Faction speculation thread

[Visarion]

Carpi/Costoboci/Bastarnae/Proto-Slavs/Iazyges (later known as Brodnici) could fill that gap indeed!

[Mediolanicus]

And Personally i think 1 Gallic Faction is more then Enough... A maximum of 2 Celtic factions, and im happy

That would be a bit strange considering that Celtic culture was the leading culture in Western Europe...
That's like saying 1 Hellenic factionis more than enough, a maximum of two hellenic faction in Southern Europe and the Eastern portion of the map, and I'm happy...

[Visarion]

Oh yes I also forgot about the Triballoi! I better make a list!

My list:

1) Carpi/Costoboci/Bastarnae/Proto-Slavs/Iazyges/Roxolani (later known as Brodnici)
2) Triballoi or Odrysae
3) Autariatae, Ardiaioi (Ardiaei) or Dardani
4) Scordisci or Serdi/Tylis
5) Caucasian Iberia
6) Media Atropatene
7) Nabateea
8) Syracuse
9) Norici (Pannoni+Taurisci)


Excluded: Bithynia, Massalia, Cyrene, Massaesyli, Mauryans, Scythia etc.

Edit: By the way is Arevaci confirmed?

[Valkar]

That would be a bit strange considering that Celtic culture was the leading culture in Western Europe...
That's like saying 1 Hellenic factionis more than enough, a maximum of two hellenic faction in Southern Europe and the Eastern portion of the map, and I'm happy...

First mediolanicus, you said i talked somewhat Rude. Im not English, and my English is far from formal. I have no idea when i talk rude or polite, so please don't rate my english, i can't help it.

The Celts had a dominant culture, but if spoil 2 faction slots only to Gauls, its a waste.
Visarion proposed the Norici, i thinks its a great idea.

i totally agree with you about the Hellenic factions.

Oh yes I also forgot about the Triballoi! I better make a list!

My list:

1) Carpi/Costoboci/Bastarnae/Proto-Slavs/Iazyges (later known as Brodnici)
2) Triballoi or Odrysae
3) Autariatae, Ardiaioi (Ardiaei) or Dardani
4) Scordisci or Serdi/Tylis
5) Caucasian Iberia
6) Media Atropatene
7) Nabateea
8) Syracuse
9) Norici (Pannoni+Taurisci)

Excluded: Bithynia, Massalia, Cyrene, Massaesyli, Mauryans etc.

1)I don't like the Carpi. Costoboci, Bastarnae are OK, Slavs should have a own faction slot, but i do not like the Iazyges.
2) Thracians? I like them, they should add them
3) Another Thracian folk? Mwah...
4) Tylis? again in Thrace?
5) A very good idea
6) Medians?
7) Only the thoughest Players can survive with Nabateea, think how fast Ptolemaic Egypt and the Seleucids they attack them
8) A independent Syracuse? Is that worth it? I think Syracuse should be part of some Greek federation with Corinth.
9) Could be a idea for another Celtic faction. Their position is ideal, and they could replace Arveni.


My new list, with Historical Arguments( Yes Mediolanicus)
1. Fenni (, a Balkan tribe, with onknown ancesteros (Germanic, Fin-Ugrish, maybe Sarmatian, maybe Balto-slavic)Fills the Gap that was in EB1)
2. Norici (nice position, Halstatt Period culture (so lots of information)
3. Wielbark Goths (yes around 500 BC)
4. Belgae (historical significant (known as the Bravest and thoughest of all Gauls)(Germanic Ancestors and dominant Culture, so much information)
5. Picts or Caledonii replace the Pritanoi

[Visarion]

Fenni Balkan tribe? I must have dazzled you with all my Balkan propositions! You mean Baltic right? By the way I was only suggesting Bastarnae with some Dacian and Sarmatian AOR!

I would sure like to see a battle between Bastarnae and Dardani!

Edit 1) My wishlist is:

1) Bastarnae
2) Dardani
3) Norici

Edit 2) Reasons:

Scordisci - we already have Boii

Odrysi and Tribaloi were invaded by Autariatae, Scordisci and Serdi

Autariatae and other Illyrians allied in many occasions with the stronger Dardani

Arevaci, Media Atropatene or Caucasian Iberia, Nabateea or Syracuse are still in!

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Edit 3) Why Dardani? because they defeated Macedonians, Epirotes and Celts in more then one occasions and because they comprised both Illyrian and Thracian tribes!

Edit 4) Why Bastarnae? because they had Sarmatian and Dacian allies and were very mobile, participating in many major battles!

Edit 5) Why Norici? simple! Hallstatt Culture: the best weapons and metal in ancient times! Plus they fill another gap!

[wiande]

Not bad idea, the Bastarnae! It fills a gap between thracia/dacia and Germans
Wich faction you've got in mind?
And Personally i think 1 Gallic Faction is more then Enough... A maximum of 2 Celtic factions, and im happy

was refering to the lugiones, feeling up the gap in actual poland

i think two celtic factions is good in gaul cause it represent the fact that there was no unity in gaul, even if they trade with each other they weren't united (at least that's what we learnt in school when we were young)

[Valkar]

There wasn't unity in Germania ether, but in many mods there's only one faction :/ so i think thats not a good argumant

[Visarion]

Another reason for Bastarnae then! Plus that great void filled!

[wiande]

Oh yes I also forgot about the Triballoi! I better make a list!

My list:

1) Carpi/Costoboci/Bastarnae/Proto-Slavs/Iazyges/Roxolani (later known as Brodnici)
2) Triballoi or Odrysae
3) Autariatae, Ardiaioi (Ardiaei) or Dardani
4) Scordisci or Serdi/Tylis
5) Caucasian Iberia
6) Media Atropatene
7) Nabateea
8) Syracuse
9) Norici (Pannoni+Taurisci)

Excluded: Bithynia, Massalia, Cyrene, Massaesyli, Mauryans, Scythia etc.
Edit: By the way is Arevaci confirmed?

1) i love the bastarnae ^^
2) odrysae dosen't match the EB 2 era
3) again unsignificant, and directly close to the epirote's
4) i don't think they were significant enough to be a faction + with another tracian faction will be rendered useless
5) with the already existing iberia faction + atropatene, would prevent any rise of one iberia faction, and it's always best to keep all factions the longuest according to me
6) sounds good
7) i lack knowledge in those
8) a city state like syracuse should'nt be a faction, and should not be related to the koinon hellenon's faction cause they were involved in the carthaginian/roman conflict
9)i don't agree, there's already a faction here, + the taurisci were peaceful and weak, so not relevant as a faction

[wiande]

There wasn't unity in Germania ether, but in many mods there's only one faction :/ so i think thats not a good argumant

lugiones will simulate the abscene of german unity, cause i guess the german and the lugiones will be at war pretty quick

[Visarion]

agree... except 3) Dardani were not at all insignificant!

so I propose a new list:

1) Bastarnae
2) Dardani
3) Arevaci
4) Media Atropatene or Caucasian Iberia
5) Noricum, Syracuse, Nabateea or Belgae

[wiande]

ok for dardani,

i was also wondering if there could be a system of events (like in europa universalis 2), considering the small scripts in EB i guess the game RTW wasn't made for such scripts, maybe it's different in MTW2, i didn't played MTW2 much so i don't know.

[Valkar]

lugiones will simulate the abscene of german unity, cause i guess the german and the lugiones will be at war pretty quick

Are the Lugii Germanic? is the question. Its still a discussion what they are; Proto-slavic, Baltic, Germanic or Celtic.
Personally i see them as Germano-Balts.

[Mediolanicus]

1.mediolanicus, you said i talked somewhat Rude. Im not English, and my English is far from formal. I have no idea when i talk rude or polite, so please don't rate my english, i can't help it.


2. Norici (nice position, Halstatt Period culture (so lots of information)
3. Wielbark Goths (yes around 500 BC)
4. Belgae (historical significant (known as the Bravest and thoughest of all Gauls)(Germanic Ancestors and dominant Culture, so much information)
5. Picts or Caledonii replace the Pritanoi

6. There wasn't unity in Germania ether, but in many mods there's only one faction :/ so i think thats not a good argumant

7. Are the Lugii Germanic?

1. It was not how you said it, in was what you said... drop this, change that, replace that.
2, 4 and your various comments on Gaul. Gaul is an area. The people are Celts. Arverni and Aedui do not represent Gaul, they represent Celtic confederacies, like the Norici, Helvetii, Remi, etc...
3. Can you give me a source on that. I still believe the Goths as a significant culture, even in gotland, is just after the Eb time frame
5. Picts.. few centuries too early; Caledonia is also the name of an area. And Caledonii just the name for the confederation of different tribes that came together to fight against the Romans.
And this is a fine example of what I mean by being rude to the people who spend hours and hours of historical research and gałe development.
6. What other mods do has never been an arguement for EB. Besides, the Sweboz do not represent a united Germany in any way. Also, for RTW mods, you have to remember the lower faction limit.
7. From what I make up out of the various EB II previews there are possible shifts towards one culture or the other, depending on how the player expands (but I am in no way certain of this). though historically, yes there is a lot of debate on in what group many which tribe fits.

[Visarion]

Are the Lugii Germanic? is the question. Its still a discussion what they are; Proto-slavic, Baltic, Germanic or Celtic.

maybe all... knowing that the Bastarnae were Celts, Germans, Dacians and Sarmatians. Even Cimbri were at first Celts that brought the runic script in Scandinavia from the Alps and merged with the Germans. It seems the Germans assimilated many nations: Celts, Scythians, Sarmatians, Balts, Slavs etc. Only those from Scandinavia remained pure. And those that left were the dominant class wherever they went! We all know that the rulling class of the Slavs had German names for a very long period of time! I'm not saying they interbred I'm just saying the people they ruled were a mix of many nations! Of course Bastarnae were later assimilated by Sarmatians so it goes both ways!

[Valkar]

1. It was not how you said it, in was what you said... drop this, change that, replace that.
2, 4 and your various comments on Gaul. Gaul is an area. The people are Celts. Arverni and Aedui do not represent Gaul, they represent Celtic confederacies, like the Norici, Helvetii, Remi, etc...
3. Can you give me a source on that. I still believe the Goths as a significant culture, even in gotland, is just after the Eb time frame
5. Picts.. few centuries too early; Caledonia is also the name of an area. And Caledonii just the name for the confederation of different tribes that came together to fight against the Romans.
And this is a fine example of what I mean by being rude to the people who spend hours and hours of historical research and gałe development.
6. What other mods do has never been an arguement for EB. Besides, the Sweboz do not represent a united Germany in any way. Also, for RTW mods, you have to remember the lower faction limit.
7. From what I make up out of the various EB II previews there are possible shifts towards one culture or the other, depending on how the player expands (but I am in no way certain of this). though historically, yes there is a lot of debate on in what group many which tribe fits.

1. OK its a bit rude, but it are friendly suggestions, not rude orders
2. There are still many Historians who see the Gauls as a unique group, apart from the Celts. Their Culture was Celtic (ofc!) but the people, that still not 100% Certain.
3.Wielbark Culture or Willenberg Culture was an archaeological culture which appeared during the first half of the 1st century AD, and replaced the local Oksywie Culture, a culture which was part of the Przeworsk culture. It is identified with the Goths
5. Bloody Hell.
6. Yes, but that means EB1 did neglect the other Germanic factions
7. True

[Visarion]

after seeing the territory of the Boii I agree with Wiande about Norici!

@ Valkar: Goths were isignificant at that time, Bastarnae were more important!

@ Valkar: Back then the world was controlled by Greeks and Celts!

@ Valkar: Only after by Romans and later Germans!

[Valkar]

Or Boii or Norici, not both, otherwise its too crowded there (Norici, Germans, Romans, Illyrians, Boii)

[Mediolanicus]

Boii are already in.
And it seems we both agree then that anything identifiable with Goths is way out of the EB timeframe.
And even if "Gauls" are to be considered a different category, the Aedui and Arverni do not represent them. They represent the Arverni and Aedui tribal confederacy respectively.

[Valkar]

I still think two Celtic factions In Gaul are too much.
What is the EB Timeframe? around 500 Bc i thought? Then the Goths are no possibility.. maybe a Scandinavian Faction?