Generals to expensive..

[Dgirth12]

Hi

Been having fun in MP dispite the bugs and art campers, but i come to point where i cant play small or medium battles on 1Vs1.

My General is now rank 8. when i play against lower ranks, mainly rank one and two they can take up to 6 or 7 more units then me, Thats without me taking any vet units.

Large battles i beat the low ranks as i can take my vet army, I play against generals of same ranks on small or medium


Last two 1vs1 i had, My general and 4 none vet units, on medium , my enemy had 12 units.
Even with all my generals 15 or so skill points its not enough to beat an enemy of that size.

My general costs 1450 at rank 8, I think this needs to be looked at.

I just like to add to this, I know if my general was cheaper i would own all the low ranks, But as i dont have an option of selecting what funds i like to play with, via match maker. and it hardly ever puts me against anyone the same rank as me. maybe lowering the price a little bit would make it a little more balanced

[Aykis16]

What I think CA needs to allow you to do is have more than one general so that you can start from Rank 1 with no provinces etc. whenever you want too. You could also customize them differently, like have one Leadership General, one Melee General, one Bow General, and the hybrids of course.

I don't see why this couldn't be possible, especially since a lot of the fun in multiplayer is capturing the provinces on the Avatar Conquest map and unlocking new units and retainers and such.

[Karingemori]

The time I could see this having any type of impact is if you do a siege or normal battle with small funds... and even then, in a small battle, a rank 8 General is only about 700 more than a Rank 1 General. That's TOPS 2 Ashigaru units and not your claim of "6-7".

Don't blame your loss on that, it isn't the real reason. You got outplayed.

[Dgirth12]

The time I could see this having any type of impact is if you do a siege or normal battle with small funds... and even then, in a small battle, a rank 8 General is only about 700 more than a Rank 1 General. That's TOPS 2 Ashigaru units and not your claim of "6-7".

Don't blame your loss on that, it isn't the real reason. You got outplayed.

i knew some would spout that BS, My general costs 1450at rank 8, and yes the last guy i played, had 12 units to my 5, i was taking cheap none vets, so how does that happen ?

[Karingemori]

His General costs 300, which is the starting cost for a general. 1450 - 300 = 1150.

The cheapest unit he can take is the spear ashigaru at 350 points.

1150/350 = 3.28.

At MOST, he could've taken 3 more units.

How about you do the goddamn math? Where is he all of a sudden getting an additional 1400 points? That is how much extra points he'd need to outnumber you by an additional 4, for a total of 7. Nope nope nope.

So at rank 8 he gets 3 more Spear Ashigary, but you get a fully kitted General with about 15 points to spend in the skilltree, turning him either into a sick supporting leader, an amazingly accurate archer or the heaviest cavalry either of you can afford in a small points game- or a mix of it all, while his General has literally no defenses and his army only has 1 retainer, while YOUR army has an amazing 4 retainers. Did you read that? 4 RETAINERS. Do you know what you can do with those 3 additional retainers? Let me count some up for you! -2 to all melee infantry damage. DAMN that's going to screw with his Ashigaru. What more? Oh, you can also reduce the morale of all Ashigaru units with -1. Oh what more can you do? You can ALSO increase your sword attack for +3, and then for another +2, for a total of +5 which is triple what his has.

No, your loss doesn't come from the General "costing too much". It comes from you trying to blame your loss on a non-issue, instead of trying to analyze your own play.

Edit: Man up. Realize you lost. Look at the replays, see WHERE it went wrong. Don't imagine yourself as a super hardass. Not even in small games is this an issue, even less so in MEDIUM games. Damn, dude- the rank 1 Generals I meet in medium do not have a chance against my monster of a General.

You lost. You got beaten. It's OKAY. Learn from it instead of blaming others. That's how you improve.

[dom385]

Well then my maths is terrible to and Im doing it at A level. I've been having this trouble too, I have any army consisting of maybe 1 vet unit and then some none vet units but only about 6 altogether and some of my opponents have bee fielding armies of at least 12 units in the same battle, and not necessarily all of them ashigaru. Is there some kind of bug that allows you to go over the limit.

[ccqwert7]

5000/12 = 416 and 2/3 per unit.

Assuming you have 5 units, they would need 17 units, which results in 294 per unit.

WHICH IS NAWT POSSIBLE. The CHEAPEST you can get a unit is 297, with Inspiring Orater and Trade Post retainers. EVEN AT LV1, the avatar costs 300, further dwindling the numbers.

So by 5th grade mathematics, it is impossible to field 12 units without full ashigaru, or twelve MORE units than you so long as you have one unit (i.e. the general).

there apparently is a money bug, although I have never encountered it.

[Dgirth12]

Maybe its this money bug, as i have a replay of me being outnumberd 12 to 5 units.........and karingemori, stop spazing out..

[Caesarian]

Maybe its this money bug, as i have a replay of me being outnumberd 12 to 5 units.........and karingemori, stop spazing out..

Well he IS right...

[xccam]

Maybe its this money bug, as i have a replay of me being outnumberd 12 to 5 units.........and karingemori, stop spazing out..

It cant be anything except imbalance or a bug? Thats a blinkered approach to being beaten.

[bushranger]

Yeah i had battles and gone WTF at been completly out numbered.I did read somewhere there is a small funds bug where the low rank guy gets med funds,dont no if thats the case but it wouldnt be something that happens alot.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

Yes it's totally stupid I got 3 units last siege , 1 general and 2 bowmen , wtf shoudl I do against 16 units???

[da_bradler]

Yes it's totally stupid I got 3 units last siege , 1 general and 2 bowmen , wtf shoudl I do against 16 units???

upload your replay.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

I don't have , but Iwas luky that my mate was low level and got severall units ....

[naro]

My generals currently costing ~1350 gold (lvl7)... I've still managed to pull wins out of the bag in the few small funds battles which i've been matched into. I did have trouble at one stage when trying to make balanced armies for the small funds but once i accepted that i just didnt have enough money to make a proper army at low funds and concentrated on having a force which could overwhelm an aspect of the ashigaru horde that i typically encounter on small funds it became much easier.

I have a leadership spec'ed general which makes my few units more powerful in the attack, and lowers the ashigaru's already shaky morale. I also tend to pick up powerful cavalry to act as a force multiplyer as they can drag the opponents spearmen/cavalry all over the place allowing breathing room for my infantry.

Retainers either used to cover deficits in my force (like cold snap to reduce archer bow reload), focus improvements in my troops stats, or to lower my opponents stats. It doesn't win all the time with such a small force, however, generals skill can provide a lot of leeway on keeping your forces fighting at low numbers (less then 40%) when the ashigaru typically rout before 60% losses. Once one unit routs then the whole line starts to waver in an ashigaru line.

[Caesarian]

I had a match against a guy with many more units than I did, I was using 2 great guard, 2 naginata samurai, 4 katana samurai and 2 bow warrior monks... he had 6 katana samurai, 4 yari ashigaru, 5 bowmen ashigaru and 4 light cav... and I destroyed him, decisive victory and alls I really did was charge straight ahead.... if you cant beat a lower rank, just get great guard and you will anihilate them

[PROMETHEUS ts]

where do u get those units? I didn't see on themap ...

[Caesarian]

where do u get those units? I didn't see on themap ...

get all the stables or whatever they are called.

[removeduser_45762834756]

mine costes 1800(10stars) and yea this is a bit crapy i searched for a 2vs2 in clan competition match, and even tought i did not searched siege batles, in some magical way i ended up in one, and defending.. but the best part is tath all i had money for was 1 unit, an i was using the "-5% cost to all units retainer" is was small founds ofcourse... in med i do not complaing, is enought to have a decent 3 vetean kick ass units army. and that can easely erase from the map any 12 units army..... 80% of all amtches i have ahd until now i have been outnumbered more than 2x1 in soldiers number and i have won 98% of those matches, so numbers are not a decisive fator... but that is on med, big and ultra..... in small in siege, is just ridiculos......

[Karingemori]

Yes it's totally stupid I got 3 units last siege , 1 general and 2 bowmen , wtf shoudl I do against 16 units???

Well, in circumstances in a siege when you only get half the points of the attacker, the General really is a problem in small funds... since he's about half the points you get!

It's weird that a rank 8 would go up against rank 1s in sieges though.