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Thread: [HISTORICAL ISSUE] - Historical films from balkan states

  1. #41
    MeAgain's Avatar Wimmer
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by Bagatyr View Post
    you writhe : "I am born for Metka" is that ,a girl ?
    Yes, that's his girlfriend.

    Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

    The documentary (from NapoleonSRB) shows everything from a British perspective. I find some aspects a little confusing. They consider Bosnian Serbs and Serbians to be Serbian, so some things don't add up.

    Basically, Serbians (including Bosnian Serbs) are to to be blamed for everything: Austro-Hungary had to defend its empire from anarchy forced upon them by Serbia. Russia and France had to defend these poor, pathetic people and Britain was an innocent by-stander who got caught up in this mess... all caused by "Bosnian Serbians". Did I miss something?
    Ooooo, yeee, Germany was also somehow involved, who would have taught? Yes, and something about Italy.

    I am amased someone (from the west) actually bothered to make a documentary about us at all. That doesn't happen often...even if some things are a little bias and wrong, they seem to have most of it right. I credit them for having a go.

    P.S. Where was the War Crimes Tribunal then?
    Last edited by MeAgain; May 21, 2010 at 12:00 AM.

  2. #42
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by MeAgain View Post
    Yes, that's his girlfriend.

    Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

    The documentary (from NapoleonSRB) shows everything from a British perspective. I find some aspects a little confusing. They consider Bosnian Serbs and Serbians to be Serbian, so some things don't add up.

    Basically, Serbians (including Bosnian Serbs) are to to be blamed for everything: Austro-Hungary had to defend its empire from anarchy forced upon them by Serbia. Russia and France had to defend these poor, pathetic people and Britain was an innocent by-stander who got caught up in this mess... all caused by "Bosnian Serbians". Did I miss something?
    Ooooo, yeee, Germany was also somehow involved, who would have taught? Yes, and something about Italy.

    I am amased someone (from the west) actually bothered to make a documentary about us at all. That doesn't happen often...even if some things are a little bias and wrong, they seem to have most of it right. I credit them for having a go.

    P.S. Where was the War Crimes Tribunal then?
    The Serbians and the Bosnian Serbs are one people divided by the river drina[same relligion,race,language,...]
    But in that time there were diference and the "Young Bosnia"[I dont know why do everyone call it the "Black hand organisation"] fought for Bosnia not for Serbia,Serbia was just driven in...The Austro-Hungarians wanted to conquer Serbia and they found a good reason in Sarajevo...Serbia didnt want to give what belongs to them and they were blamed for starting the war...[as ussual]

    P.S whats the point,General Misic would probably get 50 years for some massacre that happened on the western front...
    Rodjen za Metka

    Za sve Srpske dusmane!

    Kosovo is Serbia!

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  3. #43
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Although we are all Serbs(Srbi), we are not all Serbian(from Serbia). I know Austro-Hungary was just using that as an excuse, most historians nowdays agree that if the catalist for the first WW wasn't Sarajevo, someone would have caused one elsewhere. It was inevitable and unavoidable, at that time. I don't know what you mean by: "Serbia didnt want to give what belongs to them and they were blamed for starting the war", but the list of demands from Austro-Hungary was not just completely ludicrous but impossible to fulfill.

    Unlikely, but possible (I guess).
    Hard to say...Serbia was still considered as an ally by the 'Allies', so who knows? The main reason (I think) is that, as that documentary shows, no one gave a damn about the Serbian (and Bosnian) people at that time, or at any other realy. Not even the King of Serbia, to be honest.
    Last edited by MeAgain; May 21, 2010 at 01:46 AM.

  4. #44
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    i didnt read the ultimatum [so i think that was something abaut giving money teritories and licking ass to the hungarians]

    u are from what city?

    for those on the east we were the west and for those on teh west we were the east[noone gives a damm for us]
    Rodjen za Metka

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    Kosovo is Serbia!

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  5. #45
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    I'm from Bosnian Krajina, if you want more PM me.

  6. #46
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by Carpathian Wolf View Post
    Bulgarian wasn't an administrative language in Romania. Again it was Romanian written in Cyrillic alphabet. You wouldn't call Polish a latin language because they use a latin alphabet would you?
    No, but it was an administrative and church language in the so-called Romanian principalities before they became Romania. If you try to read the originals of many of the Wallachian decrees, you'll have to learn Middle-Bulgarian to understand most of them (as I said, sometimes only the "intros" and "outros" were on Bulgarian, while the "content" was on Wallachian with Cyrillic letters, but a lot of the times (if not most) it was entirely on Bulgarian). If you don't believe me, I'm sure you can check the originals of the various Wallachian decrees and make a conclusion yourself.

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  7. #47
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Nike, this time i will have to disagree with you. The bulgarian language was not used in the administration of principalities and was used in the church only early on. The cyrilic alphabet was used but the language was still romanian. Of course it wasn't modern Romanian with all the standardised rules, but I have seen texts written in the middle ages ages from Moldavian and Wallachia and it's all written in Romanian. For example, I have seen the the tombstones of Wallachian voivodes with cyrilic writting on them and a plaque next to them showing the same text but with latin alphabet and I could tell that the actual words were the same.
    Last edited by Wallachian; May 21, 2010 at 11:59 PM.

  8. #48
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by NikeBG View Post
    No, but it was an administrative and church language in the so-called Romanian principalities before they became Romania. If you try to read the originals of many of the Wallachian decrees, you'll have to learn Middle-Bulgarian to understand most of them (as I said, sometimes only the "intros" and "outros" were on Bulgarian, while the "content" was on Wallachian with Cyrillic letters, but a lot of the times (if not most) it was entirely on Bulgarian). If you don't believe me, I'm sure you can check the originals of the various Wallachian decrees and make a conclusion yourself.
    You know i've heard this sort of thing before and when I looked more into it the language used sometimes was actually Church Slavonic. Now Bulgarians like to say it is one in the same thing, but it really isn't. It's related of course. But even in our Church language we have certain words of latin origin that could only have come from Latin pre 300s AD. I was taken to a monastery last summer with bibles there written in the medieval age by hand using Cyrillic and they were read to me directly in Romanian and I could understand it easily.
    "Mors Certa, Hora Incerta."

    "We are a brave people of a warrior race, descendants of the illustrious Romans, who made the world tremor. And in this way we will make it known to the whole world that we are true Romans and their descendants, and our name will never die and we will make proud the memories of our parents." ~ Despot Voda 1561

    "The emperor Trajan, after conquering this country, divided it among his soldiers and made it into a Roman colony, so that these Romanians are descendants, as it is said, of these ancient colonists, and they preserve the name of the Romans." ~ 1532, Francesco della Valle Secretary of Aloisio Gritti, a natural son to Doge

  9. #49
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    The Serbians and the Bosnian Serbs are one people divided by the river drina[same relligion,race,language,...]
    But in that time there were diference and the "Young Bosnia"[I dont know why do everyone call it the "Black hand organisation"] fought for Bosnia not for Serbia,Serbia was just driven in...The Austro-Hungarians wanted to conquer Serbia and they found a good reason in Sarajevo...Serbia didnt want to give what belongs to them and they were blamed for starting the war...[as ussual]

    P.S whats the point,General Misic would probably get 50 years for some massacre that happened on the western front...
    I was born in Sarajevo in 1986. And I've lived in the Netherlands since like 1993 till today. My primary school and gymnasium I finished in the Netherlands. So I also learned history together with Dutch children. I remember when we discussed the WWI in our class in the Netherlands. Our book and our teacher teached us the following facts about WWI. This book from which we were learning the facts around WW1 is today still the same and 17 million peoples from the Netherlands grew up with this. This book says:

    "During the visit of the Austro-Hungarian Prins Frans Ferdinand; Serb nationalists who were under supervision of Belgrade, killed the Austro-Hungarian prins in an attempt to make the way clear to annexate Bosnia to Serbia."

    When I teached this in the Netherlands I could not believe it. Because my mother and my father teached me that Gavrilo Princip was some kind of "hero".
    Last edited by Bosnian_King; May 22, 2010 at 09:30 AM.
    kada se bjehmo svadili, tada nas Stjepan Rajkovic umiri i da nam nas grad Bobovac, a neda ga dati Ugrom.

    "And when we were in a quarrel between each other; Stijepan Rajkovic calmed us down. And we entrusted our capital of Bobovac to him after which he defended it against the Hungarians (King Tvrtko I Kotromanic 1366.)"

  10. #50
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    cause he killed our next king? why?

  11. #51
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Once again, it's all a matter of perspectives. No-one knows for sure what anybody's intentions were back then.

    As far as Gavrilo is concerned, he was acting for what he believed would bring freedom to Bosnia and Herzegovina. There is no reason for Bosnian (whatever their religion or nationality) people to see him any different. What he did is certainly not something to laugh at.

    I should also point out that majority of the people in Bosnia at that time saw the Austro-Hungarians as just another invader and wanted them out as much as they did the Ottomans.
    Last edited by MeAgain; May 22, 2010 at 10:06 AM.

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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by Hrobatos View Post
    cause he killed our next king? why?
    Yes we learn here in the Netherlands that Serbian nationalists wanted to annexate Bosnia. It is really true. And that because of that they killed the "protectors of Bosnia" the Austro-Hungarian prince....
    kada se bjehmo svadili, tada nas Stjepan Rajkovic umiri i da nam nas grad Bobovac, a neda ga dati Ugrom.

    "And when we were in a quarrel between each other; Stijepan Rajkovic calmed us down. And we entrusted our capital of Bobovac to him after which he defended it against the Hungarians (King Tvrtko I Kotromanic 1366.)"

  13. #53
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    bosnian king,gavrilo didnt want freedom for serbs, he wanted freedom for all people in bosnia...
    Rodjen za Metka

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    Kosovo is Serbia!

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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    bosnian king,gavrilo didnt want freedom for serbs, he wanted freedom for all people in bosnia...
    I don't know what he wanted or what he did not want. I only say what the people (or the children) of the Netherlands learn in school about this.
    kada se bjehmo svadili, tada nas Stjepan Rajkovic umiri i da nam nas grad Bobovac, a neda ga dati Ugrom.

    "And when we were in a quarrel between each other; Stijepan Rajkovic calmed us down. And we entrusted our capital of Bobovac to him after which he defended it against the Hungarians (King Tvrtko I Kotromanic 1366.)"

  15. #55
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    anti serb propaganda
    Rodjen za Metka

    Za sve Srpske dusmane!

    Kosovo is Serbia!

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  16. #56
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    anti serb propaganda
    I don't know man. I just say what people here learn. I am just the messenger. Don't shoot the messenger.
    kada se bjehmo svadili, tada nas Stjepan Rajkovic umiri i da nam nas grad Bobovac, a neda ga dati Ugrom.

    "And when we were in a quarrel between each other; Stijepan Rajkovic calmed us down. And we entrusted our capital of Bobovac to him after which he defended it against the Hungarians (King Tvrtko I Kotromanic 1366.)"

  17. #57
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    THIS IS SPARTAAAA!!!

    i know but it is just tipicay anti-serb propaganda,
    "the serbs wanted bosnia so they started the war by recruiting some assassins and killing Franza Ferdinand,they lost in the war every third adult man, it was just a plan to create a great serbia blabala "
    Rodjen za Metka

    Za sve Srpske dusmane!

    Kosovo is Serbia!

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  18. #58
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by NapoleonSRB View Post
    THIS IS SPARTAAAA!!!

    i know but it is just tipicay anti-serb propaganda,
    "the serbs wanted bosnia so they started the war by recruiting some assassins and killing Franza Ferdinand,they lost in the war every third adult man, it was just a plan to create a great serbia blabala "
    Yes my friend. This mod is about the middle ages. Please let's not talk about other periods.
    kada se bjehmo svadili, tada nas Stjepan Rajkovic umiri i da nam nas grad Bobovac, a neda ga dati Ugrom.

    "And when we were in a quarrel between each other; Stijepan Rajkovic calmed us down. And we entrusted our capital of Bobovac to him after which he defended it against the Hungarians (King Tvrtko I Kotromanic 1366.)"

  19. #59
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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    the topic is called "Historical films abaut balkans"

    Is this a historical film[what i posted]?
    yes

    Is this a wrong period?
    no[the topic is called "Historical films abaut balkans"]

    Did i started the conversations about that what i posted?
    no
    Rodjen za Metka

    Za sve Srpske dusmane!

    Kosovo is Serbia!

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    Default Re: Historical films from balkan states

    Quote Originally Posted by Bosnian_King View Post
    Yes we learn here in the Netherlands that Serbian nationalists wanted to annexate Bosnia. It is really true. And that because of that they killed the "protectors of Bosnia" the Austro-Hungarian prince....
    I don't know what Serbian nationalists wanted (but you are probably right) and I don't particularly care because I am not from there.

    I can tell you that there were almost no people in the whole of Bosnia and Herzegovina that considered the Austro-Hungarians or their prince as "protectors of Bosnia". They were asked for help against the Ottomans, not to govern once they were kicked out.

    By that time, almost all the people of Bosnia considered them to be just a replacement of the Ottomans. Also, it is fair to say that majority of the Bosnian people at that time were not much better off under the "protection" of Austro-Hungarians than they were under the rule of Ottomans.

    Gavrilo was acting for the Bosnian people with the help from Serbian nationalists, () he didn't kill Franz Ferdinand so that the annexation of Bosnia could take place. He did it so these new "invaders" would be kicked out.

    What you learned in Neatherlands is from the political perspective of that country. That is deffinitely not the way his action were seen among the people of Bosnia and Herzegovina, then as well as now. There is no reason why he shouldn't be considered a "hero" for all the people of our country. Anywhere else in the world his actions would elevate him to that status, but when it comes to Bosna you and I have to waste time arguing about it.

    I hope this is the end of this, because if we continue someone will close this thread down and ruin it for everybody else who wishes to see/post more "historical films/documentaries", etc. If there is something in particular you want to discuss, feel free to PM me, you can also post some videos of your own.
    Last edited by MeAgain; May 22, 2010 at 09:41 PM.

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