Dual Alliances: Double Jeopardy Campaign

[pesto alla genovese]

MUST... SEE... CAMPAIGN.... MAP....

I'm just confused by the mechanics of how he ended up on a ship since I didn't have any near there.

Kalmar was rescued by King Knuds' army (NOT by its weak garrison, ofc). After defeat King Magnus and the rest of his troops retreated to a boat. That boat which you probably used to ship you main force - the army which now camps close to the shore between Lund and Kalmar. Then that boat was attacked by Danish navy, and retreated east.

Also, why are you so concerned? I mean King Magnus' army was really small. It actually looked like you deliberately sent them on this suicide mission to, supposedly, get rid of unwanted King and high-cost mercs.

[Nightbringer]

Ah, thats right,
in my memory I had sent that ship back north after unloading the army.
Ok, makes sense to me now. The way it worked in my memory there had been no ship for him to be on, meaning it would have had to have spawned somehow.

And no, I'm not really that worried. I had sent him there hoping your main army was out of reach. Ah well, gambit failed, when you're a filthy backstabber you have to be risky XD

[TriforceV]

-either you or Triforce is lying here. You said that you contacted all your allies (which includes Triforce ), and everyone was ok with that (attack on Denmark) and that you would have desisted if any of them would have spoken against it. Triforce says the he highly condemned this act.. who is to be believed?

Well to be honest I did receive information on the very turn of the Invasion from NB.
While its telling, its certainly not prior knowledge...
NB told me that he is/was going to attack the Danes with Norway and that it was a pre-emptive attack because he got word apparently that the Danes were going to attack.

I wasn't asked for approval, or given any evidence for this mind you,
France was after-all my ally and I trusted his actions as legitimate, Yet I never joined the war on his behalf or supported him privately or public. At the time I figured it was a personal war on his behalf. Furthermore, it made little difference to my war in Iberia and threaten nothing to that end.
It has since been proven simply a false flag incident, and as a result we condemn his actions, but are not willing to go to war with him now then we were prior.

But here again, this isn't what I'm talking about in terms of difference.
This is what I mean by difference, or more specifically WHY I am threatening war with the HRE:

1. France is my Ally, HRE isn't.
While I may not support either war, I do not break alliances simply because my ally declares war on a nation that concerns me very little.

2. France also promised to aid me against the Moors. Since his main kingdom France would not help in the war with the Danes, he promised to send troops towards Iberia - a promises he did keep.
HRE also promised he would send help, but unlike France he negated on his promise and instead used his army on his own fellow Christians.

3. HRE's action threaten Genoa.
Genoa who promised me a minimal amount of Help in the campaign against the Muslims, something he was in position to do. The Danes did not offer such help, nor were they in any position to help me.

4. HRE actions threaten to engulf, almost all of the Christian nations into war. dividing potential allies to the greater threat of Moorish Iberia. Danes failed to do this. Nobody stepped up for the Danes.
Had the HRE, Poland, Hungary and Genoa stepped up to France and threatened war for their actions, I might have joined on the bane wagon too in order to get France from avoiding an all out war....
But nobody did this, and I wasn't willing to go to war all by my self with my neighbor on his unjust war when I have my hands full in Iberia, It concerned me very little.

You see my reasons for not joining the War against the Danes, is also the same reason why I now threaten HRE with war in an attempt to persuade them from their actions.
I do not want a devided Europe, but to maintain a united one that is not at eachother's throats.

Why are having such a difficult time understanding the difference between these situations

[Nightbringer]

4. HRE actions threaten to engulf, almost all of the Christian nations into war. dividing potential allies to the greater threat of Moorish Iberia. Danes failed to do this. Nobody stepped up for the Danes.
Had the HRE, Poland, Hungary and Genoa stepped up to France and threatened war for their actions, I might have joined on the bane wagon too in order to get France from avoiding an all out war....
But nobody did this, and I wasn't willing to go to war all by my self with my neighbor on his unjust war when I have my hands full in Iberia, It concerned me very little.

THIS

This is exactly the difference. Nobody much cared that I was going to war with Denmark, or at least no one made that clear to me when I asked. Of course I was trying to portray it in such a way as to make people less likely to care, and as far as I could tell I succeeded in exactly that.

If a united front had come up and threatened war with me, I almost assuredly would have halted my invasion. I am not interested in seeing Europe divided, I am actually quite interested in seeing us unite. This will allow us to take on th larger eastern nations together. If we are divided like this they can easily sweep us away, especially considering their relative unity.

I did not see any reason to think invading Denmark would cause any division in Europe. Denmark is halfway out of Europe, and considering its pairing with Kiev I figured it would be more likely to side with an eastern alliance than a western one. Nobody made any indication to me that this would jeopardize the unity of Europe aside from taking Denmark out of that unity, which I figured was good because it would likely not take part in it anyway but would rather go the direction of Kiev.

As to the situation now, this completely divides Europe. While one side or the other may gain some territory from this, the Eastern nations will laugh their @$@es off as they grow in power, capture Iberia, and set up to crush whatever is leftover from this war.

[Thanatos Eclipse]

You know most of us nations in the East are still part of Europe. Although I'm probably only about 2/3

[Nightbringer]

I know, but it is the easiest way to put it in terms of this game.

[invicta]

Poland's next

[Askthepizzaguy]

http://www.sendspace.com/file/hlxe3y

Venice is up.


Let it be known to all that the Venetian Doge and the Hungarian rat are untrustworthy as well.

Watch you back around those. I'd recommend entering a state of war with those people immediately, because any piece of paper you sign with them is worthless.

[pesto alla genovese]

nvm

[invicta]

The words of Genoese Consul make no sense to the Venetian Doge.
When denmark was attacked, we promised them our support. Since we have no influence or power to
change the course of French king's actions, we have to rely on someone's else help.
Only 2 king had the power and were close enough to give a substantial help to our cause: English king and HRE emperor.
English King, replied to us, that although he condemned this action, he wouldn't jeopardize his alliance with France as he needed it to fight the Moors.
HRE emperor, seemed more willing to listen. He said he would intervene, but only if Venice can secure Genoese help to the cause (so that if the conflict
escalate to a bigger conflict, Genoa would stay on our side). I contacted the Genoese Consul immediately, and made aware of our plans to attack France and force
them to give back their lands to Denmark and reduce France power. France could have not resisted to us if we fight together and thus we would have found a peaceful solution
very quickly.
2 times I asked ,2 times Genoese Consul refused showed clearly where on which side he would have stood. He also approved the attack on Denmark when informed by the French king.
I can't say for certain, to which grade the Genoese politics has an hidden agenda with the French king or was simply blind foolishness. Certainly this politics not only was bringing to death
one of our precious ally, but would have made the barbaric and filthy French king even more powerful and certainly we may have become next victim, probably with the help of the Genoese.
If I didn't trust Genoa, I wouldn't even asked to join us revealing our plans. Venice behaved correctly until the end, it was your choice to stand with France, not ours.

Signed
the Venetian Doge

[tavix]

Sicily.

[Nightbringer]

Perhaps you should have expressed your unhappiness to France. That way the war might have simply ended without force. If told that military force was to be brought against us we likely would have canceled our attack, but as no one alerted us to their unhappiness we naturally assumed it was outside of anyone's interests.

[Core-i7-inside]

I couldn't download this site yesterday.
Dane up

[pesto alla genovese]

I couldn't download this site yesterday.

There are numerous file hostings out there just for the case.

Seljuks turn.

[-=KingXami=-]

Cumans Up

[Nightbringer]

hungary!

[Askthepizzaguy]

The words of Genoese Consul make no sense to the Venetian Doge.
When denmark was attacked, we promised them our support. Since we have no influence or power to
change the course of French king's actions, we have to rely on someone's else help.
Only 2 king had the power and were close enough to give a substantial help to our cause: English king and HRE emperor.
English King, replied to us, that although he condemned this action, he wouldn't jeopardize his alliance with France as he needed it to fight the Moors.
HRE emperor, seemed more willing to listen. He said he would intervene, but only if Venice can secure Genoese help to the cause (so that if the conflict
escalate to a bigger conflict, Genoa would stay on our side). I contacted the Genoese Consul immediately, and made aware of our plans to attack France and force
them to give back their lands to Denmark and reduce France power. France could have not resisted to us if we fight together and thus we would have found a peaceful solution
very quickly.
2 times I asked ,2 times Genoese Consul refused showed clearly where on which side he would have stood. He also approved the attack on Denmark when informed by the French king.
I can't say for certain, to which grade the Genoese politics has an hidden agenda with the French king or was simply blind foolishness. Certainly this politics not only was bringing to death
one of our precious ally, but would have made the barbaric and filthy French king even more powerful and certainly we may have become next victim, probably with the help of the Genoese.
If I didn't trust Genoa, I wouldn't even asked to join us revealing our plans. Venice behaved correctly until the end, it was your choice to stand with France, not ours.

Signed
the Venetian Doge

Nonsense and pathetic excuses. You never said you'd break an alliance with me because I didn't want to intervene in the France/HRE/Denmark affair.

You are just greedy for land is all. At least stop speaking lies and admit your savagery, barbarian.

Signed, Genoese Doge

[Timur_the_Lame]

Nonsense and pathetic excuses. You never said you'd break an alliance with me because I didn't want to intervene in the France/HRE/Denmark affair.

You are just greedy for land is all. At least stop speaking lies and admit your savagery, barbarian.

Signed, Genoese Doge

LOL! Invicta doesn't know what he got himself into this time!! (I heard ATPG is awesome)

[Askthepizzaguy]

LOL! Invicta doesn't know what he got himself into this time!! (I heard ATPG is awesome)

Don't expect much for a while, I already disbanded Genoa as a whole. Genoa doesn't even start with a decent army or the ability to recruit worth a darn, and they invaded with an army 3 times bigger than I could muster in the next 20 turns.

That's okay though, HRE in particular will pay for their insolence. And when I have his head on a pike, I will shove it up the Venetian Doge's backside.

[Timur_the_Lame]

Don't expect much for a while, I already disbanded Genoa as a whole. Genoa doesn't even start with a decent army or the ability to recruit worth a darn, and they invaded with an army 3 times bigger than I could muster in the next 20 turns.

That's okay though, HRE in particular will pay for their insolence. And when I have his head on a pike, I will shove it up the Venetian Doge's backside.

Sounds awesome . Gl good sir, I have faith in you; seeing as you are famed at the Org, you better not die. No offense to invicta lol