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Thread: Armored Cars

  1. #1
    'Gunny's Avatar Überrock über alles
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    Default Armored Cars

    Since you plan to introduce tanks to the game, would it be possible to introduce its father as well, the Armored Car, used by every major nation

    Russia
    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Building of armored cars in Russia began right after the start of the First World War. On 17 August 1914 the Minister of Military Affaif s, Adjutant-General Suchomlinov, summoned an officer of the Leib-Guard Rifle Legion, Col. Dobrzanski, and ordered him to form and equip an "armored automobile machinegun battery" ("bronirovannaya pulemetnaya avtomobilnaya batareya"). This task was carried out in record short time and already by 19 October 1914 the 1-st Automobile Machinegun Company (1-ya Pulemetnaya Avtomobilnaya Rota) was sent to the front and placed at the disposal of the staff of the II Army. Initially its inventory contained 8 armored cars based on the Russo-Balt chassis and armed with machine-guns, and one based on the 5-ton Mannesman-Mulag armed truck and armed with a 47 mm naval cannon. In addition, the platoon automobile artillery had two unarmored trucks armed with automatic 37 mm Maxim-Nordenfeldt cannon. These could be fired from the truck bed or from the ground — on a wheeled carriage. Later the number of unarmored trucks with automatic 37 mm cannon increased to three.

    The production capabilities of the Russo-Baltic Car Factory, the only manufacturer of automobiles in Russia, absolutely did not allow building a sufficient number of chassis for armored cars. For this reason a special commission was sent to England under the leadership of the commander of the Auto­mobile Training Company, Col. Siekrietev, with the aim of buying a large number of motorized vehicles, among these also armored cars. As the result of this mission, 48 armored cars based on the Austin chassis, 40 on the Renault, and one on the Isotta-Fraschini were purchased.

    The first Austins, which were meant to become the basic type of armored car in the Russian Army, began arriving in Russia at the end of 1914. At the end of December the formation of an armored car platoon ("Pulemetny Avtomobilny Vzvod" — PAW) was started, and its inventory initially included three Austins. It is worth noting here that the 4 mm armor of English production was found to be totally inadequate. Because of this during the winter of 1915 all newly received Austins were sent to the Izorski factory where the English armor was replaced by 7 mm armor sheets produced in Russia.

    Battle experiences of the 1st Automobile Machinegun Company showed also the need for building cannon armed armored cars. To satisfy this need, at the begining of 1915 work began on armoring American 4-ton Garford automobiles in the Putilov factory, and arming them with a 76 mm cannon and three machine-guns. According to a new arrangement, each platoon of armored cars was to be equipped in two cars armed with machineguns and one with a cannon.

    During the spring of 1915 the first transports of disassembled Renault armored cars began to arrive. These were equipped with a machine-gun, but did not have full armor, and did not at all meet the requirements drawn by the Armored Car Commission of the Chief Technical-Military Command. A portion of these were used in the armored car platoon to deliver ammunition (mainly for cannon armed cars), and 11 were transferred to the Izorski factory with the aim of armoring them based on the design of Staff-Captain Mgiebrov.

    In total 16 cars were armored according to the system of Staff-Captain Mgiebrov. Besides Renaults these were: White, Pierce-Arrow, Benz, Isotta-Fraschini, and Russo-Balt "E". Installation of their armor was carried out in the Izhorski factory from spring to fall of 1915.
    At the same time 11 cars were equipped with armor according to the system of Staff-Captain Niekrasov in the private shops of A. Bratolyubov in Peterburg: 10 Russo-Balt and one Renault. Four of those were judged to be com­pletely unsuitable for front-line service; six others, armed with Hotchkiss 37 mm cannon, were assigned to a armored railroad platoon.

    In the Obukhowski factory 3 cars were ar­mored under the direction of Staff-Captain Bylinski, two based on Mercedes chassis (with engines of 45 and 50 hp), and one on the Lloyd chassis. The former were designed for military action in conjunction with cavalry units. The Lloyd armored car had two turrets with Maxim machineguns, and the Mercedes cars one each. The latter two were additionally armed with 37 mm cannon on the lower hull, in the back. A unique feature of these vehicles was the use of light armor of chromo-nickel-vanadium steel, and asteering system that used the rear pair of wheels. On basis of these cars the 25th Platoon of Automobile Machine-guns was formed.

    During the second half of 1915 and during winter and spring of 1916 additional 161 armored cars arrived in Russia. Of these 60 were based on the Austin 2nd series chassis, 10 Armstrong-Whitworth-Jarrot, 30 Armstrong-Whitworth-Fiat, 25 Sheffield-Simplex, and 35 Army Motor Lorries. However, only the Austins were judged fit for battle action. The Armstrong-Whitworth armored cars, based both on the Jarrot and Fiat chassis, revealed serious mechanical and other shortcomings, seriously limiting their combat capabilities. For this reason the Armstrong-Whitworth cars underwent modifications: those build on Jarrot chassis received new front axles, their rear suspensions and front shock absorbers were strengthened, armored cupolas were installed in the roofs of the turrets, and the barrels of the machineguns were provided with armor. The rebuild Jarrot and Fiat armored cars began arriving at the front during the end of 1916 and beginning of 1917.

    As to the Sheffield-Simplex and Armstrong Motor Lorries armored cars, these had not been transferred to the army at all due to their total unsuitability for military service. One Sheffield-Simplex car was send to the Kolomienski factory, where it was adopted to be used on railroad tracks. It was planned to modify all cars of this make for in this fashion.
    For completion of the newly formed units (based on the Austin 2 series of cars), PAW needed new armored cars armed with cannon. To solve this problem in the shortest time possible, it was decided to arm 22 Lanchester armored cars (assigned previously to an Eng­lish armored squadron) with 37 mm Hotchkiss cannon. Work connected with these modifications was completed during the spring of 1916, and the Lanchesters were successfully used at the front.
    In the summer of 1916 armoring of 30 Jeffery cars begun according to the system of Staff-Captain Poplavko, which were subsequently used to form the Armored Company for Special Missions.

    It is worth noting here that in September of 1916 Russian Army armored car units trans­ferred to the divisional system. Besides the already mentioned division of Staff-Captain Poplavko, 12 other divisions of armored cars were formed, each made up of 3-4 PAWs. Organization into platoons was retained only in places where such organization made sense, for example on the Caucasus.

    In order to speed up production of armored cars, it was decided, besides purchasing of 60 Austin 3 series armored cars from England, to organize large-scale domestic manufacture of armored cars based on imported automobile chassis. To this end 60 Austin and 90 Fiat chassis were ordered, which were to be ar­mored in the Putilov and Izhorski factories. However, because of the lateness in receiving these chassis, the factories could only begin the job at end of 1917. Until October it was possible to make only 16 armored cars based on the Fiat chassis. The situation with the Austins was even worse — in 1917 none of left the factory.

    Together with Austins and Fiats, it was planned to armor 31 Packard chassis in the Obukhowski factory according to the system developed by Lt. Ulianov. Only one car based on this chassis was completed, however, due to exceedingly great weight of the finished product. The Packard was armed with a Maxim-Nordenfeldt 37 mm automatic cannon mounted on the body and a Maxim 7.62 mm machine-gun in a small turret placed at the rear of the automobile.

    A separate page in the history of Russian armored cars were halftrack vehicles built according to the design of A. Kegress, the director of the Technical Section of the garage of His Imperial Highness. In the summer and fall of 1916 trials took place with an Austin series 2 equipped with a track mechanism of his design. The results were sufficiently satisfactory and it was decided to equip with tracks part of the Austins and Fiats, and all of the Packards build in the Obukhovski factory, and also 20 FWD chassis, which were to be armored inthe Putilov factory. In perspective, it was antici­pated that all armored cars of the Russian Army would be equipped with the Kegress chassis. However, these plans were never put into effect. On the way to their realization stood the Russian revolution, after which A. Kegress left Russia.

    At the end a mention has to be made of Russian plans to build tanks. The issue here are not the prototype designs of A. Porochovshchikov ("Viezdyechod") and Lebiedenko, properly rejected by the Chief Military-Technical Directorate, but the pro­gram to purchase tanks abroad. It was planed that in 1917—18 360 Schneider tanks would be obtained, and in addition interest was shown in a version of the Renault FT17 tank equipped with a machine gun. The only Rus­sian project that had any chance of being put into production was a 12 ton tank armed with a 75 mm cannon and one machinegun, which was presented to the Chief Military-Technical Directorate by the Russkiy Renault partnership at the end of 1916. There is no doubt that Russian industry, whose manufacturing possi­bilities were at their peak in the fall of 1916, was capable of producing tanks.
    However, the year 1917 arrived — the February revolution, the Kornilov rebellion, the November overthrow of the government —and no one at that time thought about tanks...

    this is just an example, armored cars were made from every type of car produced an took the forms of everything from

    and (In turkey)

    to


    (yes i know its a model) and

    IMO these should be included in the game as more lightly armored but faster versions of the tanks planned to be implemented. as of now im beginning to worry that i may have already seen something about this so just in case im going to stop, if i have here is some extra information, if i havent seen the idea before however, i think it would be a good addition to the game later on down the road

  2. #2

    Default Re: Armored Cars

    The first picture is...interesting. I suppose this would be possible, but I don't think we can have a man that is manning the machine gun die if he is hit and stop firing the machine gun but the vehicle will keep rolling?

    EDIT: Almost forget to rep you mate, sorry about that. +rep eh?
    Last edited by Icey Fresh Werewolf; August 19, 2010 at 09:00 PM.
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  3. #3
    'Gunny's Avatar Überrock über alles
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    Default Re: Armored Cars

    hehe the first picture was more of a joke, i had a much better developed writing, but i accidently changed page and it lost it all

  4. #4
    B-DizL's Avatar TGW Lead Modeller
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    Default Re: Armored Cars

    I would like to see armored cars added eventually... nice info + rep

  5. #5
    Darkhorse's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Armored Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Icey Fresh Werewolf View Post
    The first picture is...interesting. I suppose this would be possible, but I don't think we can have a man that is manning the machine gun die if he is hit and stop firing the machine gun but the vehicle will keep rolling?

    EDIT: Almost forget to rep you mate, sorry about that. +rep eh?
    It's a Simms design "F.R Simms Quadricycle Maxim Gun Carrier", dates back to 1898.

    He also made the 1902 War Car, armed with a 1pdr Maxim.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Armored Cars

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkhorse View Post
    It's a Simms design "F.R Simms Quadricycle Maxim Gun Carrier", dates back to 1898.

    He also made the 1902 War Car, armed with a 1pdr Maxim.
    Ah, good info mate. +rep
    New website for AtC (Advance to Combat, formerly known as Nations at War) Check it out here! We average 155 unique hits a day! AtC is a mod for Empire Total War focusing on implementing modern-day units into custom battles.

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  7. #7
    RO Citizen's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Armored Cars

    If we make the tanks, ofc!!!
    [Col] RO Citizen

  8. #8
    The Hedge Knight's Avatar Fierce When Cornered
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    Default Re: Armored Cars

    In many ways i think single turreted armoured cars may be simpler than tanks to implement...

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