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Thread: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

  1. #1

    Default Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    If there is any possible even minuscule way of fixing or softening the Dishonoring Treaties affect ingame, someone please fix this dam stupid issue! Ive read countless and zillions of threads about this whole Dishonor issue and i have to side with the peope against it cause there are so many things that doesnt make any sense about it. From this topic, http://forums.totalwar.com/showthrea...uring-Treaties ,it doesnt seem like CA is going to fix this So anyone if possible, please.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    i thought dishonoring treaties effect is good for the game. people want stronger alliance from AI ally, and this is also good to prevent human players cheating their AI counterparts like in previous series.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    I thought that too at first until i started getting DT for ridiculous reasons! I get DT from clans ive never even met before and when i havent declared war nor broke alliances nothing. Its strange how it works and maybe i just dont understand the mechanics of it but how is it that so many other people are having the same exact issue as i am?..If you do a search about DT on google youll get plenty and plenty of threads about it.

  4. #4
    Lord Baal's Avatar Praefectus
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    Default Re: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    May be they could get reduced penalties to lessen their mistaken application?
    Last edited by Lord Baal; April 28, 2011 at 10:45 AM.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    i would like that mid ill look into it

  6. #6

    Default Re: Dishonoring Treaties! Mod? Fix?

    I have looked through the code in detail and tested many of the situations described by players as possibly causing the "Dishonouring Treaties" effect to apply incorrectly and have not found a single instance that is not working as described above.
    This sentence... troubles me.

    I haven't looked through the code, but I have tested the game in a few campaigns and found quite opposite. What gamers report is true, what CA reports is not true.

    In my experience diplomacy lasts for only few turns. After that I get massive penalties and it is beyond amends. The sources are:
    - my allies declaring war on each other, forcing me to break the alliance
    - auto-breaking of trade agreements, due to drop in relations
    - auto-breaking of trade agreements, due to faction being destroyed or having lost a trading connection (road, port)
    - AI faction ill-behavior towards other factions which affects me for some reason

    In fact building the good relations is based on paying great amounts of money to everyone, avoiding making alliances and vassals, and avoiding trade agreements. Even the smallest actions have devastating impact on diplomacy. This is a chain reaction, an avalanche like effect and it quickly turns whole d-map red.

    Example: your fresh vassal faction with good relations may declare war on you at random (confirmed to happen). This is disastrous because you get "dt" hit and sometimes more. You win and you get additional territorial hit. This unbalances the relations with clans. You lose trade agreements and get another "dt" hit. You will be attacked soon and get another "dt" or expansion hits. It is beyond repair now.

    Example2: it may happen that a strong or lucky clan will destroy several of your trade partners or even allies. In Shogun 2 it is impossible to predict that. The "dt" you receive is so massive you will never be able to make allies anymore due to aforementioned avalanche effect.

    Example3. it is easy to prove that "dt" are purely artificial and based on bad coding. The proof lays in the regularity of CAI actions. Try "plowing" through the map with a good army "liberating" provinces to vassals. You will see that they gradually turn hostile and rebel in predictable number of turns. The order of rebellions and number of turns needed for rebellion will be constant and perfectly reflecting the order and time of "plowing". This means that you can always predict the exact moment of rebellion. So if you make vassals: Imagawa in turn 1, Tokugawa 3 turns later and Oda 4 Turns later, the Imagawa will rebel in X turns, Tokugawa in X+3 and Oda in X+3+4. I find this extremely funny.

    To be honest I stopped playing the Shogun2 just now, because I am looking for a good mod. I can't force myself to play the game as it is. What I believe that should be done is a complete removal of the "Dishonouring Treaties" feature and applying some particular and balanced effects.

    Counterexample1: I believe that backstabbing of vassals should be strongly limited. They shouldn’t do that unless more powerful, richer, bribed, promised powerful counter-allies (these would require some barter style diplomacy and advanced AI though), betrayed or directly assaulted. In game as it is having lasting vassals is too much of a risk and not much of a profit. Winning a war should earn some respect bonus too.

    Counterexample2: So enemies destroyed a friendly clan or made the trade impossible, so what? This is not my fault. I don't want to stop trading with anyone. Unless I make such a decision myself. So if I break treaty myself penalty should be applied. If it happens due to other causes - no penalty. Also alliances should serve a purpose - peace or war. In game as it is there is no difference.

    Counterexample3: So my vassal turned against me. This is obviously a disgrace deserving a penalty. Hoverer - slaughtering a traitor is a traditional way of saving face. It is also a frightening example. Every time I destroy a faction or punish the rebellion I should be given some sort of a bonus, a positive renown. This puts things back in order.
    Last edited by Steamloller; August 18, 2011 at 07:17 PM.

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