Night's Watch Preview

[Werthead]

Too bad that the Night's Watch went to hell along with everything else under Robert. If the Targaryens still ruled, the realm wouldn't be so split. But who knows, maybe Rhaegar might have turned out like his father. Doubtful, as he hated his father, but still the possibility.

The Night's Watch went to hell because of the Targaryens and the general peace and prosperity of the realm, not Robert specifically. When Aegon invaded, Harren the Black's brother was Lord Commander of the Night's Watch with 10,000 men at his command. Even by the reign of King Jaehaerys I and Queen Alysanne, just a few decades later the Watch was showing the first signs of decreptitude, with castles falling into disuse and ruin. Jaehaerys and Alysanne did some favours for the Watch, sponsoring the building of a new castle on the Wall and so on, but after them it seems the Targaryens neglected the institution.

The biggest problem was that before the Targaryens, there was a constrant stream of wars between the sovereign kingdoms. It appears that 'taking the black' was indeed a viable alternative to being executed as a deserter, or for treason, or for being taken prisoner but with no-one to pay a ransom and so on. These conflicts generated a constant stream of fresh recruits for the Watch. However, after the Targaryens took power, these wars and conflicts tailed off and became very rare (the Faith Militant Uprising and the Blackfyre Rebellions aside), so the only recruits for the Watch were criminals and well-intending knights. The constant - or at least regular - stream of battle-hardened knights and soldiers basically dried up. So the Watch suffered numerically and qualitatively, leading to the situation in the books where the Watch has dropped to barely more than 1,000 men to hold 300 miles of Wall, and most of those are former criminals.

Robert didn't pay much attention to the Night's Watch, but I suspect that between him knowing Eddard and Benjen, he might have been talked into sending more support once the threat of Mance Rayder became clearer. Obviously events prevented that from happening.

[Lordinquisitor]

Robert didn't pay much attention to the Night's Watch, but I suspect that between him knowing Eddard and Benjen, he might have been talked into sending more support once the threat of Mance Rayder became clearer. Obviously events prevented that from happening.

I bet he would have attacked mance himself.

[StannisBaratheon]

I bet he would have attacked mance himself.

This. For all his numerous flaws, Robert was still the kind of guy who would rather roll up his sleeves and sort something like that out personally.

[Sandy]

To be quite honest I don't even think Robert would have been needed to quash the wildings (had he still been alive.) Ned would have called his banners and crushed the wildings. we saw what stannis and his knights did and there were only 3000 of them at max. the North can raise ten times that should needs be.

[achudnow]

This is all most likely academic. Mance Rayder wasn't an idiot, he wouldn't have bothered to attack the Wall with Eddard Stark and the entirety of the North ready to array against him if he dared try to take the Wall, let alone the fact that Robert might have taken notice.

On a different note, whats the point of the AI Night's Watch? I assume there will be Wildling and Other invasions, and will there still be events to help the Night's Watch? Also, what will the consequences of the Night's Watch falling be? Forgive me if these questions have already been answered, I didn't want to drudge through 7 pages of posts xD

[redfungie]

I dunno if this has already been discussed or not but I don't wanna, like the guy before me, "drudge" through 7 other pages. But an idea for the nights watch could be similar to what the pope faction is, in a sense that you have to do certain things they request. Now, I don't mean like what the pope says like "don't attack this" or "raise religion here".. but the nights watch could have like a guy walking around (inquisitor?) and asking you to give stacks of units to the nights watch. In doing this you could gain chivalry (or fame or whatever is in the game maybe even money) and strengthen the night watch for the impending invasion. And depending on how much they are strengthened (A.I. has a script to give units randomly or by measuring their own power seeing if they can afford to give said units) they will either hold off the horde from the north or crumble feebly and then all hell is loose. Now, the horde can either be A) a set army of a set mass and stats. or B) depending on how reinforced the nights watch is is how big the horde is. By that I mean the opposite. If the nights watch is weak and feeble, the horde will be HUGE as to make everyone suffer for not helping the nights watch and thus reeking actual damage on the factions (and player). Or if the nights watch is strong, making the horde smaller then them and intentionally lose to show "Good job you helped the night fend off the horde" kinda scenario. If you also wanted maybe add like a mini Mance Raider (butchered the name probably but to lazy to look how to spell it correctly) sneak behind the wall and kinda harass for lore sake (haven't read a dance for dragons yet so I dunno if he succeeds or not). I think that would be the best way to handle the Nights Watch in the game to make then a somewhat factor in the game, but not a huge one. Also, in the game you could add like scripts like what they do in the vanilla and like have the nights watch guy die (I forget the guys name but I missed him the one who helped Arya escape kings landing) and then they send another. But you could put scripts like that in the game that affect certain events like causing a war or making a guy die (Ned's beheading anyone..?). Maybe not AS extreme as killing someone but you get the general idea (for lores sake!). Just some ideas. If anythings unclear I can help explain it better but it's 3 am here in Alaska and I'm tired... Hope you like the Idea!

[Toho]

@ redfungie that actually sounds really interesting. we will think about.

@achudnow
"you know nothing Achudnow Snow"

[HunterGratzner]

Couldn't tell from the screenshot, but will Eastwatch-by-the-Sea have a port? I rather like the idea of the crows helping reduce piracy.

[achudnow]

I can just imagine it, Black Brother Sailors! Damn, they must swear ALOT.....

[Meshakhad]

Ultimately, to give the Night's Watch playability would require two additional factions: the wildlings and the Others. I personally think that this would form an "expansion pack" - Westeros: Total War: Beyond the Wall.

The wildlings could - in theory - be playable. They wouldn't actually represent all the wildlings, just those under Mance Rayder. Other wildlings would be represented by rebel bands. Special units would include spearwives, giants, and mammoths.

The Others would be unplayable - indeed, I think they would be represented by unique rebel groups. Their main units would be wights and Others. Wights would be tough troops, representing their resistance to normal weapons. Others would be nearly invincible unless a unit had been upgraded with obsidian weapons. I think we'll have to wait on the pale spiders until we actually see them in the books.

As the campaign goes on, the Others become more numerous. Unless you are very good, Mance Rayder will not survive without the resources of the Wall. You will have to either negotiate with the Watch or take the Wall by force. You also encounter more Others if you go north. And you have to deal with the cold.

[Toho]

^
aye and that aint happening, as i have said before NW will remain unplayable and the only faction up there. we already have our hands full with the other houses we don't need to add a faction that has mammoths, giants and etc...sorry it ain't happening, maybe one day.

[Deathshade]

I think that Meshakhad wanted to say that it would need a submod but that it don't have to be include in the official mod.

[Enferfeu]

I personally think that this would form an "expansion pack" - Westeros: Total War: Beyond the Wall.

This is an awesome idea.
Guys, focus on the 1.0 version, with the Night's Watch only fighting against a generic barbarianish faction named Wildings. Then once finished I think it would be a great a idea, if interest still exsists, for the Night's Watch to be given a playable spot in the grand campaign and then a providential campaign or something with more scripting through an "expansion pack". (with the option to assist you know who, hopefully in both grand and providential, I do not know how to do spoilers so I will not give his name) We all want the computer controlled Night's Watch in the 1.0 version defending the realm from Windings, but while I can not speak for everyone, I would rather have them face a faction that is easily skinned (if they need to be at all) then one that will take a large amount of time. (Or to play as the Others or Wildilngs) I can't wait for this mod to be completed, and I'm sorry mammoths, Jon Snow and The Others, but I think you will have to wait for us to lead you to conquer Westros.

[Araporn]

looking good, keep up the great work.

[achudnow]

Yes, I will deeply enjoy leading the Night's Watch to conquer the rest of the Houses! Hehe. Jon Snow, the King on the Iron Throne, Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North. I could make Samwell Tarly the Hand of the King and Lord of Highgarden Maybe Pyp could be Lord of Riverrun and Casterly Rock, hell I could give Alliser Thorne the cheery fortress of Dragonstone! Muahahaha!

[Enferfeu]

Yes, I will deeply enjoy leading the Night's Watch to conquer the rest of the Houses! Hehe. Jon Snow, the King on the Iron Throne, Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, Lord of Winterfell and Warden of the North. I could make Samwell Tarly the Hand of the King and Lord of Highgarden Maybe Pyp could be Lord of Riverrun and Casterly Rock, hell I could give Alliser Thorne the cheery fortress of Dragonstone! Muahahaha!

My friend.... You have just ruined the ending to the entire book series.

[Meshakhad]

They'd never see it coming. And assuming the AI works, the Starks might well leave the North undefended. You could preposition armies near Winterfell, Last Hearth, the Dreadfort, and Deepwood Motte, then attack quickly. After that, you use the resources of the North to build a bigger army, and keep pushing south.

I'm totally going to do that.

[Enferfeu]

The above comment could be veryyyyyy deadly if the computer were to do it. Will there be systems that punish this act?

[captainnemo55555]

I can't wait to play as Dorne just to send an army up, destroy the nights watch and let all the other northern faction be destroyed by the Others and the Wildlings while I take my time taking the south

[Timur Amir]

I can't wait to play as Dorne just to send an army up, destroy the nights watch and let all the other northern faction be destroyed by the Others and the Wildlings while I take my time taking the south

But the Starks never compete with Dorne...wouldn't that actually be making the South less divided and weak, thereby making it harder for yourself while giving you active enemies to the North in replacement of an overstretched nuetral nation? I'm all for randomly attacking the Watch, but what advantages would it give (either in a future wilding-inclusive version or the current)