ERE vs WRE.

[Ricimer]

Does it seem weird to anybody else that a victory condition for both empires requires the possession of the other empire's capital?

I don't know what kind of mods people intend to make but I think this is broken. The problem is that it causes the two empires to go to war with each other fairly soon. I've played as WRE and ERE both on vh/vh and the two empires are at war with each other with 5 years.

This is pretty unhistorical. It's not just unhistorical, it's also in my opinion game breaking. The two empires, while they did not always fully cooperate (even in some instances laughing at the problems facing the other empire) they did at least try to maintain a solid front against the barbarian invasion.

I'm not saying the alliance between the two empires should be completely inviolate or hard coded, but I think the victory conditions need to be changed. Is it possible to make the possession of the other empires capital dependant on whether or not that empire still retains it's capital?

In other words if WRE loses Rome to the Vandals, could it then become possible for ERE's victory condition to expand to require the possession of Rome? Or better yet, only require that if WRE is completely destroyed.

If the victory conditions cannot change dynamically then it's best if they don't include each others territories. Can I mod this out myself? Also, I hope bringing this up will influence the really talented people who make the major mods for RTW:BI to consider this suggestion.

[big bad badger]

stop crying and make some friends

[Ahiga]

It's not really too weird. I think it was the hope of either empire to try and once more hold a unified empire (Justinian sent that famous general of his to try and reconquer a lot of the western territories), which was odd, considering the damaged goods nature of the WREs. They did have a lot of civil wars, after all?

I don't believe victory conditions can change midgame, either.

[The White Knight]

stop crying and make some friends

You should try to make some friends too. I'm sure you'll get a lot this way.

---

@Ricimer: Try asking it in the mod-forum. I believe the Imperium - Total War mod is going to implement some interesting scripts. And mods like The First Triumvirate have proven that it is possible to mod victory conditions.

[big bad badger]

You should try to make some friends too. I'm sure you'll get a lot this way.

---

@Ricimer: Try asking it in the mod-forum. I believe the Imperium - Total War mod is going to implement some interesting scripts. And mods like The First Triumvirate have proven that it is possible to mod victory conditions.

Yes, I DO have a lot of friends thanks. How about you?

[Last Roman]

@ big bad badger stop being a retard

@Rimicer, I agree. I dont like that you have to go against your strongest ally. Unfortuntaly, I dont know of any mods that have what your asking for, but ask around

[big bad badger]

Crying over the WRE & ERE going to war is being retarded. BI is historic, not very, but still historic and this is what happened is history! You complain its unhistorical and yet CA implement a Roman faction capable of going to war, which happened in real life, and yet its not good enough! If you don't like BI, write a letter of complaint to CA and explain your problams with the game. I enjoy it, the majority of people on this site enjoy it so if you don't don't bother us! Thank you and good day.

[Ettore]

(already Written)
From 363 to to 476 NEVER the WRE emperor openly fought ERE Emperor.
The 2 historic civil wars under Theososian reign was of ERE against WRE rebels.

[Boudicca]

I like to go to war with the west. Imagine what if not. The game would be so easy. The Barbarians could never make up against a unified Rome, the AI is just not good enough for that.

But yes, in fact it is ahistorical that the east attacks the west on the third turn or the other way round.

[Seleukos]

Big Bad Badger, you have been warned for troll and flame. Have a nice day.

[Marcus Scaurus]

Yes, I DO have a lot of friends thanks. How about you?

W00t, you are THE man. Get a life.

[Seleukos]

W00t, you are THE man. Get a life.

Hey hey, I already dealt with him. Dont carry it on.

[antaeus]

it doesnt suggest that you go to war with the other empire. quite often you can actually choose to let your differences simmer for a while (historically correct) and then go in after the barbarians have destroyed the other half of the empire (historically correct)

but what it does do, is give you the option to create your own version of history if you choose.

[CommanderSela]

You can always try to remove the other empire's capital from the list of victory condition. I don't know if it will change the diplomacy in the game. Anyway, i also find the starting hordes factions ( Vandal and Huns ) in bi too weak. I've played to WRE and the ai always weaken his forces agains each other or against the other barbarian faction. Only in one game, the huns attacked and took constantinople and other cities in the balkans. In the current game i'm playing with the romano british and the huns hordes are nearly destroyed. The vandal is a client kingdom of the goth. Is there a way to improve the ai of those 2 factions as well?

[big bad badger]

Big Bad Badger, you have been warned for troll and flame. Have a nice day.

You too.

[Ricimer]

Yes, I DO have a lot of friends thanks. How about you?

Hey.. badger.. You jerk. I don't know why your attacking my post and I frankly don't give a crap. I just want to respond and let you know that your an idiot.

Thanks for those of you who offered constructive and intelligent comments, and badger, gfys. I know you do it every night.

[Ricimer]

(already Written)
From 363 to to 476 NEVER the WRE emperor openly fought ERE Emperor.
The 2 historic civil wars under Theososian reign was of ERE against WRE rebels.

Your right in a sense Ettore, but we're not talking about WRE rebels. That is actually a seperate faction. We're talking about the legitimate and honorable title of Emperor of the West.

No Legit Emperor of either faction ever went to war with the other. As for Justinian, he was attacking Goths in Italy, long after the concept of a Western Emperor was a distint memory of several generations.

I'm not asking for it to be impossible for these factions to fight. I'm simply pointing out that for the most part they had a lot more to gain from uniting against the the barbarians than they had from watching either side fall. Justinian and Theodoseus's actions really prove my point. Why would an Eastern Emperor try and and revive and rebuild the ancient Western Realm unless to gain and ally against the savage Northerners?

I'm not trying to be a jerk here, I'm just pointing out the facts. For ERE to declare war on WRE in turn 3-10 is just insane. Valens and Valentian go to war? Why on earth? In the face of the Vandals\Goths\Alemanni\Franks\Burgundians\everyone else. Would these two turn on each other?

Badger aside, I think someone needs to take a serious look at this. That's all I'm saying. I'm certainly no authority on the subject.

[mike^_^]

this right here basically ruins (for me) a vanilla campaign as a roman.

I recall one campaign, where I was massing troops in greece, building several armies to go liberate armenia, and one turn an army of seriously 2-4 units of WRE layed siege to Moesia, which in itself was garrisoned by 5 liminate and a general.

man the AI pisses me off.

I wish CA would actually fix it one of these times around, to where the AI doesn't declare war with a couple of fisherman blockading your port, or a few rogue peasants sieging your cities. especially when they are getting 3/4's of their trade from you, steady coin donations from your empire, military assistance, you're allies, and they have the huns knocking on there door. no, let's just go ahead and wage war on the worlds only superpower, the player!

p.s. RCGv.2 doesn't have this problem there is only 1 empire!

[Razor]

I agree that a Roman empire openly attacking another Roman empire is a bit weird and shouldn't be included in the victory conditions. I think it's best to change the victory conditions of the Romans to outlive the other Roman factions and perhaps some barbarian factions as well.
To be honest I've never thought of this before (I hardly ever play the campaign) but this is indeed a bit weird and not implemented in BI the right way.

[The White Knight]

p.s. RCGv.2 doesn't have this problem there is only 1 empire!

RCGv.2?