matchlock use-fullness?

[helots]

How useful are matchlock units to archer units?
guns changed warfare in japan but does it change much in the game?

[Meraun]

In my recent campain i play Shimazu and i turned them to christianity.

right now iam unbeatable in Naval because of my Namban Tradeship's.

I don't use archers at all but Matchlock-Samurai.
They do hell of a job against every type of enemy, but they have to stand
in the first line.. wich is bad against an emeny with a lot of cav..

Iam not able not recruit Eurpean merc's or christ-samurai.. but i think they are even better because of there have a longer
range.


Fazit: If you change to christianity use matchlock with eurpean merc's and christ-samurai.

If you stay with budism.. stick with the archers

[♔DARTH LEGO♔]

A very debatable topic this one:

Obviously they will be nowhere near as effective as their European counterparts but as Merahun stated for shock value etc they are invaluable.

personally, i only ever include 1-3 units in a stack; and their survival rate is negligible as they are an instant magnet for any heavy cav on the field; whats more is they are far quicker to be outflanked than archers and their rate of fire is terrible.

In sieges all of the above is reversed with matchlock being imperative to a a brutal white wash of the AI, for me match is most effective in sieges otherwise at best a good battlefield distraction... at worst a serious hole in your battle line.

[Morgan]

It depends, I find archers to be more effective overall. They have increased range, higher accuracy and better fire rate making them very useful as long as they are protected from infantry and cavalry. Though I have found that when I have had large armies of Matchlock units then they become very effective as the enemy forces are normally shredded by the time they get to your line. Though if they do reach your line you will experience heavy losses even against ashiguru. In most campaigns I avoid them, I mainly use them in custom battles for the experience of using them. This is my army setup;
- General Unit (Or Another Cavalry)
- 2 Cavalry Units
- 2 Naginata Units
- 4 Sword Units
- 5 Yari Units
- 6 Archer Units

When you have that army setup with Samurai you are very powerful and prepared for most instances. The only thing I have found that presents a problem is if the enemy have a large force of cavalry.

[Arksa]

you can place them at strategic points in a castle (requires one with more than one level though) and they will do serious damage. My one Matchlock Ashigaru unit killed 220 samurai in a battle it was pretty devastating.

[MatrixStorm]

Matchlocks + castle = flawless victory

I used them a while ago, 6 units of matchlock.
4 where placed at the wall's openings, and 2 in reserve.
When the walls were climbed, and my units almost slaughtered, I placed the reserves in one line, and enabled rank fire.
It was one big massacre.

[Arksa]

I let them be one level up from the melee infantry I have. The melee guys just hold the line and the matchlocks tear everything apart from safety ))).

[Yankee fan117]

its mostly just getting how to use em right i was playing avatar conquest and a guy sniped my general with a veteran matchlock and i lost (it was pretty BA)

[MatrixStorm]

I'm trying a new tactic.
I was thinking about a line of 4 yari ashigaru walls.
When they are attacked and almost routing, the 4 matchlocks behind them use rank fire.

Anyway, matchlocks are best to be used in siege defence.

[rob-a-dogg]

I'm trying a new tactic.
I was thinking about a line of 4 yari ashigaru walls.
When they are attacked and almost routing, the 4 matchlocks behind them use rank fire.

Anyway, matchlocks are best to be used in siege defence.

Are you Russian by any chance?

[MatrixStorm]

Are you Russian by any chance?

Etnically, I'm an Italian with a little bit of Greek blood living in Belgium (second generation immigrant child, or something like that).
But then I'm half Sardinian, so who knows from where I descend of.
Though, my girlfriend is part Russian, part Italian (yep, she has it all to run the mafia ).

Anyway, why would you think that I'm Russian?

[rob-a-dogg]

Anyway, why would you think that I'm Russian?

I'm trying a new tactic.
I was thinking about a line of 4 yari ashigaru walls.
When they are attacked and almost routing, the 4 matchlocks behind them use rank fire.

Anyway, matchlocks are best to be used in siege defence.

Which i took to mean

I'm trying a new tactic.
I was thinking about a line of 4 yari ashigaru walls.
When they are attacked and my men are almost routing, the 4 matchlocks behind them use rank fire.

Anyway, matchlocks are best to be used in siege defence.

So you would be shooting your own men just as they fail to hold back the enemy Just like the red army did when their own men retreated

[MatrixStorm]

Which i took to mean



So you would be shooting your own men just as they fail to hold back the enemy Just like the red army did when their own men retreated

By the time that my yari ashigaru retreat, they are at least decimated.
those few men are worth the sacrifice.

[JohntheKern]

Anyway, why would you think that I'm Russian?

I imagine because your Matchlocks would take down some fleeing Ashigaru, shooting deserters and cowards in effect, something Commisars perfected in Russia

[MatrixStorm]

I imagine because your Matchlocks would take down some fleeing Ashigaru, shooting deserters and cowards in effect, something Commisars perfected in Russia

Well, I see it this way:

My yari ashigaru hold the line in yari wall formation.
This way they can hold the line much better and counter charges more effectively.
If there may be a situation that the yari wall breaks, they will probably destroy my men.
A soon as they flee, their numbers are around 20 left.

So well yeah, some of them get a bullet in their stomach, or liver, or face...
But at least the enemy will be dead.

[Fuznwerfer]

lol, the throwaway of peasant soldiers

[donions]

I've never actually used Matchlock myself. I always refuse Nanban trade.

But I can attest to there usefulness, especially when defending forts. Sending ashigaru up a wall defended by guns is like sending them in the ocean to wrestle a great white.
My next campaign is definitely gonna be a Japanese Christian Crusade. I grew respect for them after they repelled my sieges last night.

[alexjs]

I like having a couple per army. They seem to give an automatic moral hit on the enemy soldiers even if they don't kill a lot - I don't know if that's technically true though. As others said, they're awesome defenders but on the open field they're magnets for cavalry and so forth. I almost prefer artillery over matchlocks on the field.

[MatrixStorm]

I like having a couple per army. They seem to give an automatic moral hit on the enemy soldiers even if they don't kill a lot - I don't know if that's technically true though. As others said, they're awesome defenders but on the open field they're magnets for cavalry and so forth. I almost prefer artillery over matchlocks on the field.

Well it should be.
Historically seen, matchlocks were feared for their simplicity and lethality in the hands of even the weakest man.
Imagine being an ashigaru soldier, and suddenly seeing your comrades fall down without even touching the opponent.
If you didn't know what a matchlock was, it would have looked like magic.

[alexjs]

Well it should be.
Historically seen, matchlocks were feared for their simplicity and lethality in the hands of even the weakest man.
Imagine being an ashigaru soldier, and suddenly seeing your comrades fall down without even touching the opponent.
If you didn't know what a matchlock was, it would have looked like magic.

Agreed.