Missile focus?

**a-woowie.doowie** · February 04, 2011, 03:43 PM

Hi, I'm playing with 1hp system, and I'm often using Syrian archers(4 - 6 units in a fullstack). When I use these on the battlefield, the AI usually sends out their missile/skirmishers first - these are however quite easy to deal with when it comes to syrian archers due to their long range. The problem for me however is to get them to switch target. When there are like 7-8 javelin-throwers in a unit then I seriously find it a waste for archers to keep fireing. But if I remove the "fire at will" and want to focus other units, they still choose to fire on the closest one, not the target I wish to soften up. And it's not low accuracy that is the problem, it's actually the lack of obedience which - more or less - forces them to fire at the closes unit(which very often, still is the skirmish unit). And given the fact that archers depleet fairly fast(which I think is good, not to be forgotten!), I'd want to cause maximum unit/moral damage available - not completly annihilating an already useless unit.

Is there anything that can be done about this? Or is it something which I just have to live with(no problem there)? I just think it would further improve this already well made mod - that's all.

**Pinkie Pie** · February 04, 2011, 03:48 PM

all units automatically attack the closest unit regardless of type or unit strength, you can get them to target another by left clicking on the archer unit then right clicking on the unit you want to attack
at least it should work

**Celestial Oblivion** · February 04, 2011, 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by a-woowie.doowie

Hi, I'm playing with 1hp system, and I'm often using Syrian archers(4 - 6 units in a fullstack). When I use these on the battlefield, the AI usually sends out their missile/skirmishers first - these are however quite easy to deal with when it comes to syrian archers due to their long range. The problem for me however is to get them to switch target. When there are like 7-8 javelin-throwers in a unit then I seriously find it a waste for archers to keep fireing. But if I remove the "fire at will" and want to focus other units, they still choose to fire on the closest one, not the target I wish to soften up. And it's not low accuracy that is the problem, it's actually the lack of obedience which - more or less - forces them to fire at the closes unit(which very often, still is the skirmish unit). And given the fact that archers depleet fairly fast(which I think is good, not to be forgotten!), I'd want to cause maximum unit/moral damage available - not completly annihilating an already useless unit.

Is there anything that can be done about this? Or is it something which I just have to live with(no problem there)? I just think it would further improve this already well made mod - that's all.

I've noticed the same thing with my Armenian horse archers, but it isn't that they won't change targets, its just it takes them a couple of vollies to do so. Also I'm not sure how a mod could even do that as it's an AI problem.

**Elvis** · February 04, 2011, 04:25 PM

My experience is that "fire at will" overrides manual targeting commands (just like "skirmish mode" overrides movement commands).
When "fire at will" is disabled, my archers usually react instantly if i assign them a different target to shoot at.

If that does not work, try using the "back" button to make them stop everything they are doing, then assign a new target.

**a-woowie.doowie** · February 04, 2011, 05:00 PM

@Martin616 Haha! Thanks for the tip, but I know how to micromanage them to that degree already.

This is what I meant with them not being obedient, since they simply refuse to switch to the clicked target.

@Celestial Oblivion

Then I guess I'll have to change target when they are down to about 30-40 units left, I'll try this and check if it works. P.S I really dislike horse archers, both to play against and with. They are too annoying for my taste, I prefer infantry battles with managing of melee cavalry.

@Elvis Thanks I'll try that too.

Thank you for your help, I'll see whether these tips works for me.

**Pinkie Pie** · February 04, 2011, 05:53 PM

im sorry i assumed it would be because of you because i have never encountered that problem
i have never used the syrian archers or armenian horse archers so it may effect only a few units

**nhinhonhinho** · February 05, 2011, 06:37 AM

The way to avoid it is bring more archers! Maybe 10 or more/stack. They will shoot down almost anything before the enemy can close in. If not. Make sure you have at least 5 good phalanx to deal with

**Elvis** · February 05, 2011, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by nhinhonhinho

The way to avoid it is bring more archers! Maybe 10 or more/stack. They will shoot down almost anything before the enemy can close in. If not. Make sure you have at least 5 good phalanx to deal with

Sadly thats not universaly viable option.
It might work in 1hp against badly armored foes, but not so well against the rest.
And it will not work at all when facing 2 enemy stacks in the same battle. Archers just don't carry enough arrows to deal with that.

If the enemy is romans or other factions with high-armor + large shield troops, 10 archers won't win the battle even on 1hp.
On the 2hp system, they will not make much of a dent in the enemy army before they close. And then half your army is a melee liability that needs constant babysitting and screening to not get murdered by anthing with a sword or spear and not shoot your own units in the back.

Ofc, could go skirmishing across the map, warding of cav with your own. But i find that far too tedious and annoying against the AI.

Personally i go with 2-4 archers per stack, just to have something to drive off skirmish cav (the joys of stupid AI not using cantabrian) and shoot at certain vulnerable targets.

**Lord Fred** · February 05, 2011, 09:09 AM

Another issue you may be having is that if you group units they don't tend to listen to you. It is a bug from vanilla.

**a-woowie.doowie** · February 05, 2011, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by Lord Fred

Another issue you may be having is that if you group units they don't tend to listen to you. It is a bug from vanilla.

Is that so? Because I always group my units. It's a habit from Age of Empires 2.

**Elvis** · February 05, 2011, 10:50 AM

Originally Posted by a-woowie.doowie

Is that so? Because I always group my units. It's a habit from Age of Empires 2.

Not sure about the targeting issue, but i know that grouping messes up formation. It can cause the units in the same group to run in opposite directions and stuff like that. I never use grouping for that reason.

**nhinhonhinho** · February 06, 2011, 06:46 AM

The number and type of missile troops depend on your situation

With 2 Hp or fighting again heavy infantry it's better to replace archers with javelin arms unit like Thureophoroi, Thorakitai. I personally prefer thureophoroi than thorakitai because they have more javelin and their range are enough to wear down javelin cavalry. They also a good support troops

Fighting again HA base army. The more archer you have the more easier