[PASSED]Navajo Joe (Patron: cedric37)

**cedric37** · February 13, 2011, 12:01 PM

cedric37 Dear CdeC members,

I would like to present you an exemplary citizen in the person of Navajo Joe.
Navajo Joe emphasis the perfect citizen, honest, helpful and he is the kind of guy that keep the forums alive and friendly.
Not a great modder (well not a modder at all), his contributions are advising, beta-testing and participating in the life of TWC.
He is a famous not to say Key figure in the Stainless Steel forums and that explains why he made his way into the developpers'team.
I strongly suggest that you take random posts from NJ, and you'll find them being usefull.
Also i would like you to read 3 recommendation letters from some key figures of Stainless Steel: Meneth, Germanicu5 and Caesar Clivus.
We all know what those guys means to the TWC community.

Best regards,
Cédric.

Navajo Joe I joined the TWC Forum on 7th May 2008, at the time I was engrossed in an Apachean Tribes Campaign in MTW2 Kingdoms. I made a number of posts and then some kind sole pointed out about Stainless Steel. Initially I just read the threads and posted frequently asking questions.

Then I began to visit other parts of the forum and downloaded SPQR, Europa Barboreum and Roma Surrectum for RTW. I also downloaded Third Age, Broken Crescent and For King or Country. However Stainless Steel was my first love and I frequent this forum most of the time.

On the SS forum I watched posts from Caesar Clivus, Rozanov, Gracul & The Noble Lord to help people with problems and game mechanics. Eventually one day I took the step to answer a thread in the ‘Bugs Section’. Today I very regularly assist posters with their various technical issues.

I have made many friends thru the forum, but last year I offered Caesar Clivus my assistance to Beta Test Battle of the Baltic V2. He accepted my offer and released me a copy of the Beta. I was the sole Beta Tester and my main role was to test the new Swedish Faction, Savage AI, Hilltop Villages and various other tweaks. My feedback was by PM, sadly none of these survive to show you. This sub mod was released with very little bugs, much to Caesar Clivus dedication and skill, but also my commitment to thorough testing. In my opinion this is one of the best sub mods for SS and probably for MTW2.

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=323155

In the summer of 2010 Gracul requested assistance in the SS forum to Beta Test 6.3. I volunteered my services, which he kindly accepted and I became a member of the 6.3 Beta Test team. Sadly I did not get to test 6.3 very much, as I had significant problems with the launcher with my PC. However Gracul pointed out that my problems provided him important information on failures with launcher. I am now a member of the SS Development Team and have been involved with brainstorming and Beta Testing for 6.4. Here are some example threads:

Ancilliaries
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=416109

Cistercian Order
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=416249

Hilltop Villages
http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=412557

Letters of recommendation
From Meneth:

Originally Posted by Meneth

From the very first time I joined the SS forums Navajo Joe was there helping people. If he knew the answer to anyone's problem or question, he'd tell them, and if he didn't know he'd help them try figure it out.
Without him, the SS forums would be even more flooded in questions, bug reports, and complaints.

From Germanicu5:

Originally Posted by Germanicu5

To CdeC members,

I've been aware of Navajo Joe's presence on the forums since I joined them as he's always been expressing high level of professionality in posting improvement suggestions as well as knowledge of game's mechanics when answering other user's enquiries.
He's been a person that's always around to help less advanced users get a better grip of the game, maintaining high level of patience when dealing with these issues.
Personally I think he impersonates a type of a member that keeps forums alive after modders do their work, which would make him a great Citizen.

Regards

From Caesar Clivus:

Originally Posted by Caesar Clivus

Navajo Joe has contributed a lot to the Stainless Steel forums. He is one of the few forum members who regularly visits the SS Bug Reports forum to help solve other member's problems. He is always ready with solutions and advice for other forum members. NJ has also been an avid beta tester not only for SS itself but also for the makers of submods for SS. For a long time he has been a friendly face on the forums and his contributions make him a very strong candidate for citizenship.

-CC

**Jom** · February 13, 2011, 01:22 PM

One immediate problem is that I cannot view a single one of the "example threads".

**Leonidas The Lion** · February 13, 2011, 01:27 PM

Me neither, most likely in the dev forums methinks.

**Leonidas The Lion** · February 13, 2011, 01:46 PM

Received this pm from the Patron regarding the dev forum posts.

Originally Posted by cedric37

Hello,

Ok as you don't get access to SS dev forum, i'll paste you the contents here. Let me know if i can do something better to show you the threads.

Hilltop Villages:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

Cistercian order:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

Ancillaries:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

Sorry i can't do better than this

**Hesus de bodemloze** · February 13, 2011, 02:51 PM

So he beta tested some mods?

**Chlοë** · February 13, 2011, 03:54 PM

I think it's a very good application. Beta testing is extremely important and Navajo has done quite a bit of it.

**Nanny de Bodemloze** · February 13, 2011, 04:24 PM

I'm not familiar with Navajo Joe or his contributions, and I'll go digging, but almost every major mod has one or two "fans-turned-beta-tester-turned-tech-help" who are invaluable to the level of "customer service" for the mod, and the quality of the mod itself...this kind of work can take many hours, and a heck of alot of patience troubleshooting some of the weirdest user questions and problems, allowing the core modders to concentrate their time and efforts on what they do best. They are site contributors in my book. So that said, I'll start doing my homework on Navajo Joe...

Any moderation/infraction history?

**Belisarius** · February 13, 2011, 04:27 PM

Originally Posted by Nanny de Bodemloze

I'm not familiar with Navajo Joe or his contributions, and I'll go digging, but almost every major mod has one or two "fans-turned-beta-tester-turned-tech-help" who are invaluable to the level of "customer service" for the mod, and the quality of the mod itself...this kind of work can take many hours, and a heck of alot of patience troubleshooting some of the weirdest user questions and problems, allowing the core modders to concentrate their time and efforts on what they do best. They are site contributors in my book. So that said, I'll start doing my homework on Navajo Joe...

Any moderation/infraction history?

None

**Chlοë** · February 13, 2011, 04:31 PM

His moderation record is spotless.

**Jom** · February 14, 2011, 03:49 AM

I think Ishan will be able to tell us most about this candidate. However, just skimming through his posts, even on the first page about half of them are technical support telling people what they need to do in order to get the mod to work or that they've installed things incorrectly and how to fix it etc.

**Nanny de Bodemloze** · February 14, 2011, 08:02 AM

OK, after digging what I see in this applicant is someone who provides daily tech support for one of TWC's flagship mods, and does it in a very polite and patient fashion. And he's been doing this for a long time. This kind of service for a big mod is invaluable IMHO...it keeps people coming back, and users of the mod remain loyal in part because they know if they ever run into trouble, guys like Navajo are there to walk them through it without feeling silly or stupid. It is guys like this, no kidding, that brought me to TWC and kept me here in my first weeks.

On top of that, he is a regular supporter and cheerleader in some of the artistic and writing competitions, even though not a regular participant. Further demonstration of community spirit.

Mix in his beta testing work, and testimonials from a couple heavy-weights, I've seen enough. I'll be voting yes for his citizenship.

**Pontifex Maximus** · February 14, 2011, 08:47 AM

On the fence for this one. I'm going to look at the posts and see the context in which they were posted. I'm seeing a lot of one liners.

**Hesus de bodemloze** · February 14, 2011, 10:55 AM

I cant help it but for me beta testing is at the same level as participating in one of the RPG's.

**Chlοë** · February 14, 2011, 03:05 PM

I think Squid brings up some good points in the Commentary thread regarding beta testing. Nanny makes them too. In short, I agree with my fellow Koreans. \O/

**Jom** · February 14, 2011, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by Legio

I think Squid brings up some good points in the Commentary thread regarding beta testing. Nanny makes them too. In short, I agree with my fellow Koreans. \O/

I'd rather these points were re-made in this thread just for ease of reference for anyone looking back over this application.

**Ishan** · February 14, 2011, 03:23 PM

In my book beta-testing is a big deal as i know a modder can't think like a player and vice versa.
About NJ he is a very good beta tester, he rips the mod inside out and reports back bugs in a presentable manner and 90% of the times he knows where the error lies and why it's happening, this greatly reduces our task\time and we just need to go there and fix that thing without knowing what caused it in the first place.

Aside from beta testing he also assists the players in the bugs and technical forums knows how to read a error log file and what needs to be done etc and he is also a historical researcher in SS mod. Had made valuable suggestions which are now a part of SS, first thing comes in mind is the hilltop villages suggestion that he made should be in SS:-

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

He is an active SS dev member and i can't picture SS6.3 & 6.4 without it, gracul (mod leader) even praised about him to me during a PM conversation. Fixing of silver units(missing textures), Ghost units(improper comments in the 3d model), banners and what not it's a long list that he reported.

It looks like a small deal but it's intense really like testing of AI in game one has to spend hours on the PC to know how the AI is behaving in later parts of the game, Is it a fun spoiler for the player? Is it challenging enough? Or just buffed up to be annoying? A modder can't judge all that only a hardcore player can do it so there is no doubt the SS team is letting go of NJ.

He provided the same sets of contribution in the BftB mod.(CC's mod)
Hell i remember a couple of months ago he even bought a new PC just to try out 6.3 as it's graphically heavier than usual mods again showing the dedication as a team member and the trouble he had in arranging all the cash for it lol UK is expensive in electronic components.

Lastly comes attitude like legio says it's

, simply no doubt in that and he is mature poster and participates in other areas as well like Nanny pointed out.

So all in all it's a yes from me and i know after gaining citizenship he will show his positive attitude and maturity in the areas where only citizens are allowed to participate as well.

**Viking Prince** · February 14, 2011, 03:46 PM

This is a tough application for me to get a handle on. I agree that being a beta testor is important and worthy of consideration for citizen. It is not like playing an RPG, just as administering an RPG is not like playing an RPG. The reccomendations are a great push to help the applicant, but that is not a substitute for actual contributions. My problem is really the amount of a contribution we are looking at. From the application:

In the summer of 2010 Gracul requested assistance in the SS forum to Beta Test 6.3. I volunteered my services, which he kindly accepted and I became a member of the 6.3 Beta Test team. Sadly I did not get to test 6.3 very much, as I had significant problems with the launcher with my PC.

So for me the actual contributions are minimal until his work on 6.4:

I am now a member of the SS Development Team and have been involved with brainstorming and Beta Testing for 6.4.

I am inclined to suggest that until the beta testing is complete for 6.4, this remains a part of the dev team effort and not yet a contribution.

Thoughts????

**Nanny de Bodemloze** · February 14, 2011, 04:00 PM

I've considered the whole "released/is it not released" debate to be mostly hair splitting anyways...but SS is not some mod sitting in the back of someone's drawer being tweaked with no firm plan for release to the TWC community. So, for my money, beta testing for SS 6.4 is a legit current contribution.

**Viking Prince** · February 14, 2011, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Nanny de Bodemloze

I've considered the whole "released/is it not released" debate to be mostly hair splitting anyways...but SS is not some mod sitting in the back of someone's drawer being tweaked with no firm plan for release to the TWC community. So, for my money, beta testing for SS 6.4 is a legit current contribution.

Well it has been pointed out in the Curial Commentary thread:

Originally Posted by Meneth

@Navajo Joe's application/Viking Prince:
"I am inclined to suggest that until the beta testing is complete for 6.4, this remains a part of the dev team effort and not yet a contribution."
SS6.4 was released last month. Beta testing is complete.

So it is clearly a contribution. I am on the fence still. I need to do some more research.

**Saint Nicholas** · February 15, 2011, 03:05 AM

For me, the tech support and advice alone is enough for Citizenship. Helping people play the games we all love is very desirable and very generous. Experts that know their stuff and how to solve problems are far and few between. His post history is pages worth of helpful posts in the various tech helps forums. Couple all that with his beta testing gig and you've got yourself a very worthy candidate, at least in my book. He's got a great attitude as well. Clear yes.

View Poll Results: Shall he get citizenship?

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