My experiences and tips for newcomers

[ManDurphies]

Hi guys, ManDurphies here, trolled the forums for a while, decided i'd sign up and give my two cents on shogun 2.

Alright, first things first, Bugs etc:
-Dishonourable Coward bug, very wide spread, basically you get the Dishonourable Coward trait regardless of if you ever leave a battle or not.

-Alt-Tab crash, If you alt tab during the game, it will freeze up, not respond etc.

-Matchmade Search loop, If you search for too long for a matchmade game, you lose the function of the end search button, meaning you get stuck in the searching screen and have to restart the game, OR get a friend to send an invite that you can accept to get out.

-Invalid Armies bug, sometimes, regardless of how much you spend on your army or what units you have, the game tells you that it is invalid and therefore you cant readyup, I tested this with just my general unit and it still said it was invalid

- Matchmade Battles funds/unit sizes, dont know if this is a bug, but the fund size and unit size seem to be completely random in matchmade battles, for the most part you will get small funds/large units but every now and again you get small units and medium funds, just make sure that you check your funds every battle, bringing a small funds army to a medium funds battle sucks.

Some tips for new players:
- Ashigaru, dont ever trust your ashigaru to hold if your general isnt in close proximity, their morale is horrible and even if they outnumber the enemy 10-1 they can still break, I have routed whole armies of ashigaru in literally seconds, after causing at most 10% casualties.

-Saying that, Ashigaru are an integral part of shogun 2 as most battles are fought with small funds, just make sure to have your general close and have at least a few units of samurai to rely on, (you start with one kind based on your generals specialisation)

-General's skills, DONT put points into archery at first, this transforms your general into a cav archer, however the ammo is very limited and your generals shot isnt great, better to spend the points on leadership skills to help morale or melee defence to help your general live though unexpected cav attacks, if you want im to shoot wait till you get to around 5-star level first.

-General's, NEVER EVER charge your general at anything that isnt bow ashigaru of the back of a very depleted unit, the morale boosts your general gives and the penalty for him dying is alot more important in shogun 2, if you have a large amount of ashigaru in your army and he dies, its gg, as ashigaru can break almost the instant he dies, samurai can be counted upon to stand for quite a bit longer, but they still rout quickly.

-Reduced Fatigue General Skill, Get this, not tommorow, now, basically this skill reduces stamina loss and increases stamina regeneration for every unit within your generals aura sphere, as most matchmade battles are on small funds, you can fit the entire army within the circle, never underestimate the power of being able to rush the center hill, your units only being active while the enemies are winded or tired, 2 points in this should suffice

-Balanced armies, Dont ask me about any tactics relating to or involving anything at all to do with army balance, direct your questions towards DeerHunter, as he is a strategic prodigy...

- Retainers, Make sure to choose retainers that suit your army, ie. a retainer that increases bow unit accuracy by 5 if you use archers alot, or one that increases spear unit defence by 2 if you bring alot of yari troops, common sense really. If you use alot of Ashigaru, watchout for the retainer, Bad Omen, being used against you, it will decrease the morale of all your Ashigaru by 1.

Aykis16 provided - Here's one tip from me for beginners: At the beginning, most of your armies are likely filled with ashigaru, so if after a battle one of your ashigaru becomes a veteran, I recommend putting the 1st skill point in Morale. As others have said before me, morale is key. As you gain experience and unlock more units, start reducing the number of ashigaru in your army. Right now I use only 3 bow ashigaru and 1 veteran Yari Ashigaru in my army with the rest being Cavalry and Yari/Katana Samurai and its been working well for me.

Aykis16 provided - Speaking of morale, if you spot an opportunity to take out an enemy's general, go for it. Quite a few of my wins have been in battles where I've been losing, but was able to turn the tide by killing the opposing general. The bowman trait for your own general can be useful for this, especially if the enemy doesn't have it. Usually they keep their general close to their main army to provide the morale boost, so if your general has the bowmen, or if you have some archers hanging back, have them target the enemy general and if he falls or routs, it could turn the tide of battle in your favor.

And finally, kiting with horse archers or cav in general.... Dont, just dont, its a dog of a way to play and in the end, unless they brought only like 1 unit of spears they can just sit in a forest in loose formation until you run out of arrows and have to charge, believe me, ive faced maybe 4 kiters and each of them lost in the end.


Well thats about all i can think of, been sitting here for 30 mins so I hope some people out there can get some help from this, meanwhile im gunna get a drink....

See you on the Feudal Japanese Battlefield, young Samurai,
Good luck!
ManDurphies

[Ragga]

awesome write up... thanks!

[Nero Wulf]

Now that I read this, you can delete it, so no one else can see this

Great tips! Surprisingly I came up with a lot of the same tactics as you

[Niteshade_Runesoul]

Going to go ahead and bookmark this thread. Im very new to the TW experience , my only other experience being with medieval 2 and that was only picked up around back in december. The multiplayer features here are very appealing so I'm looking forward to getting a little Shogun 2 clan experience and checking it out a bit more. Great tips

[DeerHunter]

Devilmano you would have no chance with your 1st army you have no cav , I would just split my archers up and every time u charge near an archer move it away and fire on your infantry with the other archers , Game over a well balanced army will always win you just have infantry so anyone sensible would just keep there distance which would be easy to do due to your lack of cav

[Alexander_Paines]

pro tip: MORALE MORALE MORALE!!
Tis all about the morale!
NO point having fancy samurai's if they route at the sight of a swam of ashugaru!
My avatar is going COMPLETELY down the morale route, and the retainers i am using are to reduce the enemies morale. This means i can charge my ashagaru strait into the enemies lines, no matter what compositon, with general behind using rally, and i WILL win the fight.

[ManDurphies]

@DeerHunter,
Ive used the first army against well balanced armies many times and won, keep in mind this is only for small funds battles where you cant afford both quality and balance.

Believe me, my samurai can run far longer (due to my generals fatigue rresistance perk) than your archers can, ill just keep charging them, with my spearmen just behind to prevent your cav from flanking ill catch you eventually, and i think the strategy you were referring to is called kiting, and i touch on it briefly in there.

Im definitely not saying this strategy is foolproof, but for you to say it will NEVER work is ignorant, if you do own shogun 2, you probably havent faced a player doing this or if you did, his micro may have been low...

If you read closer i said give it a go, and if it doesnt work for you, go back to balanced armies, not "this strategy always wins and is infallible"

For any new players out there: This is not an unbeatable strategy, if you play it well you will win, if you play it bad you will lose, if the enemy is a better player you will lose etc. all i was saying is give it a go, as small funds places restrictions on what you strategies you can employ in-game.

[angelofwar12]

my best won so far, 2 yari cav defeated an entire army, don't quit until the end

his katana make short work of my puny ashigaru army, but he drop the ball and my cav made him pay dearly

[VersionLangley]

my best won so far, 2 yari cav defeated an entire army, don't quit until the end

his katana make short work of my puny ashigaru army, but he drop the ball and my cav made him pay dearly

Oh dear...bad memories are coming back!

[Run_Show]

Thats awsome thanks, im looking forward to useing your advice im just downloading the game now and thought id come check out this forum.

[Just4Fun]

I have to agre with deerhunter your first army would be at a disadvantage, and in my opinion whould not sugest to eney beginner to use this build as not only it requires micro i also se it not standing musch of a chance againts most players , and also this builds hole stratergy is based on only beting 1 type of army, what if your opponent took 2 bow cav instead of archers? , best thing i recon a biginer should do is take a balanced army get to no the units and builds ppl go and and when u get a better understanding try to mix ur army up to make it more flexible to counter rush builds and such a balanced build is a much safer bet and has a better chance on countering spams and rushes . besides that i think your other tips and observations are spot on.

[naro]

I've been experimenting with switching ashigaru over to the more expensive samurai troops in small sized battles. While i can agree that using weaker troops to provide mass is useful there are drawbacks too. The fragile morale of ashigaru as stated earlier are very prone to routing. However as long as you keep their flanks secure they hold the line usually long enough for your cav/samurai to break an opposing unit. Once one ashigaru unit breaks the whole line breaks and it cascades horribly for the losing side. I personally wouldnt bother taking more then 3 units of ashigaru simply because they are useful for the raw numbers (and as arrow fodder), however, anymore and you have trouble covering more units with your aura.

For example earlier today i took an army (small funds) using 3x yari ashigaru (1 at 1*), 2x samurai archers, 2x katana samurai and 1 unit of light cavalry. (+ general) against a larger army using 4ish loan sword ashigaru, 2x light cavalry and 3x yari samurai (+general using the archery tree). The fire arrow ability of the archers decimated his general unit (20ish down before he retreated). Then my spearmen held his cavalry (which had been trying to catch my archers on their own) while i quickly finished his general with a quick raid from my gen+light cav. While this was happening he was moving his troop all against my katana samurai. Once his first unit of loan swords broke the rest of his loan swords broke quickly and his yari samurais broke with a small pause after contemplating resisting but the morale shock of 4 ashigarus fleeing was just too much to hold on. - considering that cavalry were incoming into the rear of his troops and my ashigaru were also returning to re-enforce my flagging katana samurai.

Total kills about 400ish total, deaths in the region of 250 (most in the ashigaru who were hit by the initial cavalry charge(100ish)). So my point is while ashigaru can provide useful mass in the small battle size fights too many can cause a cascade failure of morale when fighting against higher teir troops when they are used with moderate skill.

[ManDurphies]

I see your point Just4Fun, it probably isnt the best beginner army, as it is fairly micro heavy and requires you to use your Yari Ashigaru effectively to counter enemy cav movements.

I dont know, it works out well for me, im just suggesting that they try it, but only on small funds, as with only 5000 funds its hard to choose a well balanced army that doesnt consist of all ashigaru, considering my general at the moment costs 1000, that makes it harder.

Horse archers probably wouldnt be too huge a deal honestly, 2 units of HA's cost 1400 which means they would have to sacrifice elsewhere, and they arent effective enough to influence the battle too much, sure they can cause more casualties than normal archers would, but the center of his army would break fast, than loose formation + forest = ineffective HA's, theres forests on every map i think so theres a good chance theres one close to where the battle will be fought.

If the enemy brought say 3 HA's and 3 Katana Sam as well as a Loan Sword ashigaru (this is assuming their general costs 0, and they have 5000 funds to start with), assuming that they sent the horse archers forward first to soften up my Katana Sam, then overwhelmed them with their own, this could work, however they would be severely weak to other cavalry posessing no spears in the build...
Small funds bring with it so many problems, it counts so much on army build rather than micro and tactics.

[Just4Fun]

yeah i totaly agree small founds do count so much on army builds thats why i tend to stick with a more safer balanced build slightly changed to what strat i think im going to go, example i might go a bit heavy on cav.

dont get me rong im all for going un balanced builds and do go them alot and catch my opoinent of guaurd and find these types of builds quite efective with decent micro.

[GenWolfe]

How do you get katana samurais... do you have to capture a province first?

[DeerHunter]

Mandurphies I know its only small armies but in your battle account you presume that your opponent will just stand therer and let your superior infantry just attack is, also why the hell would he just leave is archers to be attacked by yourself , like i said your army would easily be beaten if you want a lesson will gladly give you a lesson, played many armies like yours and beat them easily in this game and all the previouse TW games , The rest of the information on MP though is good so good post but dont think you have found some sort of miracle army

[Cecil XIX]

How do you get katana samurais... do you have to capture a province first?

Hold one province with a Sword Dojo.

[ManDurphies]

Miracle army? Where did I say that it was a miracle army or anything like that? All i said was that balanced armies arent the only way to go and to give an unbalanced one a go... Miracle army... pffft.
And i also didnt say that my opponent would leave his archers out front, i said my katana would make quick work of his front allowing me through to his archers... Did you even read it?

[StrongIsland]

So many new additions to the multiplayer part of Total War since last I played (Medieval 2). All these general upgrades and stuff are confusing, but thanks for the tips. Guess I'm gonna have to read the manual thoroughly!

[Aykis16]

Here's one tip from me for beginners: At the beginning, most of your armies are likely filled with ashigaru, so if after a battle one of your ashigaru becomes a veteran, I recommend putting the 1st skill point in Morale. As others have said before me, morale is key. As you gain experience and unlock more units, start reducing the number of ashigaru in your army. Right now I use only 3 bow ashigaru and 1 veteran Yari Ashigaru in my army with the rest being Cavalry and Yari/Katana Samurai and its been working well for me.

Speaking of morale, if you spot an opportunity to take out an enemy's general, go for it. Quite a few of my wins have been in battles where I've been losing, but was able to turn the tide by killing the opposing general. The bowman trait for your own general can be useful for this, especially if the enemy doesn't have it. Usually they keep their general close to their main army to provide the morale boost, so if your general has the bowmen, or if you have some archers hanging back, have them target the enemy general and if he falls or routs, it could turn the tide of battle in your favor.