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Thread: Hyrule: Total War - Link to Subforums in First Post

  1. #2501
    PaulH's Avatar Hastatas Prior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    I suppose all I can say to that is:

    It seems to be a staple of Zelda games to have moronic looking characters. Whether it is the snot-boy from Wind Waker or the Mailman from Twilight Princess, there is always a moron of a character out there :p


    Oh, and btw, regarding the Fairies... I do hope you take serious consideration of the unit ideas and the suggestion for the campaign layout. But also, I hope you take serious consideration of the unit names, as I did a lot of research to give each and every Fairy unit a name which corresponds with a Fairy from Mythology and think that such names will give the units more character.

    I will do the Twili soon, who I'm thinking shall be getting somewhat of a large overhaul of your current unit list.

  2. #2502
    UndyingNephalim's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    @PaulH
    Generally there's always been a "moronic" character or two in almost every Zelda game. As far back as Majora's Mask we have Tingle. However I point out that these were exceptions among a believable cast in the games before Windwaker, rather then the case being the other way around. Maybe it's just me but I find it hard to take many characters seriously in more recent Zelda games.

    I suppose I should leave this link here: http://zeldawiki.org/The_Legend_of_Z...%27s_Menagerie .Some of the history of the Fairies and the mythology around them was presented when I made that, and I just more or less want to point out that for years I already have had lots of backstory and culture for all these races well developed. It's more or less my defense if I don't quite stick with the same names.

  3. #2503
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    I just feel the series has failed to really evolve and grow up.[/SPOILER]
    See, this is the problem I think. The term I use to describe this is "You grew up with X, so X should grow up with you."
    Best example: Transformers. In the 80's, kids would rush home after school to watch Tranformers G1. 30 years later, those same kids are now raging online about how the series is too childish. They claim that Hasbro should be making G1 homages and focusing on releasing Collector's toys instead of pushing child-based reboots. Thing is, G1 was aimed at kids, but the fan's want to keep the series for themselves, so they think the series should age at the same rate as them.

    As a fantasy fan, you enjoyed Zelda when you were younger. But as you got older and more mature, you noticed the cracks in the series, and moved on to Elder Scrolls and other fantasies that suit your age. But as I said above, you want the series to mature with you. Yes, Zelda has alot of potential to be dark and realistic, but that is not what it is. There Will be Brawl proved the Super Smash Bros. series was awesome as a dark noir detective story, but that doesn't mean Nintendo should do that to it.

    As for the Wind Waker goofball syndrome: In OoT, people actually knew what was going on, Ganondorf openly conquered Hyrule and subjugated them. In WW, all the islanders know is that a giant bird is kidnapping girls and there is a shady looking fortress somewhere in the sea. They simply assume it is happening far away, and doesn't concern them. When Aryll is kidnapped, her family reacts realisticly, when Valoo is acting up, his worshipper's react realisticly, but why should a bunch of simple village folk be concerned about far-off happenings?

    Once again, my post is too long, and I apologize, I just feel the need to get my opinion in.

  4. #2504
    UndyingNephalim's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by WEBwarrior094 View Post
    "You grew up with X, so X should grow up with you."
    Pretty much sums up my opinion. Hence why I'm making this game.


    Quote Originally Posted by WEBwarrior094 View Post
    As for the Wind Waker goofball syndrome: In OoT, people actually knew what was going on, Ganondorf openly conquered Hyrule and subjugated them. In WW, all the islanders know is that a giant bird is kidnapping girls and there is a shady looking fortress somewhere in the sea. They simply assume it is happening far away, and doesn't concern them. When Aryll is kidnapped, her family reacts realisticly, when Valoo is acting up, his worshipper's react realisticly, but why should a bunch of simple village folk be concerned about far-off happenings?

    And hence why I rarely bash Windwaker, because it's not really that bad of a case. Spirit Tracks holds the crown for that. Even Princess Zelda makes light of her apparent death and it just completely kills the mood. I could list dozens of other examples in that game alone.

  5. #2505
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    @webwarrior094

    Interesting philosophy. Also;

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulH View Post
    Due to UndyingNephalim's speed at making models and my own delayed writing, I have decided to jump ahead of the “finished” factions and focus instead upon two factions that I am deeply fond of -before- they are started. This is in the hope that my ideas will be given serious thought, and hopefully be implemented, especially at this stage where it will be easier for Neph to do so. The two factions which I am fond of, are the Fairies of Tarm (some may have seen my unit list in the past for them) and the Forces of Twilight, and people may remember that I fought quite hard to get them implemented. Due to the Fairies being next after Lizalfos and Labyrnna, I feel they would be the better of the two to start with.


    Due to the fact that the Fairies of Tarm have not been included in the mod as of yet, and that we only have a list of units and a short piece of lore behind the faction's actions, we are pretty much given free reign to prod about the unit list. Which frankly, suits me just fine. Below, I shall write a list of my perceived strengths and weaknesses of the Fairy faction, before attempting to write my own list.



    • Behind Wizzrobes, they are the strongest magic user in the game, giving them a strong basis in magic.
    • Fast moving army
    • Free Upkeep on units, and many units are very cheap to field.
    • Massive forces.
    They also happen to have negatives, which would be best shown laid out in a similar fashion.




    • Not heavily armoured, and low health
    • Low morale in small fairy units
    • Lack Durability
    • Rubbish at siege warfare

    My vision of the Fairies of Tarm is that the greater whole of their forces are huge units of small fairies, surrounding larger creatures, fairies and monsters which are allying with the Fairies. I view their race as quick moving, powerful from afar but easily cut down in melee. Due to the fact that we do not really have much of a unit list to work from, I shall spare everyone from having to look at the EUL, and instead jump straight into showing the current units laid out by Neph's unit list so far, and after that I shall detail my own suggestions for a unit list.


    • Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
      Tarminian Worshippers
      - Pink Faries
      - Green Fairies
      - Violet Fairies
      - Humanoid Manifest
      - Giant Manifest
      - Great Faries
      - Phantoms of Tarm

      - Tarm
      - Navi
      - Dezaia
    Though it is not immediately apparent what the roles these units would have are, you can get some idea of the direction that Neph is going with them. The Fairies are accompanied by worshippers from Tarm who help bolster their forces and likely are “cannon fodder”, amongst these are the normal Pink/Green/Violet fairies which are the main bulk of the army and with those are the larger units such as the Giant Manifest which I can only assume is a Giant or Gigantic Fairy. It sort of flows along with my own ideas regarding the faction, which is good as I want my force to be in line with Neph's vision but be my own as well.


    Instead of fitting those listed units into categories of which I cannot be sure, I am instead going to bypass my using section titled “Current [Insert Faction] Unit List” and jump to my own.




    My Fairies of Tarm Unit List:


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Light Infantry

    • Worshippers (Tarminian)
    • Spryte Darters (Tiny Fairy)
    • Will-'o'-The Wisps (Tiny Fairy)
    • Cloudscrapers (Tarminian)
    Heavy Infantry


    • Sundancers (Tarminian)
    • Nymphs (Humanoid Fairy)
    • Banshees (Humanoid Fairy)
    • Faeids (Half-Fairy)
    • Korrigan (Humanoid Fairy)
    • Glaistig (Humanoid Fairy)
    Light Cavalry


    • Fairies of the Gales (Hidden Fairy)
    • Moonchasers (Tarminian)
    Heavy Cavalry


    • Veela (Large Fairy)
    • Golems of Tarm (Golem)
    • Eastern Jade Giants (Golem)
    Missile


    • Pixies (Tiny Fairy)
    • Slyphs (Humanoid Fairy)
    • Fairy Queens (Large Fairy)
    Artillery


    • Starcallers (Tarminian)
    Heroes


    • Queen of Fairies (Fairy)



    From the list I have added 3 Light Infantry unit (and renamed 1), 5 Heavy Infantry units (and renamed 2), 1 Light Cavalry unit, 1 Heavy Cavalry unit (and renamed 1), 2 Missile units, and 1 Artillery unit. I will readily admit that this one was tough to get ideas for, that is why most of the units are merely expanding previous units to have more than one incarnation (for example, the list now has weak-average-strong monk units to pick from). I do believe I have at least added some much needed progression, but I will readily admit that there is a long way to go, and others may have more or better ideas than I.


    Unit Descriptions:


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Worshippers (Tarminian)

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    When Tarm fell from the sky, the impact was hailed as a sign from the Goddesses by the native and somewhat primitive peoples of the north-eastern lands of Hyrule, causing many of them to travel to the impact site and bare witness to their divine message. Instead, they came across ruins of great splendour and a race of tiny beings of beauty which inhabited them, gazing upon them with wonder. The fairies on the other hand, took to moving through the congregated people, healing any ailments that they could find. Wonder soon turned to worship, and the primitives took to settling the lands around the Ruins and treating them as sacred ground. Even to this day, there are many Tarminians who worship the Fairies.

    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • These are essentially primitive Humans/Hylians who are basically the Hyrule Total War equivalent of Peasants. A Throw-away unit there primarily to use to carry siege weapons or for other less than savoury jobs.



    Spryte Darters (Tiny Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The majority of the Fairy population takes the form of what appears to be tiny lights with wings attached, when in truth they take the appearance of attractive but absolutely tiny woman akin to a Hylian. These tiny women happen to travel at incredible speeds, and are known for their incessant pestering in battle and as a companion. Of all the fairy subspecies treated poorly, these were the most common amongst them, often caged inside bottles for instant wound recovery by larger "friends". Since returning to Tarm, these Sprytes have rallied against their oppressors and now flutter ready to combat them at any and all chances.


    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • Fast moving
    • Huge unit size
    • Weak Melee Attacks
    • Low health but difficult to hit



    Will-'o'-The-Wisps (Tiny Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    In the lands surrounding Death Mountain and the other volcanic regions of Hyrule, a subspecies of Fairy settled and adapted to the heated conditions in which they had chosen as their home. The potent Fairies adapted their magic to take on the spark of fire and gleefully reigned in their secret Fountains of Power. Even these mountain homes brought misery to the lesser species of Fairy, often from the accidental bombing of their fountain homes by clumsy Goron farming techniques.


    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • Capable of firing a small number of flames at the enemy over a small distance. Comparable to javelins. 4-5 launches of fire, I expect.



    Cloudscrapers (Tarminian)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The people of Tarm have grown to adapt their religion to feature heavily in the Sun, Moon, Sky and anything that travels up on high. This is due to the Ruins of Tarm seemingly dropping from the sky, and the winged nature of the Fairies they worship so fiercely. When it comes to war, the Tarminian's have grown to adopt names which are reminiscent of those places they have deified, and amongst those are the Cloudscrapers. These Tarminians are equipped with huge pikes which “scrape the clouds”, and carry hide shields, although they are only lightly armoured these Cloudscrapers are regimented unlike most of the Tarminian forces; an adaptation to foreign threats.

    Special Abilities = Shield Wall
    Notes

    • Basically a Hoplite Regiment, but not too tough. I suppose if this was Roman Total War, their equivalent would be Militia Hoplites.



    Sundancers (Tarminian)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Chief of the celestial objects that are worshipped by the Tarminians is the Fiery Orb in the sky known as the Sun. Much time has been devoted to this life-giving orb, songs of worship and dances of praise, one of these being a war-dance. The Sundancers practice their dances both with and without weaponry, their motions easily translating from worship to conflict with the littlest of adaptations necessary. Often these are armed with two weapons, and are covered from head to toe in heavy tattooing.

    Special Abilities = Warcry
    Notes

    • This is the spiritual successor unit to the Worshippers, and is another unit of Tarminians rather than Fairies.
    • These are barely armoured at all
    • Fight with two weapons and are pretty deadly once they actually reach combat.


    Nymphs (Humanoid Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Despite their name suggesting otherwise, the Nymphs are a force of Great Fairies that have equipped themselves ready for the wars that are slaying their cousins. Unlike most, these Fairies have long since realised that they cannot hope to survive without learning how to fight against their foes in melee combat. These warrior Fairies are armoured and carry axes to battle, yet they have sacrificed much of their magical talents in order to pursue their martial skills.


    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • Fast unit
    • Spiritual successor to the Spryte Darters but with much smaller units
    • Good morale
    • Good all round unit that'll be core to Fairy forces.



    Banshees (Humanoid Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Not all lands held Fairies in any sort of regard that was positive, those who settled in the south near to the lands of Moblins became known for their presence at the sites of death. This was mostly due to Fairies having a complete disdain for those who would kill and ravage a land purely for something to do. Instead of healing the sick these large Fairies would mask their ethereal beauty and stalk those who would bring suffering to others, leaving their corpses on display to attempt to teach others a lesson. Often these victims would be incapacitated by the unnatural screams which would pass their lips.

    Special Abilities = Chant
    Notes

    • If I was to class these as any unit in any Total War game, they would be reminiscent of Hastati or Principes. My view is that these are not regimented, but scattered like the smaller fairies, but act similar to those two units I mentioned.
    • Prior to combat, they use a magical scream to strike their foes before melee combat is initiated. The scream would essentially be like the javelins that Hastati use.
    • Good morale, but perhaps would not be too fast moving due to their disguises.



    Faeids (Half-Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    There are many tales of the origins of the Faeids of Tarm; some say that they are the descendants of marriages between Great Fairies and Tarm tribal leaders, others say that they are daughters offered to the Fairies for a sacrifice who instead were granted a metamorphosis by the Fairies into something resembling them. Whatever their history, the Faeids now ready themselves for war with Pikes, armour and shields.

    Special Abilities = Shield Wall
    Notes

    • Spiritual successor to the Cloudscrapers, acts as a Hoplite unit.
    • I imagine them as very beautiful Humans, rather than Fairies. Whether or not you want half-grown wings on them is entirely up to you.



    Korrigan (Humanoid Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The Korrigan are Great Fairies liken to the Sylph who stand at the height of a Human, but are affected deeply by the great tragedies of the mistreatment of their kind. Mistreatment, war and worse have come to these once beautiful Fairy women, having suffered and survived some of the more horrific things that they can bring. They have witnessed the desecration of their sacred Fountains, their wings have been rendered useless or pulled off entirely, and now bay for the blood of the mortals responsible. Once helpful, these women are now temptresses of their enemies demise, masking their ruined beauty with illusions.


    Special Abilities = Fear inducing
    Notes

    • The most powerful of the standard units of Fairy kind, though obviously weaker than the specialist units such as Fairy Queens.
    • Very high morale.
    • Heavily armoured, armed with 2-handed blades. Their appearance should be midway between shocking and alluring.
    • Formed in ranks



    Glaistig (Humanoid Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Along the great rivers of Hyrule there were Fairies known as Glaistig who ruled beneath the water or upon the banks. Often dressed in emerald and with flowing orange hair, these unusual fairies had an uncommon bond with the water, able to make it bend to their will. Like water, they could be both soothing and violent, and often did they take the more vicious approach to tainters of the water. With war brewing, many have left their watery homes and have equipped themselves for the coming war.

    Special Abilities = Unknown
    Notes

    • I believe the Glaistig would be armoured in cast-offs of the Zora and Lanaryu factions gear.
    • They would have a ranged attack which would in effect, be whipping their foe with a stream of water. 3-4 uses.
    • I imagine them armed with weapons of the Zora or Lanaryu factions for melee fighting. My view is of them as a Principes equivalent.




    Fairies of the Gales (Hidden Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The smaller subspecies of Fairy have ended up embedded in numerous containers over the years, yet few are as unusual as the container kept for the Faery of Gales. These Fairies have chosen to become embedded into the heart of a Boomerang, usually with the intended purpose of aiding a hero in their fight against darkness, but alas now being used in war against the mortals who threaten their kind. The metallic boomerangs become dangerous weapons in their tiny hands.


    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • Despite looking like Boomerangs, these are melee units. They do not hit strongly, but are rapid attackers.
    • Fastest unit of this unit list, perfect for charging into a foe and immediately leaving to cause maximum damage at least cost.
    • High Armour, little health.
    • Strong Morale.


    Moonchasers (Tarminian)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Across the many Human and Hylian realms there seems to be a constant with them when it comes to warfare, one which repeats itself in each territory though is often used in different manners, the use of the Horse. Near to the ruins of Tarm were huge fields of grass where herds of wild Horses roam free, yet when the ruins first landed there were some Horses that were near to the crash site and were changed forever by it. As the fairies emerged into the new world their city had crashed into, Horses with a somewhat supernatural appearance appeared alongside them. These were swift on their feet, but hugely temperamental, and over the years the Tarminian's have slowly tamed them as mounts for combat.

    Special Abilities = No idea
    Notes

    • It's a poor description, I know, but my view of the Moonchasers are of them being a javelin throwing cavalry unit.
    • Fast moving
    • Low armour



    Veela (Large Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The Veela are Great Fairies who took to the skies and travelled far and wide upon the wind currents, often setting up home within the hearts of Storm Clouds. Similar to the Will-O'-The-Wisps, these Fairies adapted to their chosen home and adjusted their magic to suit the lightning infested home. Of all the subspecies of Fairy, the Veela have been least affected by mortal hands, though they have taken considerable lengths to attempt to halt Labrynna's technology from polluting the skies.


    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • Very swift unit, can move and shoot.
    • Weak Melee attacks.
    • Medium ranged lightning.
    • Low armour.



    Golems of Tarm (Golem)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The ruins of Tarm are home to many artefacts and treasures of the rare and powerful qualities, often ones which are sought after by adventurers and thieves alike. In order to protect their treasures from the outside world, the Queen of Fairies began turning the rubble of the City into Golems who would patrol the ruined streets for intruders. With war coming, these Golems now have taken to the battlefield.

    Special Abilities = Unknown
    Notes

    • Small Unit Size
    • High Health
    • High Armour
    • Slow attacks and movement
    • A tank unit of sorts, draws in the enemy to surround them and attempt to take them down. Thus allowing the smaller, swifter units to sweep into their sides and attempt to rout the enemy.



    Eastern Jade Giants (Golem)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The Jade Mountains reside far to the East in the uncharted lands beyond Tarm and Labrynna, uncharted at least to the mortal races of the world. The Fairies of Tarm did not only spread to the west when they landed, but also the east, and it is there that the Fairies discovered the unusual properties of the mountains there. They hew the Jade from the mountains, carving out the faces of Giants into the mountain walls and sparking life into their stone hearts. As the Fairies have rallied to defend themselves and ready for war, these Jade Giants have been making their ponderous journey to the west to aid their creators in battle.

    Special Abilities = Unknown
    Notes

    • 3-5 men in a unit
    • Obviously very tough units, and very powerful. I am thinking they are probably the most expensive unit in the list.
    • Slow moving
    • My design for them would be having them being somewhat alien but with a humanoid appearance. I would see them made of jade, but with celtic symbols carved into their bodies.



    Pixies (Tiny Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The Fairies that remained behind in the Ruins of Tarm are amongst the more potent of this magical and strange species. Though they possess the tiny appearance shared by Spryte Darters and Will-O'-The-Wisps, their power is of a greater magnitude. However, unlike their cousins they are not accustomed to the rigours of war and evil and as such can be a liability in combat. Yet their talents lie in bolstering their allies potential, and pelting the enemy from afar with arcane spellcraft.


    Special Abilities = Chant
    Notes

    • Massive unit size
    • Fast moving
    • Low morale
    • Long ranged magical missiles but low accuracy
    • Low health but difficult to hit



    Slyphs (Humanoid Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The tiny Fairies which appear as balls of light are not the only subspecies of Fairy, there are others of a much grander height who are far less common than their smaller cousins. These tend to stand just slightly smaller than that of the typical Hylian or Human woman, and have the appearance of teenage girls wearing little clothing upon their forms. Once upon a time, they would gift their heroic visitors with a Bow imbued with their magic, but now they use those arms against those who were once considered friends.

    Special Abilities = Fire/Ice/Light arrows as a special ability, whichever you prefer
    Notes

    • Weak Melee Attack
    • Low Armour and Health
    • Based upon my concept of a Fairy Warrior but without the spear and less armour. Instead I could imagine them bearing war paint upon their torso's and arms.



    Fairy Queens (Large Fairy)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Rarer than the Great Fairies are the Fairy Queens, who essentially rule over their shorter and less powerful cousins. Usually only one of these Queens will reside in a Fountain, surrounded by those who serve her every need. However in these times of great uncertainty, these Queens have had to abandon their Fountains and join with their sisters in order to combat the threats that lay ahead. Their strength lays not only with their vast skills of magic, but also that of melee as well.


    Special Abilities = Unsure
    Notes

    • Tiny units, probably 3-5 in a unit.
    • Exceptionally powerful ranged attacks, probably better to class them as siege attacks.
    • Capable in melee.
    • High health, morale and "armour".



    Starcallers (Tarminian)


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Tarm was an advanced city before it crashed into the lands that make up the world of Hyrule, although its technology was based purely upon magical means. Amongst the ruins were discovered the “Starcallers”, ancient devices made of mirrors which reflected and condensed star-light into a beam of energy to sweep across enemy forces. The Fairies rarely go near them, but the Tarminians have taken to using these ancient weapons of war.

    Special Abilities = None
    Notes

    • I suppose you could think of this like a somewhat alien Beamos on wheels.
    • Would only have 2 machines in the unit.


    Queen of Fairies


    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Despite her diminutive size and childlike nature, the Queen of Fairies is without a shadow of a doubt the single most powerful Fairy of known existence. She holds her court within the Ruins of Tarm, and surrounds herself with what can only be described as puppet versions of the Fairy Queens she rules under. It is highly rare that she comes to the field of battle, but when she does there are few survivors.

    Special Abilities = No idea
    Notes


    • Based upon the visual image of the Queen of Fairies from The Wind Waker, and the fact that she carries a doll of a Great Fairy. I love the thought of her child-like nature causing her to make these dolls or puppets in order to aid her. I expect the puppets would take the appearance of Wind Waker's Great Fairies.
    • Powerful spells with long range, no doubt.
    • Weak in melee.



    Although normally at this point I would then reel off a list of Temple Specific units, I am going to leave these out and work upon ideas for them at a later date, and instead discuss quickly as to how to incorporate these units for campaign purposes. Neph has said before about how the Fairies can recuperate losses quickly due to many of their units being almost like mercenaries. So I will quickly lay out which units can be gained and how:



    • Units that are free and treated like Mercenaries = Spryte Darters, Will-'o'-the-Wisps, and Pixies

    • Most Tarminian Units would be able to be gained early on in the campaign, would be cheap and take probably 2 turns to build.

    • The Humanoid and Half-Fairy units would be gain-able after upgrading the religious building to a certain level, thus crippling development of stronger forces for the Fairies until later in the game. This would make them rely upon the free units more.

    • Huge Fairies can only be produced in lands which have a Fountain or Temple in them.

    • Golem units are built near end-game.

    • All units except Tarminians and the free ones, would be expensive to build and maintain.

    Well, there you have it. My next faction will be the Twili.




    Previous Updated Unit Lists:


    Kingdom of Hyrule - http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...10#post9771010
    The Gerudo - http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...7#post10189307
    The Gorons - http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...9#post10267719


    You really don't have to apologize for posts as long as yours compared to this. I am fairly certain I've seen longer posts.
    "You know, for you, I guess that might have been something. Bunch of goblins come out of nowhere trying to give you a welcoming gift of stabby death, Ted crashing a building, me delivering electric death to all of the above.....don't worry, though. You'll get used to it. I mean, look at me; this is just tuesday to me now."

    ".....But it's monday...."

    "Well, yes. Ted crashed the building earlier than he usually does."

    -Damien Arn, angry SOB, chatting with the new guy.

    From a sprite comic I might never actually publish anywhere.

  6. #2506
    Ikko-Ikki
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by FFfanboyX View Post
    @webwarrior094

    Interesting philosophy. Also;

    You really don't have to apologize for posts as long as yours compared to this. I am fairly certain I've seen longer posts.
    But at least that post had relevance to the game and the forum, I'm just spamming Neph with rants, it's not really the same.

    Also, @Neph: I completely support your creating this game, I love seeing dark/gritty-fied fangames. My problem is with complaining that the official material isn't like your work.

  7. #2507
    PaulH's Avatar Hastatas Prior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    @PaulH
    I suppose I should leave this link here: http://zeldawiki.org/The_Legend_of_Z...%27s_Menagerie .Some of the history of the Fairies and the mythology around them was presented when I made that, and I just more or less want to point out that for years I already have had lots of backstory and culture for all these races well developed. It's more or less my defense if I don't quite stick with the same names.
    This harks straight back to my post about being fluid and adapting to editting your mod to fit beyond your own viewpoints of how it should be, and embracing the efforts put into furthering and improving the mod by other people. Remember, at the end of the day, this is a Hyrule Total War mod and not a Time Menagerie mod. It is impressive what you have done, so do not feel I am disrespecting you, but you have to be willing to adapt or your mod will not only fall short but will also not be a fair representation of the source material.

    I do want to point out that I am still impressed by what has been achieved, but as someone with a lot of mod leading experience, I am truly trying my best to help with advice and to help make this mod as good as it can be. And when it comes to a world celebrated by many fans, you can only do it justice by embracing the different views of it rather than purely the one established in your fan fiction. I also want to point out that I am a fan of fan fiction, I myself put a lot of effort once into establishing a good story for a Pokemon themed fan fiction which was going to be made into an emulation, so I know how easy it is to become tied to your own vision of a world rather than embracing the actual vision of it.

    At the end of the day I'm merely trying to help, and though I am not modelling or texturing, I am pouring alot of effort into expanding unit lists to better work and trying to establish canon to suit the world. I am hoping my efforts will not go to waste, but sometimes I worry that it might.

  8. #2508
    Ethereal Lancer 916's Avatar Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    ...
    Homeguards:

    The main police and law force of Labrynna, Homeguards are found in virtually every city of the Regime. Armed with a heavy pole-arm and shield, they are effective crowd control during both civil unrest and during war time on the battlefield.


    Hey hey hey, this is good. The big whacking stick is an interesting concept, essentially a giant mace, no? Thing is, now I really see a late-era upgrade of these guys with halberds, too.
    ...
    So, what exactly ARE the Pioneers going to be, cavalry perhaps? Perhaps a Mounted/Dismounted version of them with lancea? (I know, can't seem to let the pike thing go for now, sorry.)(Also the 'misspelling of 'lances' was intentional, 'tis Latin) I noticed the lack of Labrynnian cavalry before (except perhaps those Knights of Ambi), but it only really just hit me ^_^'

  9. #2509
    UndyingNephalim's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    @WEBwarrior094
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    I understand complaining can be annoying, but I'm not just going to lie and say I think these recent Zelda games are gold when people ask why I do things or what my opinion is. If someone asks "Why are you choosing this style of art over the Toon games?" I'm going to be honest and say it's because I don't like the Toon style at all and it just makes it too hard for me to take the material seriously. Generally my complaints are tied with people asking the questions of me and the complaints are my answer, I'll rarely just go out of my way to rant for the sake of ranting unless of course I see something really funny that I just can't hold in and have to share. I have to admit for whatever reason the Legend of Zelda is the only series where I can complain about something I dislike and tons of people seem offended by it. I can mentioned faults with Halo, Elder Scrolls, or pretty much any other game and people will at the very least understand it's just not my cup of tea. But no if I say even one bad thing about the choo-choo train I'm suddenly a heretic.


    @PaulH
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Do keep in mind that I have taken the ideas into consideration and that I have probably included more suggestions from you then most. I really don't want to come off the wrong way, but I do think it is evident at this point that my goal is not to appease every fan of Zelda. I want to appease how I personally have wanted the series to evolve, and I want to continue the storyline and mythos I established in my other Zelda games. I know a large amount of people do not share my point of view, but neither did people in regards to the new direction Star Trek took with Wrath of Khan and look at how well that turned out. Using the argument "you should appeal to as many fans as possible" probably will not work well with me. Rather proving the value of the idea in question (which you generally have done remarkably well with your very detailed rundowns of each faction you've done so far) will more often then not convince me to change something. If I just appealed to fans then we'd probably see derailed choo choo trains as a Hylian unit by now.


    @Ethereal Lancer 916
    Pioneers here! (Kudos to anyone who knows what RTS that line is from):
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    Pioneers:
    The military workforce of the Regime, Pioneers are found in virtually every Labrynnian army. Base builders, Supply Charters, and logistic support, Pioneers assure that any army is in top fighting condition and well maintained. On the battlefield they can set up barricades and other defensive barriers before the fight starts.




  10. #2510
    Duke Serkol's Avatar Princeps Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    ...shovel warriors?

    Okay that's... peculiar. I mean, I get what the shovel is chiefly for, but shouldn't they have some manner of proper weapon to defend themselves with? Even short knives?

    Still, I guess either way the player is supposed to assign other units to protect them, so it doesn't make that big a difference.

  11. #2511
    Ethereal Lancer 916's Avatar Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    I dunno, in WWI the weapon that got the most melee kills (whenever somebody actually MADE IT to the other trench line) was the trusty trench spade. Think about it, just sharpen the edges and you've got a frickin' glaive in your hands.

    Oh, and something that's bugged me for a while with the Hyrule faction... is the male Recruits, both mounted and foot. The female Recruits have a nice armoured neck-piece that covers the neck and above the chest. Males, however, have this spot bare. I've always kinda wondered why that is, any particular reason?
    Last edited by Ethereal Lancer 916; October 03, 2011 at 10:27 PM.

  12. #2512
    Duke Serkol's Avatar Princeps Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Hey Neph, I've been thinking about something... would you be adamantly opposed to changing the schedule for future factions?

    Because I really think it would be wise to move Ikana after the Wizzrobes and before the Oocca. Why? Skyward Sword.
    I know you are skeptical about the game, but there is a good chance it will reveal more about the Sky People as well as introduce at least one new race that might make a good addition to the mod. And the way I see it, the only two factions that could be booted out of the roster are either the Lanayru Zora (by integrating them with the regular Zora) or Ikana (since we already have the Stalfos).

    Therefore I think it would be a good idea to move the Ikana faction later on in the release schedule, so that if we do get a new and interesting race from Skyward Sword, you can decide which to include without having to scrap any of your hard work.
    Last edited by Duke Serkol; October 04, 2011 at 04:47 AM.

  13. #2513
    UndyingNephalim's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    @Ethereal Lancer 916
    A shovel is a surprisingly versatile weapon. It's no surprise it's the mandatory melee weapon of Green Berets in the U.S. military forces.

    I probably should give them some nice armor to protect those vulnerable necks shouldn't I?

    @Duke Serkol
    Naw I'm not opposed to that, as for a long time I actually have been considering removing Ikana from the game. Even though Ikana played a big role in my other Zelda games it was still more of a Termina feature even if the Kingdom briefly reappeared in Hyrule. I don't think I'll be removing the Lanayru Zora though since they've already been a main feature in many of my other Zelda media.

    For a sky based race like the Oocca I don't really think I'd ever make them a playable faction (not in the campaign anyway), the main problem being that it's sort of hard (pretty much impossible) to portray their cities and empire floating above the campaign map. It's safe to assume any new major race introduced in Skyward Sword will also probably be based largely on the sky (though I did see a really silly looking mole-like race introduced in the last demo. Possible Mole Mitts connection there? )

  14. #2514
    gaiachild's Avatar Pili Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by Duke Serkol View Post
    ...shovel warriors?

    Okay that's... peculiar. I mean, I get what the shovel is chiefly for, but shouldn't they have some manner of proper weapon to defend themselves with? Even short knives?

    Still, I guess either way the player is supposed to assign other units to protect them, so it doesn't make that big a difference.
    Don't underestimate the shovel! In the right hands, it is just as leathal as the average axe, hence why the shaolin monks have been using it as a weapon for centuries. And it defenitely doesn't stop there. A lot of agricultural instruments can, and have been used as weapons very effectively, and have given inspiration for more weapons only designed to kill. Like scythes or treshing flails. Personally, I'd rather face someone with a sword than a shovel, if at all. The shovel has more reach and is more likely to break bones on impact (unless it's a two handed sword of course).

    So respect to neph for bringing a usually overlooked tool of destruction to the battlefields. And judging by the description, can we expect the pioneers have the "wooden stakes" ability"? Or something like a mine field, if that is even possible with the TW engine?

  15. #2515
    Duke Serkol's Avatar Princeps Posterior
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    for a long time I actually have been considering removing Ikana from the game. Even though Ikana played a big role in my other Zelda games it was still more of a Termina feature
    Glad we agree, it's good to know we have a potential free slot still open.

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    For a sky based race like the Oocca I don't really think I'd ever make them a playable faction (not in the campaign anyway), the main problem being that it's sort of hard (pretty much impossible) to portray their cities and empire floating above the campaign map.
    Yeah, but either way, whatever you do with them, Skyward Sword could have a big influence on that faction (perhaps just by providing new units or, Goddesses willing, reveal the real masters behind the chickens).
    So it's good to keep them for last.

    Quote Originally Posted by UndyingNephalim View Post
    It's safe to assume any new major race introduced in Skyward Sword will also probably be based largely on the sky (though I did see a really silly looking mole-like race introduced in the last demo.
    Yeah, you never know

  16. #2516
    LordAmbler's Avatar Ashigaru
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Personally, I'd rather face someone with a sword than a shovel
    I'd rather not. Swords are given to well-trained people. Practicing Kendo myself, I know the skill a swordman has that a neophyte in martial art doesn't have. So yeah, shovel may kill, but a sword is a thousand time more dangerous.

    Other than that, I like the pioneers. I'm really appealed by the progress Labrynna stands for in Hyrule.

  17. #2517
    DarkReborn's Avatar Ashigaru
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    I like these guys, their uniforms alone cry "steampunk!". The color palette you're using for these is actually pretty good!

  18. #2518
    Ethereal Lancer 916's Avatar Aquilifer
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    Quote Originally Posted by gaiachild View Post
    So respect to neph for bringing a usually overlooked tool of destruction to the battlefields. And judging by the description, can we expect the pioneers have the "wooden stakes" ability"? Or something like a mine field, if that is even possible with the TW engine?
    Maybe, they did it for Napoleon, it may be possible to jury-rig something like that for M-II. I mean, come on, we've already got frickin Gohma and giant enemy crabs in the game, how much harder could it be to rig up a "do not pass" zone with explosives? Though, I primarily see the Pioneers as being able to construct low walls to provide cover for the musket-men against direct archer fire - with stakes in front of that for cavalry!

    Perhaps they could also take over hostile/abandoned siege engines if they get the chance, that would be cool!

    And, as to the potential free slot for the factions, why not make a second Twili faction - one with Zant as the leader, primarily populated with those corrupted creatures from Twilight Princess, and one led by Midna with proper rank-and-file Twili soldiers. There is a huge diversity of creatures in Hyrule - and many of them were corrupted by the Twilight into hybrid creatures - not to mention the Shadow Messengers and Kargoroks, twisted beings to match Zant's insanity. Meanwhile, Midna would undoubtedly prefer proper, trained soldiers such as the Lancers, with maybe some swordsmen and archers/mages/both for support. Make them hostile to eachother, and have one (The "Royal Twili" faction, led by Midna) be friendly to Hyrule while the other (The "Twili Usurper" faction, for Zant) is hostile to it.
    Last edited by Ethereal Lancer 916; October 04, 2011 at 11:13 AM.

  19. #2519
    Shugo560's Avatar Ishiyumi no shashu
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    i like the Labrynnians uniform idea!!!! it makes them look alot more modernized, an the look of a people who want to conquer, as ive seen they do alot on your campaign map ideas which were mabye from march XD

  20. #2520
    Extradaemon's Avatar Vexillifer
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    Default Re: Hyrule: Total War - Epic Legend of Zelda Warfare

    is that pioneer quote of yours from company of heroes? i think theyres a unit called pioneers for the germans and they say that wheres my kudos!!!! XD

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