Lord of the Rings vs. Medieval Europe

[Celebrinbor1]

blunt truma acts very different than Penetrating truma...andin the book it was an orc chief instead a troll.

Getting hit by a troll club probably isn't an issue of blunt force trauma, I'm guessing that the whiplash/G-force caused by accelerating that fast would alone be enough to kill.

[KnightsTemplar]

there is simply no way Elf and orcs can united against men, it's the whole basic premise of Middle-Earth.
and demonic forces like Nazgul or Trolls could act as double-edge swords, yes they were powerful on one hand, but they were also easily de-humanized. (they were not human anyway)
Say that Pope could denounce them as agent of Satan, thus soldier who killed these monster would granted with entry of Heaven...

considered that religious driven warriors often engaged in near -suicidal stlyle fighting, I wouldn't say it's impossible to defeat trolls or other monsters.

BTW, does anyone considered that population in Middle-Earth probably has no immunity against germs in our world?

Well you never saw the fell winter.
Elves win then.

[KnightsTemplar]

Sure, a pre-gunpowder Europe would be a bit less daunting to Middle Earth IF all the forces of Middle Earth could somehow unite and that would be a huge hurdle alone. Europe however, wouldn't have nearly as much trouble uniting thanks to the pope. Now if Middle Earth could unite then they'd at least stand a chance but we're talking a HUGE difference in population. I'd say Gondor and Rohan (in the book, not the movie) are your average 13th century European country.

If we're getting into the late Medieval period (1400s) we're getting into gunpowder. I don't care how amazingly strong Olag-Hai may be they aren't going to stand up too well to gunpowder weapons and the Europeans would be vastly superior to the armies in lotr in terms of both quantity and quality. The army of low level gentry (the farmers that you mentioned) would be replaced with disciplined standing armies of trained troops. And sure, spies feeding information can be a deadly weapon but how much can information do to an enemy that is so vastly superior to you? Also, Mumakil are essentially giant elephants. The real world has those too they may not be as big but they can be equipped with cannon.

Even in the early days of gunpowder age, longbows are much better than them.
Just they are much more easier and required much less training.
A longbowman is a job livelong. Like a elf.
When everyone goes gunpowder, the bow-strong ME would still have power to resist the MA dudes.

[Baywatch]

Even in the early days of gunpowder age, longbows are much better than them.
Just they are much more easier and required much less training.
A longbowman is a job livelong. Like a elf.
When everyone goes gunpowder, the bow-strong ME would still have power to resist the MA dudes.

I'm not going to get into this because it leads down the road to the argument that has been beat into the ground of Archery vs. Armor. But, let's just say gunpowder made armor completely obsolete where as longbows did not. Say Gondor is pitted against an enemy European nation from the 15th century, both are likely decked out in Plate armor (if we're going by the movie and not the books). Gunpowder, even in its earliest form, would be a massive advantage in that battle.

I'll leave it at that and hope I made my point without starting anything that I will regret.

[Lugiahua]

more importantly...gunpowder weapons made all exist forts obsolete...

[Lemoniser]

more importantly...gunpowder weapons made all exist forts obsolete...

Even those pesky just about indestructable walls and towers?

[a-woowie.doowie]

Off topic! Basically I didn't want to start a new thread - just to ask a simple question(I think it's simple atleast ).

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Does anyone know where I can watch a free-stream of the LotR trilogy - extended versions?

[Thanatos]

Please do not promote illegal activities, thank you.

[KnightsTemplar]

Even those pesky just about indestructable walls and towers?

Even Ents cannot cause a single mark on Orthanc.
Something that can rip thick walls like paper can't even make a little damage.
From here we can see the strength of Ents can be compare to cannons. (They punch right through the great walls of Isengard and rip them apart from the INSIDE!)
But still they can't damage the tower, So I guess Minas Tirith will be stilll the city that never fall.

[Lemoniser]

Please do not promote illegal activities, thank you.

I was wondering if something like that would pop up.

Even Ents cannot cause a single mark on Orthanc.
Something that can rip thick walls like paper can't even make a little damage.
From here we can see the strength of Ents can be compare to cannons. (They punch right through the great walls of Isengard and rip them apart from the INSIDE!)
But still they can't damage the tower, So I guess Minas Tirith will be stilll the city that never fall.

Exactly. But only the first wall is made of that material so with mortars and everything gun powder would still give them a big advantage. Not to mention small arms.

[KnightsTemplar]

I was wondering if something like that would pop up.



Exactly. But only the first wall is made of that material so with mortars and everything gun powder would still give them a big advantage. Not to mention small arms.

Well I think it's mentioned the first wall is incredibly high.
Each level is one-hundred-foot high as recorded, 1 feet = 12 inches.
12 inches is 30.5cm. 100 foot = 1200 inches.
3050 cm for one level. Total its 30.5 metres tall for a level.
(long calculations)
In my country, one level for a flat nowadays is ~3 metres.
For this, only the first level would have been 10 floors.
And we got seven 'floors' for the great city.
Can't imagine how it looks like in real.
I think never a fort in MA had reached this height.
A 30 metres tall bullet-proof wall.

[SamwiseTheGay]

well the main problem would be that european nations would never want to go to war with middle earth societies, for the reason that middle earth has no clearly defined economic motivators for war. in fact i dont even understand the reason for war between any middle earth nations themselves. does gondor have lots of resources or something? why is mordor so keen to destroy it, not even occupy it! not to mention that the entire orc race would likely revolt against sauron, seeing as that they are obviously an intelligent species and sauron doesnt even care about nationalistic values, even though he is so obviously a fascist totalitarian!
BUT the BIG question!
are there orc women!? cities? or just military barracks' and soldiers. god im confused

[Lugiahua]

The Gate of Minas Tirith could be breached, and the wall was high, but not high enought to prevent siege weapons from attacking the inner-city.

[Darth Ravenous]

The Gate of Minas Tirith could be breached, and the wall was high, but not high enought to prevent siege weapons from attacking the inner-city.

That's because siege weapons arc most cannons not so much.

well the main problem would be that european nations would never want to go to war with middle earth societies, for the reason that middle earth has no clearly defined economic motivators for war. in fact i dont even understand the reason for war between any middle earth nations themselves. does gondor have lots of resources or something? why is mordor so keen to destroy it, not even occupy it! not to mention that the entire orc race would likely revolt against sauron, seeing as that they are obviously an intelligent species and sauron doesnt even care about nationalistic values, even though he is so obviously a fascist totalitarian!
BUT the BIG question!
are there orc women!? cities? or just military barracks' and soldiers. god im confused

One question, have you read the books? Or are you going by what you've seen from the movies?

[a-woowie.doowie]

Please do not promote illegal activities, thank you.

Is free-stream illegal in your countries? Or where you speaking of something else perhaps? If yes, then sorry - my bad.

[KnightsTemplar]

Is free-stream illegal in your countries? Or where you speaking of something else perhaps? If yes, then sorry - my bad.

Well I think many things are illegal in anywhere or you're from Sweden?

[a-woowie.doowie]

Well I think many things are illegal in anywhere or you're from Sweden?

Hahaha right on! I live in Sweden.

Free streaming isn't illegal here. . . yet.

Technically it's only free for the viewers, the ones having the site should've paid for the movie and recieves income whenever there is a viewer. Or something like that - I'm not exactly knowledgeable in the matter.

[Muffer Nl]

Downloading is not illegal in the Netherlands, only uploading. And it seems there are some constitutional problems with making downloading illegal.

[KnightsTemplar]

Hahaha right on! I live in Sweden.

Free streaming isn't illegal here. . . yet.

Technically it's only free for the viewers, the ones having the site should've paid for the movie and recieves income whenever there is a viewer. Or something like that - I'm not exactly knowledgeable in the matter.

The great Pirate's Bay and the Piratpartiet.

[Lemoniser]

Is free-stream illegal in your countries? Or where you speaking of something else perhaps? If yes, then sorry - my bad.

Someone had posted to jsut torrent it (not encouraging it just stating a fact and torrenting is illegal) and yes that was me avoiding the mod hammer of doom.

Anyway the post was removed and replaced with that.