    Inhuman One's Avatar Tribunus
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    I'd like to see reduced movement for larger stacks. Each unit added should slow the army down a bit. This would allow small armies to outmanouver larger armies, which would be historically accurate unless the large army contains just cavalry. Cavalry alone would already move further, so would suffer less from the movement penalty.

    This would make fielding smaller armies a good option.

  6. #6
    Supai
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    i would like castles that give true advantage to the defender

  7. #7
    Doom M.D.'s Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Quote Originally Posted by betto View Post
    i would like castles that give true advantage to the defender
    uhhh

    they're not the castles of Medieval, but they definitely give an advantage to defenders.
    i love www.twcenter.net, formerly known as www.kidswhocantreadgood.com

  8. #8
    Dustindesrctin's Avatar Hastatus
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    I prefer to use normal unit sizes, on medium because around 80 pre unit just sounds right. My comp can handle it but to me in medieval Japan with all the clans fighting on another I just don't see each clan going around with 8000 soliders.

  9. #9
    Supai
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Quote Originally Posted by Doom M.D. View Post
    uhhh

    they're not the castles of Medieval, but they definitely give an advantage to defenders.
    if what i read everywhere is true
    first sometimes the attackers tried to attacks without assembly ladders to storm a "fort" before reinforcerments arrive but it usually ended really bad for the attacker
    second the forts had normal walls too the inclined ones were like a invitation for a general desiring fame to attack there and lose his men

  10. #10
    Doom M.D.'s Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    not sure what that has to do with gameplay at all.
    i love www.twcenter.net, formerly known as www.kidswhocantreadgood.com

  11. #11
    Mr Kami's Avatar Emotionally disturbed
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Agreed history lessons have nothing to do with the gameplay that's being discussed in this thread so please stick to the topic guys.

  12. #12
    Yari-hei
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Well large unit sizes are usually fine for me, unless it's a siege.

    In that case, it just gets silly. On 2x unit sizes, I would say around 8-10 ashigaru units fit inside the fort, including manning the walls. If an enemy attacks with more than 8-10 ashigaru (which is always will), you either have to try to stuff all of your troops into the fort and get massacred by the hail of arrows falling on your peasant blob... OR you can sally forth and get massacred when the too large unit sizes get caught on the gate.

  13. #13
    Mr Kami's Avatar Emotionally disturbed
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Stick to the topic if you would be so kind

  14. #14
    Doom M.D.'s Avatar Signifer
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    he is. relax.
    i love www.twcenter.net, formerly known as www.kidswhocantreadgood.com

  15. #15
    Supai
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    well sorry about the topic , yes 2x size with the initial castle is awful crampled but in the citadel its very enjoyable

  16. #16
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    Well we don't always want a citadel, too much food it costs...

    And with the propensity for battles to always go full stack, it is overkill.

    The whole tactical enjoyment of arranging your troops and issuing orders works nicely when there is enough room.

    But with a mass gaggle of men filling the fort, it just turns into a battle or click and hope..

  17. #17
    Supai
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    a fort battle must be dangerous for the attacker or why someone would build a fort ?
    so would be better limit the number of units by the fort level like first level 4 units ... second level 8 ....
    and give more advantage to the defender , use full stacks on all battles is boring and if you have to use full stack vs full stack ever then nor you nor the ai will be able to use the power of bigger numbers. ireally hope that someone find a way to play with 40 or 60 smaller units like some guy is doing for ntw.

  18. #18
    Nelduin's Avatar a.k.a ALG & echuu
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    You can edit user.scrip.txt and change value of the campaign_unit_multiplier line . Using Darthmod and 2x units size, the default value is 2, so you can change it to 1.3 or 1.4. It makes battles easier to manage and you have more soldiers than vanilla.
    Last edited by Nelduin; September 20, 2011 at 08:20 AM.

  19. #19
    Cторожевая Cобака.
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    I moved mine down to 1.25 multiplayer and it's very manageable and still gives plenty of men per unit. Just requires a campaign restart.

  20. #20
    Hartassen's Avatar Ishiyumi no shashu
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    Default Re: 2x Unit Size not needed for Shogun 2?

    I always play on normal units sizes, I used to play on large but as some other people pointed out, It's annoying as hell defending fort/stronghold with a fullstack. You can't fit stuff in there for . Whic was a huge problem in M2TW for castles.

    I really think CA needs to spend more time optimizing castle/town size to unit ratio A really good step would be to have castles larger/smaller depending on unit size. Might seem excessive but for instance in medieval if you played on huge or even large you couldn't place a single unit on most walls in the regular castles as they just wouldn't fit.

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