Isengard Tips/Strats?

[shokh]

~ Isengard fix for VH/VH ~

Install:
Just paste ..
...export_desc_buildings in your data ordner
...descr_strat in your imperial_campaign ordner
in your third age mod folder

Changes:
Isengard castle have now 4 iron mines (2 in original) this will add up about 500g/turn
Isengard castle have now swordsmen guild from beginning
Isengard castle have now the best armorer from beginning
Isengard castle have now drill square from beginning
Isengard castle have now mines build from beginning
Saruman is now a great builder (-10% building costs and -1,5% squalor)

This all should help up the start a little bit, but not too much. I placed the push in a way i think its realistic. The earlier armor upgrades, the doubled iron and the swordsmen guild (not buildable for your faction in other regions) should show, like in the story, that Isengard castle is a pure Uruk-hai-forge. And hey... Saruman is a great builder, he was guest in this place first and then changed many things *g*

Isengard on VH/VH is a challenge.
Manage your armies and your income with care. Expand wisely.

[Alex-ander]

Has anybody tried this sub mod yet?

[Huggins777]

Sorry to resurrect a thread but the title and posts so far are exactly what i'm having an issue with. I'm playing with TATW vanilla 3.2+3 bug fixes. Great mod, but damn Isengard is super hard on VH/VH. i managed to keep the 3 starting settlements, fangorn, the north and south towns by the river, and two town running west along that river. but then High Elves attack, and of course Rohan is a damn army producing whore. I've already restarted 3 times, on my 4 game right now. I feel like Rohan either needs a nerf seeing as how they only have to contend with me(least after 46 turns i'm only war they have) and as stated, we get naga's, they get axemen out the ass.

So besides trying a sub-mod/cheats to boost isengard, has anyone come up with a strategy? i don't want to play another faction because they're easier. I've steamrolled the AI in most TW games once i get going and as this is the first time i've not even got up and going much i'd like to get some help with this challenge.

TL;DR - Restarted campaign 3 times, on 4th play, same result each time. Rohan is axemen training whore+cav. 30-46(current game) turns far as i get. cheat needed? or is there a solution.

[Huggins777]

I found some advice ally with Gondor, Rohan ceasefires. Working good so far, on turn 36 and expanding into rebel territories.

[eugenioso]

I've been playing a game of Isengard for campaign and it feels really difficult compare to Sylvan Elves or the Dwarves...

First is the lack of family tree that is killing the Isengard economy. Without baby makers aka faction family, Isengard barely, if ever, gets to expand its leadership, and for the most part I'm running over half of my settlements without any generals! This is hurting my city growth/income way too much.

Second is the position. I got High Elves, Free Ppl and Rohan surrounding me, and if they decides to gang up on me it pretty much feels like a GG. Thankfully the orcs can keep the northern factions fairly busy, but this doesn't seem like a guarantee and hence Isengard feels really unprotected.

Third is minor but still I guess I should just bring it up. I'm loving the pikes and berserkers (feels like berserkers actually make decent anti calv because of their high hp to eat a charge ), and would love wargs too but I'm having trouble using them. They got a pretty awesome charge but unlike other calvs, I can't pull them out after a charge without losing a huge chunk of wargs. Also how should I use crossbows in general? They don't have the angle that archers do so leaving them behind pikes didn't look like it worked (saw lot of blood squirting out from back of my pikes ), they move a bit slower compared to other range and they don't have skirmish either so... Should I leave them between melee units in slightly "broken" line fashion like --_--_--_--_-- ?

So essentially, economy and diplomacy aspect of Isengard feels really difficult for me atm, with few unit mechanics that I'm puzzled by. Any other Uruk lovers wanna help me out here?

For the first issue, split up your generals. I remember that vanilla had a dunland bodyguard, saruman, ugluk and lurtz, and each of them combined, at least until you can muster more armies, will do the job just fine.

second, yes, you will get ganked, which is why by the time that they come for you, you will strike first, and not be the first struck.

third, wargs are 'glass cannon' units: they do lots of damage and have high attack, and do well against cavalry, but they generally suck too hard to survive. keep them as units for chasing down enemy armies, one warg unit should be more than enough. Berserkers are very good cavalry killers, just make sure they dont get charged (charging units can kill many HP units very quickly) and they will destroy them. Pikes are good place holders, and i have yet to see many units that will charge through a full pikeuruk unit. as for crossbowmen, use them as focused fire on cavalry or other heavily armored enemy units. they are only one of 3 units in the game with crossbows (the dwarves have one, rhun has another) and this means they are far better at destroying heavily armored units than anyone else, except perhaps eldar archers.

[Johnny12]

Guys, I need help. Berserkers are awesome I've heard, but they die so quickly. Any way to use the most out of them? I just don't seem to be able to control them.

[Flinn]

Berserkers are powerful, but not immortal.

Avoid direct charges from cavalry, just like any other regular "heavy" infantry unit. Use them to flank if possible (they are excellent to kill enemy generals), and use them in offence (a unit of uruk pikemen can serve you better than 2 of berserker when you defend a line or a chockepoint).

finally, avoid any Legolas that might be roaming on the battlefield

[Johnny12]

Berserkers are powerful, but not immortal.

Avoid direct charges from cavalry, just like any other regular "heavy" infantry unit. Use them to flank if possible (they are excellent to kill enemy generals), and use them in offence (a unit of uruk pikemen can serve you better than 2 of berserker when you defend a line or a chockepoint).

finally, avoid any Legolas that might be roaming on the battlefield

haha, I'm getting the drill.
Usually, my armies consist of 6 phalanxes, put in two lines so the back ones can defend the front ones, and they make an impenetrable spea wall, sometimes even by the Dismounted Black Numenoreans or the High Elven Smiths of Eregion.
Of course I keep wargs and infantry and crossbowmen in the stock, but the Berserkers I always keep from battle, because they die so easily when facing even shielded infantry (say Morannon Guards or Orc Raiders). And most of the time, when they face Uruk Bodyguards, they just get annihilated so easily. So I can't seem to find other use on them, rather than have them walk in front of my phalanxes' pikes and fight the enemy infantry, while the pikemen storm them. But I'l't try to use them as flanking units, if you say this is their use

[Flinn]

well flanking is always good, berserker or not

frankly I'm surprised that you find so much problem with them, IIRC in Vanilla TATW Berserkers where awesome troops; ok they are not Trolls, but they do make a good job against any light or medium infantry and can save the day when flanking heavier enemies. The thing you have to consider is that they have poor armor, so even if they have 2 hit points, they can't hold the ground against armored units in 1vs1 confront. They are shock troops, use them for their charge bonus and disengage them if they got stuck in melee for a long period. IIRC, they prove to be good in sieges (when you attack units on the wall).

hope this helps

[DrDragun]

Berserkers have a number of special stats that make them different. Compared other super-heavy infantry like Eldar Spearmen or Ironguards, Berserkers are actually better at killing trolls. The reason is because they have 3 hitpoints and average defense, instead of super high defense and 1 hitpoint. A troll-hit will kill you with almost certainty no matter if your defense is 12 or 22, but they have to hit a berserker 3 times to kill them.

They are also non-routing and cause terror, making them useful to break enemy morale when they are wavering. Use them almost like cavalry in this sense... running around the flank and charging from the rear.

Berserkers are supposed to be pretty awesome on wall-tops, similar to the Helms Deep battle in the movies, because it allows them to concentrate their density 1-on-1 with an enemy. However, I find that the 2-hand weapon animation is inferior to the quick stabs of a 1-handed sword or spear, and 2-hander infantry tends to get stun-locked in the pain animation when fighting in a standstill. They are much stronger in charges.

[Flinn]

3 hps not 2, thanks for pointing it Dragun

[DrDragun]

I was checking the stat on the Palantir myself as I had forgotten. For a moment I thought you were correct at 2 hp. I think we have a similar experience with Berzerkers; they are very effective in the right place but not quite the same as main-line general infantry.