Unit Suggestions (pre version 4 - now redundant)

[Heart of Madness]

Yes, but that is the point, no? Finding a strength and a weakness for every faction.

However, I disagree with the TO. They're meant to be strong all round. I would just do the smaller in numbers thing.

Otherwise, it all goes along with how I play them all anyway, but heavy cavalry is really useless in the desert. I've found that to my horror many a time.

[Templar Knight]

well i guess this a unit suggestion, or maybe its more of a question, but i just thought i would put it here since it has to do with units.

Has there ever been any thought to creating an optional epic battles patch? What i mean by this is having an optional EDU that you can use that increases the size of every unit in the game by say 10. Since every unit would be increased in size by an equal amount i would assume that the unit balancing stays the same, though the battles would be longer what with more men involved. Anyways i was just wondering if something like this has ever been considered?

[Winterwolf00]

I don't suppose we can get some Pickelhaube helmets on the Faustian gunners?

[TheFirstONeill]

I don't suppose we can get some Pickelhaube helmets on the Faustian gunners?

You are correct

well i guess this a unit suggestion, or maybe its more of a question, but i just thought i would put it here since it has to do with units.

Has there ever been any thought to creating an optional epic battles patch? What i mean by this is having an optional EDU that you can use that increases the size of every unit in the game by say 10. Since every unit would be increased in size by an equal amount i would assume that the unit balancing stays the same, though the battles would be longer what with more men involved. Anyways i was just wondering if something like this has ever been considered?

That would be easy enough to do, I cannot see a problem with me releasing such a patch to plug into V4 (or V3)

[Winterwolf00]

You are correct

How so?
Also, HAIL BISMARCK!

[TheFirstONeill]

How so?

In your assumption that

I don't suppose we can get some Pickelhaube helmets on the Faustian gunners?

It would draw the Faustians too close to WWI Germany, the trick is to get the factions to doth a cap to their inspirations without actually attempting to copy them.

[Winterwolf00]

In your assumption that


It would draw the Faustians too close to WWI Germany, the trick is to get the factions to doth a cap to their inspirations without actually attempting to copy them.

Ah I see, oh well.

[Heart of Madness]

I want to see the Privateers kick some ass for one! They always interested me more, but their AI is really dumb in the campaign, but at least they use their navy.

So far in my TO campaign I've destroyed the Vashta, Gaelic, Wotan, Valhalla, and most of the Barka navy in my campaign. I realize that as soon as you do, you pretty much screw up the AI's chance of expanding across the ocean. The Wotan and the Gaelics are dead in my campaign though, and the Barka only control Dagabar and Padmea now. I thought they were dead for sure when a Romuli legion showed up at Dagabar, but they finally got a victory.

The Vashta are near enough dead, and I have their final family member besieged. Me and the Dracule are really kicking their asses, and when they decided to leave only one general in charge of the garrisons at Bae Hyra and Bae Asra, I assassinated them and occupied both of them without losing a single man. I had to fight against two units of Immortals on the field outside of it supported by their Hashashim. It was a heroic victory, and I didn't even have a single unit of heavy cavalry. BTW, I assassinated Sultan Jalal and Baraka Baghdadi as well. I think I got a pic of me in the act.

Also, the Valhalla only have Odin's Gate and the surrounding settlements left. I took Valhalla, Jomsburg, and Elsador. I believe I took Sraken island as well, but that was controlled by rebels. The funniest part is that Odin's Gate and the settlement west of it both revolted and they're having to retake them even now.

[TheFirstONeill]

I want to see the Privateers kick some ass for one! They always interested me more, but their AI is really dumb in the campaign, but at least they use their navy.
.

Privateers have been totally rebuilt. Only one unit remains from their current roster, and their roster is totally unquie to them, no other faction shares their units. They have a revised starting postion, a new era setting they are pretty much a completely new faction in Version 4, some will like them, many will hate them, but they will be different from the other factions.

Also are you using the hardcore patch ?

[TheFirstONeill]

That would be easy enough to do, I cannot see a problem with me releasing such a patch to plug into V4 (or V3)

In fact if someone uploads a un-modded Thera V3 EDU I will knock up a large unit patch.

[Heart of Madness]

I can't get the hardcore patch to download.

[TheFirstONeill]

I can't get the hardcore patch to download.

Why ? How many times have your tried, and on seperate days ?

[The Holy Pilgrim]

Privateers have been totally rebuilt. Only one unit remains from their current roster, and their roster is totally unquie to them, no other faction shares their units. They have a revised starting postion, a new era setting they are pretty much a completely new faction in Version 4, some will like them, NOBODY will hate them, but they will be different from the other factions.

Also are you using the hardcore patch ?

Fixed it

[Templar Knight]

In fact if someone uploads a un-modded Thera V3 EDU I will knock up a large unit patch.

Here you go, 1 un-modded v3 EDU. Oh and thank you for deciding my suggestion was worthy enough to be acted on.

[The Holy Pilgrim]

Fair warning about simply adding unit numbers:

The idea, while it sounds good at first, will distort proportions in unit sizes, thus setting off the delicate balance between units. Take the following as an example:

Say that a unit of Peasants has 50 men and a unit of Dismounted Knights has 25 men. As of now, it is a 2:1 ratio, peasants' favor. Now, let's add 10 to each so that way we get 60 peasants and 35 Dismounted Knights. This is no longer a 2:1 ratio, but rather a 1.714:1 ratio, peasants' favor. This, in turn, skews the balance a bit in both in-field battles and in auto-resolve decisions. I know this is true as I have modified many, many, many EDU for balancing purposes, and re-balancing with just a simple addition of men per unit always offsets the scales, sometimes in a small manner, sometimes majorly.

In order to compensate, unit stats would have to be modified as well in order to get the same results in battle. Alternatively, you could multiply each unit by a certain number in order to maintain the current ratios, but not all units can take that change without going over the hard-coded limit of 100 men per unit as per EDU.

I'm not trying to dismantle your suggestion, Templar Knight, but I am just offering my view on the subject and my experiences with such changes. Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see longer battles, but balance is always a very delicate thing to handle. Who knows, perhaps 10 may be just small enough to not have a dramatic effect on balancing, but it will change it. There's no avoiding that.

I do hope you understand that I am just trying to shed some light on this subject, not just dismantle your suggestion.

[Templar Knight]

lol its all good Holly Pilgrim i understand you are just weighing in on the subject. I admit that the thought of unit size ratios never really crossed my mind when i made the suggestion, but now that you bring that up i would be the first to admit that it makes perfect sense what you are saying. So maybe instead of increase every unit by 10 men, btw i just randomly picked that number in my original post, you can multiply the unit sizes by say 1.2 or some such number. Anyways im sure that increasing the unit sizes in a balanced manner is a much more complicated process then what my original post, making the suggestion, would have led people to believe.

[Torvus]

I play on Huge and regularly get 5000 men battles.

[Lord Golog]

I fear that Medieval 2 just isn't built for larger-than-huge unit sizes. The engine isn't optimized for modern systems so performance isn't that great, and is often worse than if you played something like Napoleon or Shogun 2 on similar sizes. Additionally, huge units on the engine are awkward as hell to use, even more so in confined spaces like bridges, mountainsides and settlements. If you ask me, Large is probably the optimal balance between gameplay and performance, and Huge is the practical maximum.

[Jean=A=Luc]

Fair warning about simply adding unit numbers:

Yes, the sizes needs to be increased by percentages, not fixed numbers.

.

[Lord Golog]

I would like to suggest that all bayonet-armed firearm units be changed to use the same melee animations as billmen and the like. Other mods use these animations, and they look splendid when used by bayonet troops.