Aragon: The Iberian Stalemate

[sbroadbent]

Note: This is a strategic exercise. I am not looking for help to solve the stalemate. I'm interested in how various forum members would solve the scenario.

New Requirement (as of 11:50PM Eastern Standard Time on 9/12/2010): Your solution must ensure Cordoba, Toledo, Pamplona and Toulouse do not fall to Castilian, Portuguese, English or Moorish invasion (or any other faction for that matter). If one of these does fall, consider it a fail and start again.


What would you do to break this stalemate and gain Iberian supremacy given this situation.

First, some background:

Early on you were at peace with the exception of the Moors. You had a Castilian marriage alliance which got thrown away when you decided to side against the aggressor in a Castile/England war. Then you decided to lay siege to Castilian Burgos, leading to the last 70 years (50 turns or so) of war (with occassional peace). This war also got you excommunicated. You had been allied with Portugal, until they decided to support their Castilian ally.

A Jihad to Toledo many years ago brought the Khwarezmian Empire west with four stacks. The Khwarez were successful in the Jihad.

The French attempted to invade, but were cut short when England dominated and became a superpower. You have had English aggression against you, and took Toulouse as punishment for their actions.

At one point you had the Khwarez going after Murcia and Valencia. Castile going after Pamplona. England going after Barcelona, the Moors going after Cordoba, and Portugal sitting there waiting for their chance. At any one time 2 or 3 of your cities/castles were under siege for decades with very little rest or retraining time.

Now, you are sitting strong with Toledo, Pamplona, Toulouse, Granada and Valencia as your castles. You have Barcelona, Zaragoza, Murcia, Cordoba, and Palma as cities. Oddly, no one has bothered to invade sunny Palma with a garrison of all but 5 spear militia, though the Moors occasionally blockade the port.


To atone for your sins, you went on a massive church building campaign, and priest training program. You have sent an army of priests to convert Moorish controlled Fes (currently at 65% Catholic). You also have some spies and assassins wreaking havoc on Fes, and Fes has been on the verge of rebellion. You have regained your place in Christianity and for Castile's actions, they have got themselves excommunicated.

Unfortunately due to the large size of the Fatimid Caliphate, the Pope favors the Fatimid Caliphate for Crusade targets. Constantinople was a crusade target when Hungary was in control and got themselves excommunicated. Frankfurt has been a crusade target twice (once when HRE controlled and second when currently held by excommunicated Norway).

You have Montesa Chapter houses in Murcia and Valencia. The additional armor piercing heavy infantry has been helpful. You have a Master Theologians guild in Cordoba and Master Horse Breeders Guild in Toledo with Horse breeders in Granada and Toulouse.


The current situation:

Every turn you have a Castile army laying siege to Pamplona. Portugal and Castile take turns sieging Toledo. The Moors and Portugal take turns sieging Cordoba, though the Moors have Portuguese troubles south of the Mediterranean

Your only ally for a while was the Turks. They were the only ones willing to be friends. Unfortunately that friendship ended when the Khwarezmian Empire eliminated them. Later and more recently you received a request by a Norwegian princess for an alliance and marriage alliance with her people. Not thinking about it at the time, you gladly accept, only to find on the same turn the Pope has called a crusade on Norwegian controlled Frankfurt, and has demanded that you end your alliance with the Norwegians... DOH


Your Faction Leader is "Wildy Extravagant" (which gives you a +15% increase in construction costs, 30% penalty to taxes, but a -2 to squalor) and has a "Skewed View".

Your Faction Heir is unfortunately "Dangerously Mad" happens also to be an "Unproven Commander" is "Un-manly", "Corrupt", a "Poor Logistician", and to top it off has "Trouble at Home".

You're probably thinking to yourself that you should send these Family members on a lone pilgrimage to Jerusalem to redeem themselves


My Tactics:
I have allowed the three enemies to assault the walls. Portugal and Castile bring lots of cavalry which makes it essential that you divert the enemy to try to take the walls, rather than break down the gates. You have no spears in Toledo or Pamplona, but you have plenty of Javelins and crossbow and sufficient infantry to create a meat grinder of Castilian and Portuguese bodies while taking very few casualties. So long as you can rush your cavalry out of the gates, disrupt their ram crews (and perhaps a ladder or tower crew or two, the AI will go after the walls if they get a ladder or tower at the walls. Let them get at least one ladder or tower to the walls, as they ignore other options.

In Cordoba, you have 4 units of Pike Militia which you can use to create a barrier at the gates, preventing a mass of cavalry from wreaking havoc. Use excess melee infantry to mob the gate to prevent the enemy from making headway. They will rout.

My secret weapon (sort of):
In a desperate attempt to break the stalemate, I have a trebuchet on board a ship currently in the port of Zaragoza on it's way west to break Portugese power. A second ship in Murcia has 2 Light Men at Arms, a unit Dismounted Knights of Montesa, and a unit of Knights of Montesa. I plan to pick up some Dismounted Feudal Knights, and a few more cavalry from Granada before sailing to Silves to lay siege. Following that a quick trip up the coast to Lisbon or Oporto (which ever is lightly defended) and cut even deeper into Portuguese finances. If I can't hold them, I'll sack and leave it for rebels. By cutting into Portugal, it'll shift the balance of power in the region.

I have attached the save game as of turn 106/Year 1237. The Mongols and Teutons have appeared. You will need SS 6.2 RC4 to play. Difficulty is VH/VH.

How will/would you turn things around?

[Ichon]

SS 6.2 RC4 is the compilation without BGR right?

It sounds sort of interesting setup but with Aragon already controlling so much territory it does not seem terribly difficult especially if you don't mind sacrificing Toulouse momentarily or can scrounge enough troops to end Castile now to give you more defense in depth and they are the easiest opponent to finish off not to mention their current cities are rather close together... probably can finish them in 3-4 decent battles. If you go after Portugal it takes awhile to travel around the whole Peninsula by ship but probably can have easy time capturing at least Lisbon and Oporto.

England is your main worry long term but sending a fleet up to the channel and sacking all the cities both sides will slow them a bit and help your finances but they will probably be having quite strong armies with all the Fortresses they will have with that much territory. Hopefully they are fighting Genoa and Norway already. If relations with Pope are repaired you can likely get a Crusade called against England if you want though that is the easy way out...

[bɑne]

SS 6.2 RC4 is the compilation without BGR right?

6.2 RC4 is the 6.2 patch, Release Candidate 4. The latest patch of the 6.2 series (not the Compilation). Also known as 6.2.4

[Ichon]

6.2 RC4 is the 6.2 patch, Release Candidate 4. The latest patch of the 6.2 series (not the Compilation). Also known as 6.2.4

I should have been more precise- its the most up to date version of 6.2 without RR/RC or BGR right? Eh... I just have trouble being interested without at least once of those.

[bɑne]

Yes. No compilation, no RR/RC, no BGR. Thats 6.2 RC4. I don't know how to be any more precise

[bɑne]

How will/would you turn things around?

Very nice idea. I'll defrost my 6.2 installation.

[Callawyn]

Pick a faction you want to destroy first and focus on it. Capture their weakest provinces, then either finish them off or make peace and target someone else.

1) Moors. Moors are extremely vulnerable to naval attack, probably 2 or 3 of their 4 provinces could be taken by a 1/4 stack of crap with a trebuchet (or 2 catapults). Go by sea. I'd put 3 such armies at sea and hit all 3 of their eastern provinces on the same turn. Have a diplo stationed at their westernmost province to offer ceasefire (offer tribute if necessary, or tribute + a province). So, take 2 or 3 regions, get ceasefire even if you have to give 1 back. If you go straight for their settlements, and hit them all on the same turn, you can knock them out of the war without ever bothering to deal with their field armies. Once they're out of the war, pick your next target.

2) Spain. only 3 provinces, 2 of which are easily in reach by land the 3rd takes a bit of a walk. You have 10, you really should be able to knock them out without much trouble.

3) Portugal. Remember Paul Revere? 1 if by land 2 if by sea? Don't recall them having a pre-arranged signal for a combined land-march / naval invasion. As with the Moors, probably 2 of their 4 settlements will be lightly garrisoned,

[DirtySmurf]

I say try to break Castile's siege. Concentrate all of your troops on them. In all of my Iberian games, Castile has always given me the most trouble.

I also would advise staying away from the Moors. They are bordering a superpower that will probably declare war on you if you end up sharing a border. Getting the Iberian peninsula should be your main concern (approx. 30 turns seems reasonable). From there you should be able to challange the English.

Oh also, suicide that faction heir. He seems to be a bigger problem than anything you can do to save him.

[the cooliest]

First of all, kill the faction heir. Secondly...march against Castile first and focus most of your military might on them...even if you leave a couple settlments a little undefended. Leave the Moors alone for now, turn on them once you have control of Iberia or atleast everything that Portugal doesn't have. Castile looks like it could be taken in a couple of quick strikes. Once they are eliminated, move on to Portugal. Like somebody aforementioned, a joint naval ground attack could be good. Maybe try to take the capital and give it back for some tribute or a couple of there eastern cities, and a ceasefire. And before you give it back, destroy every building in the city just to piss them off . That might weaken them enough to re fortify your northern settlements and try to lead a couple of raids against the English, or participate in a crusade and start and oversea colony in some random area of the map because its fun...maybe in Greece or southern Italy, but that might turn the Pope against you. But you first must get rid of the immediate threats in Iberia, and then you will have many opportunities.

[RollingWave]

nay, the Fatimid's hold on the western part is usually fairly weak, as the western settlements is really far from their core settlements.

I'd suggest you somehow make peace with spain (try to ally someone who's a ally of them to force peace if they don't want cease fire) for now, and then go after the Moors / Fatimid via sea invasion, that should get you in the pope's good grace and if Spain attack again it should end up better for you.

[sbroadbent]

Note: I am a cautious player by nature, and though temporarily sacrificing one settlement to get an advantage over one enemy may result in a desired outcome, for this strategic exercise, holding the existing possessions is a requirement, which means having a sufficient garrison for Toulouse, Pamplona, Toledo and Cordoba.

I'm mostly curious how forum members would handle this scenario. Since posting, my naval assault of Silves, a half stack with a Trebuchet was successful, and the Portugese were willing to ceasefire. This has bolstered my income from another city + trade with the Portugese. I was later successful in getting a spy (from the attempt to cause a rebellion in Moorish held Fes) to infiltrate Burgos, and with it lightly defended (one general, though there were three half stacks sitting to the west, south and south-west), my spy opened the gates and I came in from the north, eliminated the general, and before the Castilian reinforcements could save the castle square, the 3 minute timer ran out, giving me the needed victory. Now it's just a matter of taking out the Castilian cavalry that are still very much a threat and Castile is as good as done.

It should be noted, at the save point, you are 4343 florins in Debt, and running a projected Deficit of 2964 florins.

It sounds sort of interesting setup but with Aragon already controlling so much territory it does not seem terribly difficult especially if you don't mind sacrificing Toulouse momentarily or can scrounge enough troops to end Castile now to give you more defense in depth and they are the easiest opponent to finish off not to mention their current cities are rather close together... probably can finish them in 3-4 decent battles. If you go after Portugal it takes awhile to travel around the whole Peninsula by ship but probably can have easy time capturing at least Lisbon and Oporto.

The one thing about both Castile and Portugal was that they were producing enough troops to regularly send a stack a turn. There was a few turns where they would lay siege with one stack, assault on the next. I'd repel that assault and then their second stack would re-establish the siege, preventing the ability to even retrain my troops.

With each turn, they had an ever increasing number of cavalry with more and more Feudal Knights each turn, and with my finances no way to out produce them (not just against one faction, but two factions to maintain cavalry superiority.

Without any decent spear or Pike units (level 5 city barracks), it's almost suicide to try to take them on the field, especially when they have so much cavalry, which means you either need siege weapons or spies to immediately assault to avoid being caught out in the field.

The key is to find an opening and have enough troops to take advantage of it.

1) Moors.

If there was peace with Castile and Portugal, I might launch naval invasions into Africa. Ultimately my effort to spam Fes with priests, spies and assassins is more to try to get it to rebel, because it's mostly all but impossible to get settlements to rebel, even with a concerted effort of spies, sabotage and religious unrest. I decided my spies and assassins were of better use, and sent them north.

2) Spain. only 3 provinces, 2 of which are easily in reach by land the 3rd takes a bit of a walk. You have 10, you really should be able to knock them out without much trouble.

If I only had to focus on Castile, I could find the troops to overcome Castile. Fortunately I did find an opening to steal away Castile's advanced military training facilities.

3) Portugal. Remember Paul Revere? 1 if by land 2 if by sea? Don't recall them having a pre-arranged signal for a combined land-march / naval invasion. As with the Moors, probably 2 of their 4 settlements will be lightly garrisoned,

Taking Silves by naval invasion turned out to be the best option. The money gained from sacking the city allowed me to build some much needed balista towers in several of the castles, giving me some better firepower in the defense of the city/castle. At the save point, Silves, Badajoz and Oporto are lightly garrisoned. Lisbon is garrisoned with a full stack.

As to the Moors, if an assault on Africa was in the cards, Algiers and Melila were minimally garrisoned, but an attack across the Mediterranean wouldn't have stopped the Portugese or Castile sieges. The Moors assaults on Cordoba were infrequent, but annoying because they'd lay siege just after Portugal was repelled.

I say try to break Castile's siege. Concentrate all of your troops on them. In all of my Iberian games, Castile has always given me the most trouble.

I also would advise staying away from the Moors. They are bordering a superpower that will probably declare war on you if you end up sharing a border. Getting the Iberian peninsula should be your main concern (approx. 30 turns seems reasonable). From there you should be able to challange the English.

Oh also, suicide that faction heir. He seems to be a bigger problem than anything you can do to save him.

Castile is a bit more challenging because their settlements are inland so not as open to a quick naval strike, and when you have multiple stacks floating around, with a fair amount of cavalry in each, it makes it all the more difficult when you don't have a decent cavalry counter.

Castile and Portugal should be more of a priority especially considering how many invasions they attempt. It got to the point that Castile got themselves excommunicated for the constant attacks. Portugal has apparently maintained their Papal relations well enough.

First of all, kill the faction heir. Secondly...march against Castile first and focus most of your military might on them...even if you leave a couple settlments a little undefended. Leave the Moors alone for now, turn on them once you have control of Iberia or atleast everything that Portugal doesn't have. Castile looks like it could be taken in a couple of quick strikes.

Have you taken a look to see what Castile has? On the surface it does seem like a couple quick strikes could take them out, but it's easier said than done. Also consider that other than Toulouse, Cordoba, Toledo and Pamplona, every settlement Aragon controls has minimal garrisons (enough to maintain the free garrisons). If you pull troops from any one of the aforementioned settlements, you might lose them under the constant sieges. It may be possible to reduce the garrisons to a lower level, and still be able to successfully defend them, but I haven't tried to experiment to see how few units you would need.

Though I didn't make it a requirement of this strategic exercise, you must be able to hold the four settlements of Cordoba, Toledo, Pamplona and Toulouse, otherwise consider it game over and have to start the exercise again.

[sbroadbent]

nay, the Fatimid's hold on the western part is usually fairly weak, as the western settlements is really far from their core settlements.

Though the Fatimid Caliphate is a superpower, you are far from their base of power so they are of little concern.

I'd suggest you somehow make peace with spain (try to ally someone who's a ally of them to force peace if they don't want cease fire) for now, and then go after the Moors / Fatimid via sea invasion, that should get you in the pope's good grace and if Spain attack again it should end up better for you.

Sadly, Aragon is considered Very Untrustworthy, and due to the nature of the AI in 6.2 (Gracul's AI) it creates alliance blocks which the AI uses to good effect.

It's been rather difficult to get a ceasefire with Castile. It's always been Demanding or Very Demanding. The current war has only been going on for the last 10 turns. Before that there were a couple turns of peace, but that was about it. With the constant attacks from all sides, you do not have the florins to give large cash payments to improve relations or to buy peace. I'd also not consider giving away settlements an option either, unless I'm holding onto something that's far away and hard to hold.

As it is, Castile is (and has been) excommunicated for quite a while, though they apparently have been paying off the Pope as they have boosted their favor with Rome, even though they are still excommunicated.

I did recently get peace with Portugal when I took Silves. Still, even though Aragon is at peace with one of their allies, they refuse to end the war, even after they have lost their only castle. I suspect the only problem is that they have too many field troops, and consider themselves still powerful and able to retake some territory, so feel no need to gain peace. Too bad then that their remaining cities will feel the explosive power of Aragonese sabotage

[Ichon]

Not having ballista towers already past turn 100 and being required to keep certain cities would be important information on the situation as well as the financial status. Not sure how the finances are so poor, sending a couple merchants into N Africa or to Sicily should only take 5-6 turns and would increase income anywhere from 1-3K.

What Knight Orders are there or merchant guilds in the cities? Having access to Knights or Merchant cavalry and especially Jinetes from Granada or wherever you can get them should make field battles vs Castile doable.

Well, we'll see what others post about the situation if many bother to load up plain 6.2.

Strategically-

If you are already screwed with relations to the Pope but there is currently a Crusade somewhere else then now is the time to eliminate your Catholic rivals in Iberia and repair relations later. Castile is a thorn in Aragon's side forcing you to maintain several unnecessary garrisons around them. Clear them out and you can shift forces to other fronts quite easily. With ballista towers you should be able to garrison even besieged cities fairly cheaply. Portugal and any coastal powers are almost always vulnerable to sea raids as you've demonstrated but if your forces are so thin striking widely disperses what could instead be a hammer blow onto Castile. Lots of cavalry does not make Castile armies unbeatable... just more difficult but the terrain in Iberia should allow you to negate that quite easily- not to mention Aragon's roster even at this point in the campaign with AOR units considered.

[RollingWave]

also, spies / priest / assasins / diplomats all cost upkeeps, if you have as many of them as it sounds, it's probably one of the reason your going so deep into debt. as well as ships, ships are fairly fast to rebuild anyway, if your not in a big naval fight then try to disband most of your ships (just leave one so your admirals can stay alive if you have one with stars).

given your description, I guess then try to disband as many ships / mercs /high up keep units as possible, and if you really have that many spies assasins just keep sending them on missions until they die out. your right that it's really hard to make settlements rebel, and in high level settings assasins are about as close to a complete waste of money as it gets. I usually only use spies to get a general idea of what i'm going up against and looking out for reinforcements. in my current lithuanian game, I have 15 settlements and just 3 spies. (though I did get burned on one occasion when Hronda was lost because my gate got opened AND I got hit from both sides.)

[sbroadbent]

Not having ballista towers already past turn 100 and being required to keep certain cities would be important information on the situation as well as the financial status. Not sure how the finances are so poor, sending a couple merchants into N Africa or to Sicily should only take 5-6 turns and would increase income anywhere from 1-3K.

In many of my games, I have tended to be on the offensive, such that I almost never have to fight a defensive siege battle. If an enemy does siege, I usually sally, or get reinforcements from elsewhere, making ballista towers an unneeded expense, so I've never bothered to build them. Considering the lack of decent spear units, I've gained a new appreciation for letting the enemy try to assault my settlements to minimize the advantage that cavalry have in that environment.

This was also the first game where I had 5 enemies coming at me from all directions (English, Khwarez, Moors, Portugal, Castile) in 50 turns worth of war. To hold back the enemy, I've spent a lot of money on recruitment and retraining, and not enough on the economics. Though I could have built less churches, it along with the massive priest recruiting did bump up my papal rating which was very low after excommunication, which possibly contributed to Castile getting excomm'd.

War with all those neighboring factions also cuts down on the amount of trade income you can potentially generate. You can definitely feel it in the treasury when suddenly that income cushion gets removed.

I only decided when I wrote that response, and updated the original post that I'd make holding the four settlements a requirement. It's a rule for this scenario that would make things a bit more challenging, as it does seem most people would assume this was an easy thing to accomplish. Holding the settlements fits more along my play style, so it'd be interesting to see what people would do in that circumstance.

I don't typically have much luck with merchants, so producing merchants hasn't been a priority so no merchant guilds yet.

What Knight Orders are there or merchant guilds in the cities? Having access to Knights or Merchant cavalry and especially Jinetes from Granada or wherever you can get them should make field battles vs Castile doable.

Can Aragon get Jinetes? Nothing in the stables line, or (during the Iberian tour with "character_reset" to see if I can get them as mercenaries) recruitable as mercenaries. I only have the following mercenary options: Mercenary Frankish Knights, Mercenary Crossbow, Mercenary Spearmen, Andalusian Infantry and Macemen.

I'm thinking to compensate for the lack of spear, that I'll have to start purchasing some expensive mercenary spears.

Guilds:
Toulouse: Horse Breeders
Barcelona: none
Zaragoza: Explorers*
Pamplona: none
Burgos: Master Horse Breeders
Valencia: Montesa Minor Chapter House*
Toledo: Master Horse Breeders
Murcia: Montesa Minor Chapter House*
Granada: Horse Breeders
Cordoba: Master Theologians
Silves: Explorers
Palma: none (planning to get thieves or assassin guild)

The guilds with * are the ones that I built. The rest the AI built.

Well, we'll see what others post about the situation if many bother to load up plain 6.2.

Strategically-

If you are already screwed with relations to the Pope but there is currently a Crusade somewhere else then now is the time to eliminate your Catholic rivals in Iberia and repair relations later. Castile is a thorn in Aragon's side forcing you to maintain several unnecessary garrisons around them. Clear them out and you can shift forces to other fronts quite easily. With ballista towers you should be able to garrison even besieged cities fairly cheaply. Portugal and any coastal powers are almost always vulnerable to sea raids as you've demonstrated but if your forces are so thin striking widely disperses what could instead be a hammer blow onto Castile. Lots of cavalry does not make Castile armies unbeatable... just more difficult but the terrain in Iberia should allow you to negate that quite easily- not to mention Aragon's roster even at this point in the campaign with AOR units considered.

Aragon was excommunicated. King Alfonso died, lifting the excommunication. Papal rating was boosted by a few offers of tribute, plus the church building campaign and priest recruitment. It's back down to two crosses with the attack on Silves (which Aragon subsequently got a 6 turn excommunication warning).

It was relatively recent, but I did get a ceasefire with the English, and up until the last turn I've played to, the haven't returned back, making the garrison at Toulouse "unnecessary", but you never know when the AI will randomly show up with a stack or two and rain on your parade. Considering Toulouse was my only eastern defense, I wasn't taking many chances.

There is a crusade ongoing, but I'd rather avoid excommunication again, especially when at the current point in time it's just a matter of whittling down Castile's existing castle troops, and discouraging Portugal from going to war again. Compared to where Aragon was, the stalemate has been broken.

also, spies / priest / assasins / diplomats all cost upkeeps, if you have as many of them as it sounds, it's probably one of the reason your going so deep into debt. as well as ships, ships are fairly fast to rebuild anyway, if your not in a big naval fight then try to disband most of your ships (just leave one so your admirals can stay alive if you have one with stars).

Wages are 3180 florins. Army upkeep is 16798. As of 1237, Aragon was paying 700 florins in tribute (100 to Norway, 200 to Portugal, 200 to Moors, 200 to Venice). Several of those were to get ceasefires (in the case of Venice), while others were an effort to boost relations to encourage a ceasefire, which did not always work.

I have 4 War Galley's and 3 Cogs. A reasonable number of ships given my extensive coastline and the need to quickly transport units long distances, and to stop Moorish and Genoan blockades (I started a minor war with Genoa because they refused to remove their troops from Palma). I have been in a fair number of naval battles, and all of the ships have some experiece. The Cogs each have 5XP, 4XP, 2XP There are 2 War Galley's with 3XP, while the other have 2XP. Once I got War Galleys, rather than retrain my Cogs, I have been merging them together, to reduce the fleet and accumulate the XP into a few. When you are on a tight budget, you can't always build ships as needed.

The Debt/Deficit of the save point had only been relatively recent (about two turns), but I made the point so to illustrate money is tight. Often what happens, is Aragon has several battles that eliminates a large chunk of cavalry (which eventually get retrained, but frees up space in the budget, and the semi-occasional ransom helps to (re)train a few more high quality units to better defend Aragonese settlements).

As to agents, Aragon has 7 Priests, 4 Cardinals (all high Piety produced from the Theologians Guild. Aragon has 3 diplomats (1 near Rome, 2 in and around Iberia) and 1 assassin (6 subterfuge) and 2 spies (7 and 6 subterfuge).

2 of my priests are currently 8 piety, 2 more are 9 piety while a 5th has 10 piety. Once there is space in the college, my priests will dominate. Poland has two cardinals while Venice has the other 7.

Aragon has hired no mercenaries.

Given the fact that unless I want to lose them, I've needed to maintain large garrisons in the 4 main settlements, which has all but eaten Aragon's income. It's a situation where Aragon has been forced to grow militarily faster than the growth of the stable economy (farms, taxes) and volatile economy (trade) can support.

[barcamartin]

I decided to give this a go. I have only played two turns, and furing trun two the English attacked me at Bordeuax, and during the battle (which I was winning crushingly) the game froze. The at the moment I am at the end of my second turn. So far:

Turn 1: Relieved Cordoba with the forces in Granada, and sent the garrison to besiege Badajoz. Emptied Toulouse to march west with that army (left one unit of peasant archers..). Also emptied Pamplona, again leaving a unit of archers, and stationed my army on the bridge at the Castilian settlement just west, trying to lure them to attack me there.

During the AI turn, the army at Badajoz was attacked by another army. Faced by Portuguese on both sides, we valiantly fought them off, killed or captured every single one, and sacked the now empty castle for 8,000 florins. I also successfully fought off a siege of Toledo. Toulose besieged by two units of English infantry. I was not counting on that, but I'm hoping the double walls and lots of tower fire will allow my archers to hold them off.

Turn 2: Moved back to Pamplona, since the Castilians had rolled up an army of pretty much only heavy cavalry, which would allow them to slaughter my army, even if I was defending the bridge. Moved the big army from Toulouse, that had headed west, to besiege Bordeaux. Started recruiting everything I could in all castles, focussing on cavalry and heavy infantry. A medium sized army headed out from Valencia,strengthened by mercs, defeating a pretty large Spanish army to the west. It was badly decimated though, and is now headed back to Valencia for reinforcements from my recruitment drive. Also, your treb ships has merged with the army from Murcia, and is headed for Sivas, as you suggested.

During the AI turn, Badajoz was besieged by three Port. armies, and as I mentioned, the English attacked at Bordeaux. I suppose the same things will happen next time I click end turn.

Edit; Once again, the Enlgish attacked at Bordeuax, and were crushed. The citadel sacked for 10,000 florins. Also, they called off their siege of Toulouse. Whew, risky gamble pulled off there. Portugal besieged Badajoz with the same forces.

Basically, my current plan is to be aggressive, and gain money aswell as weaken the enemies by taking and sacking settlements. The Spanish are strong to the north, so I'll try focussing some kind of push in the south and central parts, mainly aimed at Portugal, but it's going to be hard.

It does seem doable though, but the motherload of Castilian forces are a bit scary.

[Ichon]

Can Aragon get Jinetes? Nothing in the stables line, or (during the Iberian tour with "character_reset" to see if I can get them as mercenaries) recruitable as mercenaries. I only have the following mercenary options: Mercenary Frankish Knights, Mercenary Crossbow, Mercenary Spearmen, Andalusian Infantry and Macemen.

Aragon should be able to get Grenadine Jinetes from Grenada but maybe that is only in RC/RR, without Jinetes or spearmen it is more difficult to defeat lots of cavalry but if you have javelinmen in many ways they are better than spears except for the initial stopping of a cavalry charge but you should be able to use your FM's for that. Desert Cavalry if you go into N Africa also work as Jinetes just not quite as good but work well against Castile's light cavalry and can still damage heavy cavalry in the early era.

[sbroadbent]

Aragon should be able to get Grenadine Jinetes from Grenada but maybe that is only in RC/RR, without Jinetes or spearmen it is more difficult to defeat lots of cavalry but if you have javelinmen in many ways they are better than spears except for the initial stopping of a cavalry charge but you should be able to use your FM's for that. Desert Cavalry if you go into N Africa also work as Jinetes just not quite as good but work well against Castile's light cavalry and can still damage heavy cavalry in the early era.

I suspect Jinetes are only available to Aragon in RR/RC. It does make Aragon that more of a challenge. I remember playing a Norwegian campaign in 6.1 where I was routinely crushing Aragon armies simply because there was nothing to stop my cavalry charges.

The only problem with trying to stop Castile's or Portugal's initial cavalry charges are that their armies consistently have a large number of them (4-6 Feudals, 2-4 Mailed Knights, 1-2 Jinetes, plus their own FM).

I decided to give this a go. I have only played two turns, and furing trun two the English attacked me at Bordeuax, and during the battle (which I was winning crushingly) the game froze. The at the moment I am at the end of my second turn. So far:

Turn 1: Relieved Cordoba with the forces in Granada, and sent the garrison to besiege Badajoz. Emptied Toulouse to march west with that army (left one unit of peasant archers..). Also emptied Pamplona, again leaving a unit of archers, and stationed my army on the bridge at the Castilian settlement just west, trying to lure them to attack me there.

During the AI turn, the army at Badajoz was attacked by another army. Faced by Portuguese on both sides, we valiantly fought them off, killed or captured every single one, and sacked the now empty castle for 8,000 florins. I also successfully fought off a siege of Toledo. Toulose besieged by two units of English infantry. I was not counting on that, but I'm hoping the double walls and lots of tower fire will allow my archers to hold them off.

Turn 2: Moved back to Pamplona, since the Castilians had rolled up an army of pretty much only heavy cavalry, which would allow them to slaughter my army, even if I was defending the bridge. Moved the big army from Toulouse, that had headed west, to besiege Bordeaux. Started recruiting everything I could in all castles, focussing on cavalry and heavy infantry. A medium sized army headed out from Valencia,strengthened by mercs, defeating a pretty large Spanish army to the west. It was badly decimated though, and is now headed back to Valencia for reinforcements from my recruitment drive. Also, your treb ships has merged with the army from Murcia, and is headed for Sivas, as you suggested.

During the AI turn, Badajoz was besieged by three Port. armies, and as I mentioned, the English attacked at Bordeaux. I suppose the same things will happen next time I click end turn.

Edit; Once again, the Enlgish attacked at Bordeuax, and were crushed. The citadel sacked for 10,000 florins. Also, they called off their siege of Toulouse. Whew, risky gamble pulled off there. Portugal besieged Badajoz with the same forces.

Basically, my current plan is to be aggressive, and gain money aswell as weaken the enemies by taking and sacking settlements. The Spanish are strong to the north, so I'll try focussing some kind of push in the south and central parts, mainly aimed at Portugal, but it's going to be hard.

It does seem doable though, but the motherload of Castilian forces are a bit scary.

How is the battle going? Going on the offensive where possible is about the only way to break the stalemate. It is definitely a challenge when the enemy brings along a heavy cavalry army.

In one siege I managed to lure two units of Castile or Portugal cavalry (IIRC 1 of Feudal the other Mailed Knights) into chasing one of my Alforats within range of the Ballista towers and javelins/archers/crossbow.

By the time the battle was over they had two less units of cavalry. Even though I tried to draw the other cavalry into chasing the Alforats, they didn't take the bait.

I've found spies to be an essential component in taking advantage of low garrisoned settlements. I managed to grab Leon when they left it lightly defended and a quick strike killed their King (which also destroyed the faction). If there wasn't a now large ex-Castilian rebel army in the way, I could rush troops from Toledo to Badajoz to do the same thing.

The most recent even to occur to Aragon was a Moorish invasion of Palma. Before they assaulted, I destroyed everything of value, as there was no way 3 spear militias could hold off an army led by their Caliph, and I have no troops in the area to retake the island. I'll just let the Moors rebuild it, and retake it once Iberia is property of the Crown.

[barcamartin]

I'm working on it. Short on time now, but expect an update when I get back from work tonight, in 9-10 hours. Aragon has made progress, bloody and costly, but still progress.

[barcamartin]

Apologizing for the double-post, but here comes the latest news of the Aragonese "Breaking of the Iberian Stalemate, barca version".

Turn 3: Picking up where I left off, the siege of Badajoz was relieved by Aragonese forces, in a bloody battle between the relief force from Cordoba and two big Portuguese armies. The full-stack army was shipped west from Bordeaux, heading for Oporto and a strike at the last recruitment center of the Portu's. The army at Pamplona had been reinforced, and once again moved towards Burgos, lead by the King himself. During the Ai turn, Toledo was once again besieged by Castile.

Turn 4: The treasury took a serious dive into the red, after the national recruitment drive I had started. The turn started at - 5,000 florins, but the sacking of Silves by the naval force incl. catapult brought it to 3,000 positive. The town was plagued however, and population and soldiers took a heavy toll the coming turns. At Burgos, the King's army attacked an army outside the castle, which in turn was reinforced by two other Castilian armies. After fighting long and hard, the King was slain and the Aragonese army all but destroyed. The Castilians suffered heavy losses, although many were prisoners that returned to their ranks after the battle. The mad Prince became King, and he was on a fleet with a large army from Valencia, headed for Oran and North Africa. Our valiant forces laid siege to Lisboa, while Badajoz was besieged by a small force of Castilians.

Turn 5: The Pope decided to intervene, threatening Aragon with excommunication unless we stopped shedding Portuguese blood. So be it, all efforts were instead turned towards the Castilians, despite both Oporto and Lissabon being clearly conquerable. The force besieging Lissabon instead marched for Salamanca, and clashed with a massive Castilian army outside the walls. A crushing victory meant the city was for the taking, and it was sacked for 8,000 florins. This also meant the Castilian King was killed, and his nation reconciled. It turned out to matter little though. The Portu faction heir was assassinated, and a MotH was awarded to the captain leading the relief of Badajoz. Moorish Oran was besieged by the new King. Bordeaux besieged by a large, heavy infantry force of the English.

Turn 6: Oran sacked for 8,000 florins, and the treasury was barely hanging on in the recruitment/upkeep mania. Bordeaux relieved, and while the general died, a MotH took up his fallen cape and started the creation of a large force in Bordeaux, to threaten the English at Angers and further North. The army meant for Oporto reached Leon, crushing one army west of the city, and finally clashing with the Castilian King (alone outside the walls) and a full-stack from the garrison. Heroic Victory, and Leon was mine, sacked for 9,000 florins. My princess married the general in Burgos, leaving them leaderless with the King lost near the Atlantic coast near the castle. A small force from Pamplona was sent forth to "assassinate" him, and succeeded in doing so. This resulted in the destruction of Castile, and another MotH for me. The now rebel Burgos is besieged by the army from Leon, combined with the one from Salamanca.

Turn 7: Here's where I'm at now. Preparing for the destruction of Portugal, with only one turn left of the Pope's excom threat. A full stack with treb near Lissabon, and a weak army at Oporto. Another army is headed west from Toledo. The Portu's have lots of troops at Oporto, so the battle/s there will be bloody.

I might have missed something in my resume, but I think you get the picture. Nothing too advanced. Pretty much attack, attack and attack.

Anyway, I think I've done well and within a turn or two Iberia will be united. The Moors remain to be dealt with, as well as the Portu holdings in North Africa, but they can wait. Overall, I can only quote the Holy Roman Emperor Friedrich II; "He who defends everything, defends nothing."

Offense and aggression were my keywords, and it worked out well.

Attaching the save, should you wish to take a look-see.