Faction Re-textures by Massive_attack (not compatible with V4)

[Massive_attack]

Anyway, my post got lost, but Im planning on retexturing the muslim factions in THERA. There wont be a release soon, but i thought i should give you guys a heads up. The first faction im going to look at will be the Vashta.

Now id like to remind everyone I havent got permission for this yet. I wont ask untill i have a complete package to show, so this may or may not get approved. Time will tell, I suppose.

Im basing my concept for the vashta like this:

The vashta are a proud and strong people. Of the muslim nations, the Vashta have risen to technological superiority by embracing some of the new ways of the christian renaissance. They field armies of both the old and the new, and they are a unique force to be felt on the field. The vashta believe in their destiny to rule the world, and unite islam against the christian heathens (though some doubt this as little more than a bid for more power).

Vashta armies are the most ornate of all the factions. They enjoy adorning their armors with thin gold plates, and even there most mobile troops, like Yani Ceri are adopting chain mail hesitantly. The Vashta are not, however, a people to overly decorate their warriors. Most of the warriors the Vashta field are practical in nature, and while changes are ongoing, effort is made to respect the Vashta's heritage.

To this end, you can expect:
A slightly more decorative and flashy faction than the vanilla muslim turks
Better armoured Yani Ceri
Colour changes (much less green, im still going to leave some in there i think, but not alot)
An all around more appealing visual experience for the faction.

Edit: if any of this seems wrong or incorrect please let me know, Im focusing on the Yani Ceri right now, and id like to know if any of what i proposed strikes anyone as a bad idea.

[TheFirstONeill]

I look forward to seeing you weave your magic again mate.

[Daraunon]

I agree with your interpretation,looking forward to see the results of your work.

And I was just looking for an excuse to start a new Vashta campaign...

[Massive_attack]

The Yani Ceri are almost done. I had to stop and redo parts of them several times, overall they were fairly hard to work with, both in terms of the fiction surrounding these guys, their historical counterparts, and my interprettation.

Essentially my thoughts were "make them look organized, but not too organized..."
"give them armor, but too much armor"
"make them look unique... but not out of place"
"make them seem... wealthy, but not rich"

Ill upload some shots when im done (read: soon). Overall I think the Yani Ceri "Heavy Infantry" (pikemen) turned out the best, but thats just me.

Just a note for TFON, You might want to consider giving the Yani Ceri basic sword troops another armor upgrade, using the tier-one level armor from the Yani Ceri "Heavy Infantry" (pikemen), just with swords instead of the pikes. That'd be awesome

[TheFirstONeill]

Just a note for TFON, You might want to consider giving the Yani Ceri basic sword troops another armor upgrade, using the tier-one level armor from the Yani Ceri "Heavy Infantry" (pikemen), just with swords instead of the pikes. That'd be awesome

Thats not a problem, I will get that sorted. I will do the same for all the Yani Ceri troops.

[Massive_attack]

Hm, maybe not all. I mean, the faction would get boring if litterally all the yani ceri ended up looking exactly the same. Those troops compose a big chunk of the faction. Plus, it might be a bit imbalancing.

Maybe just the sword troops and the arquebusiers (since the Aquebusiers often get into melee combat after firing there last volley)

The mounted Yani Ceri and the Archers really dont need it if you ask me.

[Massive_attack]

Vashta Sultanate is now available for your viewing pleasure, first post updated.

...poor first post. its so fat and bloated. Ah well.

Enjoy !

Little note: I cant change the Hdars or Otjuks for legal reasons. They looked fine anyway, all i would have done was adjust the colours. No biggie.

[Torvus]

Those textures actually make me want to play the Vashta now. +rep to you, Massive_Attack.

[Massive_attack]

TFON, I was thinking, it would be totally awesome if the Yani Ceri arquebusiers could get an armor upgrade that uses the texture that the naffatun_ug1's (upgraded naffatun throwers, middle eastern mail) get. I just really want to see another unit use that texture

Edit: and yeah, the Vashta seriously needed more love from the players. They had to one of the most unplayed factions in the mod. To this day, Im still not even sure if they HAVE a fan thread. Shame too, since their roster was cool and now they just look cool. The Vashta are what the United Arab Emirates would be like in the middle ages. Rich, powerfull, and flashy. Great contrast to the other muslims (assorted desert dwellers and raiders) and the super militant "Oddly-reminds-me-of-Nasser" Barka. Honestly, im kind of itching to get my hands on the Barka, but the Tahar deserve a retouching more.

My next release wont happen for... at least a week or so. Probably more, im going to be busy, and I tend to go "OCD" when retexturing a faction, so im going to try and restrain myself from further work

[The Holy Pilgrim]

Very nice MA!

[Daraunon]

Great job Massive_attack,the Vashta now are really nice to look at. I was one of their fan because of their culture and roster,now I can appreciate their appearance as well.

I just started an Avalon campaign,so I won't start a Vashta one right away,but I was planning to send an army in Syrianna anyway...one more reason to do that I guess.

Can't wait for a revamp of the other Muslim factions,but take it easy,focus on real life as much as you need,we can wait.

I'd like to know what other faction or units would need some work in your opinion. No request here,mind you,just curious about your ideas.

EDIT:TFON,I just noticed that the megaupload link of the Faust-Privateers pack leads to the Battle of Demos download instead,might want to check...

[Massive_attack]

Other factions ? Hmm...

Well the holy order of the pale knight needs some work. My main issue with them is they have 0 unifying factors in the majority of there units, its just a mish mash of other stuff packed into one faction. That kind of annoys me, I suppose what i would do is try to incorporate more white as subtly as possible just to make the roster feel more unified. Also, some of their vanilla style shields could be made to look a little bit better. But i dont really want to touch them now.

The Royaume de Chevaliers need to have there own unique look imho, but i dont really know how to tackle them at all. Ive looked through online sources of "french-knights" but none of it ever fits this quintessential "knight in shining armor" faction. I tried changing the blue to light purple on some units but it looked horrible, I tried making some of there armors look even lighter but again, bad result. Im just leaving them for now, out of frustration.

Avalon is fine. All it needs is a retexture of the zweihanders to look like they belong in that faction. Ill admit though, I really want to see them in the faustian reich roster more XD but thats a debate i wont win so ill drop it.

The Dracule just need to look alot more serious. Right now alot of there units wear bright white and stuff, it just doesnt fit them well, makes them look less menacing. I would definately make that faction alot darker if i could. Id use alot of pitch blacks, bright reds, very slight bronze trimming for armor, and a few shades of brown as well. I was thinking that as an armor upgrade i could make blood knights have dark blood-red armor, that would be cool. However i want to wait untill they get there v4 graphical update before i do anything for them.

The Tahar need to stop looking so unified... and orange. They are essentially a group of independant tribes who have "sort-of" banded together under the caliph out of necessity. They are much less united than any of the other factions in the game. When i get around to them, you will see more "black" but also more bright colours. The entire faction will abandon any kind of "faction specific" coulouring, with the exception of only the most elite troops who serve the caliph. They are also going to be a faction with little-no gold decoration or the like. The Tahar are practical and hardy, troops with any kind of gold would be wrong. In fact, i was considering making some of the armor there heavier forces wear look like leather, but im still deciding that one. Overall, the faction will be really refreshing for players who tend to get bored of "sameness" quickly in their warriors.

The Barka are the most militant of the muslims in my opinion. There roster just feels more disciplined and better trained than the other muslims. These guys will be a treat to work on. I wont change there primary sand-like colour much, but ill be darkening the entire faction and working in new details. Playing the barka, you will feel like you command a military powerhouse, with a mighty war machine just raring to go !

I dont have any plans at all for the meso factions. They look fine as is. Not much i could change really.

I cant change the romuli out of respect for there creator. If i could, the only things that would really be edited would be the praetorians (they would have purple cloth), the horses (standard un armored horses have red saddles, elites have a few seperate coloured saddles) (armoured horses would be detailed, with gold silver and bronze plates adorning them) and maybe a better looking town militia (although Ive failed to really achieve this )

No plans at all for the uruk dominion. I would end up making the faction look stupid, i can tell. I have a hard time taking them seriously as it is, I wouldnt dare touch them.

No plans for the inquisition either.

I would totally retexture the teutonic knights if i didnt know that there existed textures that just blow my mind for them released ALREADY. Seriously, you guys need to look around and ask permission to use one of them in your mod. I have nothing on the guys that have made TO work, no really, i dont.

[TheFirstONeill]

Personally I feel the PK should be devoid of a faction based theme, since they are a collection of different crusaders from many peoples, granted now a couple of generations from the initial taking of Eden, but still a faction made up of blood stock from various Chiv' nations (as can be seen in the factions wide selection of names.

The Dracule will be entirely rebulit for V4, with a much later (tho not traditional Renn) look to them, armour will be less common so any time spent reskinning them, would be lost when V4 is out.

The Barka and Tahar would benefit from your eye, as at this point I havent made any choice for them to really change 'much' going into V4.

As for the TO, that was by far my favourite kingdom vanilla mod, and I always loved the vanilla skins for them, so I left them as it. Much like the use of the French skins for the Chevailiers (but I am a Manchester City fan, so blue is in my blood), I liked the skins so felt no need to reinvent the wheel. However if you can improve them, at least the player can make their own choice as to whether to use them or not.

[Massive_attack]

The chevalier and TO are very very low on my list of "priorities" at the moment, because mainly i know id bungle them badly if i tried anything. Any of my attempts on the chevaliers at all have resulted in grotesque looking forces. Which is why you (both TFON and others ) have never even seen them. Im leaving them as is untill i get a great idea or Ive done everything else id like to with this submod.

The Tahar and Barka take definate precidence. And there wasnt much wrong with the Pale knight, its just the faction roster was somewhat disjoined in that the units had little in common colour wise. All I would do for them is add White and yellow stipes or details here and there. Nothing nearly as extensive as my other retextures. Just slight "nip/tucks" here and there to create a common central theme, so to speak. Hospitallers would still look like hospitallers and templars like templars, they'd just have tiny extra details making both the templars and hospitallers look "like pale knights"

(That was an example, in reality i doubt i would change the Temps or Hospitallers much at all for fear it would affect all factions who use those troops, but you get the idea).

My standing on this is simply due to the pale knights being an order of knightly forces in there own right. It makes sense for the order to adopt at the least a minimal way of recognizing there fellow christian knight brothers apart from others, probably by making some sweeping rule that all under the banner of the pale knights must wear some band or strip of cloth somewhere signifying where their loyalties lay. Otherwise, i imagine there would be some confusion and a great deal of political upheaval since there would be less of a real command system, and alot more "diplomacy" just to get simple things done. Maybe this is what you were going for though, as a sort of parody of the kingdom of Jerusalem *shrug*

[Daraunon]

Mmmm I see...

The unifying factor in the PK could be the subtle use of the red-blue used on their tabards,but I'd be careful to keep the overall mismatched look,to reflect the fact that they're something like an alliance of chivalric factions and Knights from all over Christiandom.

I see your point with the Chevaliers,and I too think that Avalon is fine as it is,but...since they're the only 2 chiv factions it could be worth a try to make the Chevaliers stand out as the "shiny knights" you refer to by giving the Avalon some maybe darker look?Just an idea...or they could be rendered darker than Avalon,also as a way to separate the two societies:the Avalon are all in all pretty pious and care for their people,while the Chevaliers nobles only care about themselves usually.
Anyway,not a priority ATM

I agree with waiting to see how the Dracule will be in v4.(question to O'neil:by hinting at a more renn look to the Duchy,should we assume that they won't be merged with the TO yet?)

You think of the Tahar pretty much as I do,can't wait to see what you'll come up with. Same for the Barka,but I hope that they'll keep the somewhat "feudal" look,so we'll have three Muslim factions each with a unique look and feel beside their roster. It's interesting that you think of them as the most militarist,as the Vashta have already tried to conquer Slavia and the Tahar clearly state that they want to conquer anything they can,but with Syrianna invaded by Christians I think I understand what you mean. If there is some way to reflect the fact that the Barka are the most zealous Muslims it would be perfect. Maybe some crescent here and there?

The only thing that irks me with the Meso factions are the Eagle Warriors...maybe they should look something like the old Age of Empires 2 Eagle Warriors rather than the pajama wearing freaks they are now. Not a big issue anyway.

With the Romuli the only problem are some horses,they look almost cartoonish when compared with their riders.

The Uruks are fine IMHO,as are the TO. Their skins are good even vanilla,and they already stand out from other chiv factions,so no problem there.

EDIT:

I just read your other post,Massive_attack,the idea of strips of cloth is good IMHO,and could be worth a try. If there's some way to use red and blue,the PK colors,on Templars and Hospitaliers,it could be less of a problem than you think. After all Avalon's colour is red,and they use Hospitaliers,while the Chevaliers colour is blue,using Templars. With some subtle use of the two the overall result could be not too invasive and still give the PK a good unifying element.

[Agamemnon]

Yeah, but personally I actually prefer a completely mismatched unit roster. It reflects that they are a bunch of knights thrown together by the crusades, and, in reality, the knights of the era all looked different from each other anyway (heraldry). Personally, I would actually like to see less matching, as they are knights thrown togther, and I don't think that looking alike would make them better at all. I understand why you would want them to look more alike, I just don't think it is needed. I think that they are some of the least work-requiring factions, as they are already great.

[Daraunon]

The idea was giving them something like a patch of cloth or something to identify them as "crusaders".
Even in medieval times Knights of certain regions or Kingdoms theorically had to distinguish themselves by wearing the proper colours,even without putting completely aside heraldry,especially during crusades and the like,as it was the only way to organize hundreds of men coming from all over Europe. (example:knights from Kingdom A had to wear a green cross,those from Kingdom B had to wear a blue one etc...)

[Agamemnon]

Well, that makes sense, but don't make them go back to RTW! (with all the men looking identical)

[Daraunon]

Omg not if I can help it!!

[TheFirstONeill]

I would of thought that since they are fighting mulsim factions, if would be pretty easy to tell friend from foe ? In the current rosters the Pale knights wear the blues (from vanilla Anitoch), and the higher tier units wear white (from vanilla jeruselm) to signify their peity

But Im not discounting the 'patch ' idea, as always I would need to see the actual finished product beofre actually agreeing anything.

The TO-Dracule merger is off the the board and with the new rebuild it could never work now. So the TO and Dracule will continue to exist as very different factions from each other.

@ Massive_attack, I have the new version 4 blood knight model, you could reskin that if you like, ready for version 4.