Russia vs Britain

[Fotchimus]

I'm playing a mp campaign as Russia and my friend as Britain. The objective to win is to take London and that seems difficult to say the least. Though I'm sure for him taking Moscow would be equally hard. So my question is how should I go about winning?

Some things about the game so far:
1. He did well in the early naval battles and captured the French and Spanish 1st rates making his navy even more ridiculous. Making any sort of navy that can compete with his seems almost out of the question. We're about equal skill in naval battles.

2. I'm quite a bit better in land battles than he is and can defeat him with an inferior force. I managed to wipe out the Ottoman empire and replace them with one giant Romanian protectorate very early in the game.

3. We are still allied by default at the moment. I'm also allied with Prussia, Austria, and Sweden still. Would it be a good idea to get out the coalition and ally with France instead?

[Dreamw4lk3r]

I don't know if you'll be succesfull with allying, I've tried as france and it never stays... I think it's programmed that the coallition (excluding prussia who doesn't start as coallition) forces will eventually always declare war.

I'd say you're in for a tough fight since GB's land units are very good (too bad for their short range arty tho) and sneaking across to GB for invasion from russia would be nearly impossible + losing a fleet with army would severly weaken your faction I bet.
But since you are better at land battles, if you can gain a foothold on brittish soil i'm sure you'll have np to win.

As france i managed to distract my enemy and human player as GB like this:
I sailed my french navy around nelson guarding the channel and assaulted his trade ships behind GB; he chased after me with nelson and while i gave him a nice run I also dropped an army with a sloop at ireland which had no defenses to speak of, looted it and moved on to scotland.. i could ravage and loot and by the time he has an army i could settle in scotland if i wished .

Now I do realise that sneaking a sloop across the channel is way easier than getting through the baltic and past the gap between dk & sweden if he closes that off.. (the mediteranean is also not a great option for similar reasons + being far away) but a distraction could work..

Hope this helps a bit ^^'

[Slaists]

I'm playing a mp campaign as Russia and my friend as Britain. The objective to win is to take London and that seems difficult to say the least. Though I'm sure for him taking Moscow would be equally hard. So my question is how should I go about winning?

Some things about the game so far:
1. He did well in the early naval battles and captured the French and Spanish 1st rates making his navy even more ridiculous. Making any sort of navy that can compete with his seems almost out of the question. We're about equal skill in naval battles.

2. I'm quite a bit better in land battles than he is and can defeat him with an inferior force. I managed to wipe out the Ottoman empire and replace them with one giant Romanian protectorate very early in the game.

3. We are still allied by default at the moment. I'm also allied with Prussia, Austria, and Sweden still. Would it be a good idea to get out he coalition and ally with France instead?

I feel, the MP campaign goals are too limited. I liked better the ETW MPC system, where you got to keep your faction's SP grand campaign goals in order to win the campaign. For me, that seemed way more interesting than blitzing for the opponent's capital.

I have played as Britain against Russia. Here are the British opening moves: 1) Bribe Prussia to attack Russia; 2) Bribe Ottomans to attack Russia; 3) Gather all the starting troops and ship them over to Ingria. 4) While the army is sailing, build up trade. Russia has no cash to counter this and no navy to deliver any of it's troops anywhere. France will not attack UK at least for the time being since their ports will be raided.

So, once the British army arrives, Russia has absolutely nothing to offer in terms of resistance. In one scenario, Russia will have moved it's starting armies North to counter the Brits. In that case, Brits can just stay at sea and strike targets of opportunity along the coast while Russian South and West will be eaten up by Prussians and Ottomans. In the other scenario, Russia will be fighting Prussians and Ottomans. In that case, Brits have a free passage straight to Moscow: Ingria -> Narva -> Moscow. Each province taken by the Brits in the North will reduce Russian financial capacity to regenerate military even more.

That's on the strategic level. On the battlefield, the British starting forces eat Russian low tech army for breakfast. No salt needed. Russians might have superior melee, but that will help them none while they're being mowed down by British machine guns (that's how British line feels in the game).

[Travisk]

Ah, the annoying Britian vs Russia scenario.

There are quite a few ways to take them out.

1. Conquer as much territory as possible as early as possible, preferably with ports. Build up a giant fleet. Crush the British fleet and block their ports. Land a giant army in Scotland, liberate, replenish in Scotland, conquer London.
2. Use a diversionary fleet to distract the enemy's fleet. Use a smaller fleet to land an army near London and take it out ASAP.
And the final one:
3. Rush fleets and armies from everywhere if you have taken over almost the whole world.

[Slaists]

Ah, the annoying Britian vs Russia scenario.

There are quite a few ways to take them out.

1. Conquer as much territory as possible as early as possible, preferably with ports. Build up a giant fleet. Crush the British fleet and block their ports. Land a giant army in Scotland, liberate, replenish in Scotland, conquer London.
2. Use a diversionary fleet to distract the enemy's fleet. Use a smaller fleet to land an army near London and take it out ASAP.
And the final one:
3. Rush fleets and armies from everywhere if you have taken over almost the whole world.

That's why I am suggesting, a reasonable British player would ensure, Russia is at war with Prussia AND Ottomans from turn 0. On top of that, make sure, you HURT Russian military as much as possible in every single battle they fight against the aforementioned Prussians and Ottomans.

As to the 'building up Russian fleet' idea. On what money? And on what technology? The biggest ships Russians can build = 80 cannons. And each of those will take a huge chunk out of the Russian budget in upkeep expenses.

Nah, if a skilled campaign player plays for Britain, Russia = gone (lost it's capital) by the end of 1705...

[fourganger]

Denmark makes quite a good launch pad, though it is fairly obvious that you're planning to do once you take it. Also consider getting military access to a state you are friendly with and attacking from an unseen angle.

[Fotchimus]

Well the Ottomans are no more and I'm still allied with the Prussians and Austrians (for now). He hasn't tried to get Prussia to declare war on me. He is new to the mpc and probably didn't think of trying to get Prussia to war dec me on turn 0.

Thanks for the advice here so far. I think what I will do is wait for Austria to war dec my huge Romanian protectorate and use that as a way to leave the coalition and ally with France. I'll scrap the idea of getting a huge fleet and instead get a fleet of sloops/brigs in position near his trade nodes (but hidden in the fog of war) and take out his trade ships immediately when we finally go to war. Right now his fleet is occupied dealing with the French so I think it might work. I will definitely get a ship out of the Baltic before he blocks it off though.

[Dreamw4lk3r]

tbh guys if you follow slaits' tactic, russia does not stand a chance whatsoever.

They don't have the money, the fleet, the army or the tech's to win in such a scenario and no chance to recover, but then again, it's not good sport to play like this imo :/

To fotch: I'd not suggest waiting for Nelson to become available again, if you give your opponent time I believe you'll loose the opportonity you have now.

Kill his trade, get an army/fleet out of the baltic before the hits the fan ^^

[Slaists]

tbh guys if you follow slaits' tactic, russia does not stand a chance whatsoever.

They don't have the money, the fleet, the army or the tech's to win in such a scenario and no chance to recover, but then again, it's not good sport to play like this imo :/

To fotch: I'd not suggest waiting for Nelson to become available again, if you give your opponent time I believe you'll loose the opportonity you have now.

Kill his trade, get an army/fleet out of the baltic before the hits the fan ^^

I think, I mentioned somewhere else that the current MPC goals or rather the only goal (take your opponent's capital) are very limiting in terms of gameplay. Basically, you should head for the enemy's capital straight away forgetting all about the AI's which are not likely to do much for the first 2 years or so. If you do not do this, you are likely to have lost the necessary momentum and the enemy might be camping next to your capital already... It would be much more fun if the campaign goals (in order to win) stayed the same as they are in the SP campaign. Or, we could have several sets of goals to pick from starting a multi-player campaign.

As to 'good sportmanship', if you are playing chess and your opponent has left himself open for a checkmate after the first couple moves do you not take that opportunity? Unfortunately, in NTW Russia starts in such an open checkmate situation if it chooses to play against Britain. Picking Russia against Britain in NTW is similar to picking Poland against Prussia in ETW. Prussia starts with a turn advantage. So, by the time Poland gets to do anything, it has lost half of it's territory (on turn 0). And it's not like Prussia has a lot of choice about it. The AI is scripted to swamp the faction, so it needs to expand rapidly. Unfortunately, Poland is the natural target. Anyway, if anything, I'd like to see some NTW faction balance adjustments in MPC regard in upcoming patches. That, or expanded multi-player goal options.

For now, yes, the only way to play some of the factions is to ignore the 'goal' and make a gentle-manly agreement of not attacking each other for some set period of time.

[Sparkywarky]

me and my brother has set a house rule. We've recorded the single player victory conditions and once they are completed (X number of predetermined regions) then we could go for capitals or you might wanna try playing france vs russia which seems to be fun. France is busy with hot zone at start and can't touch russia while russia has his own battles with ottomans and have time to build economy.

to answer you question. Try building cheapest ships (few of them) and head towards england. There's a high chance he'll be trading with denmark or such so he'll notice your fleet around Baltic sea coz of the trade rout. Fake going to his northern trade node and draw away his fleet. With a second fleet (prolly 1 ship) bring troop liberate scotland. It will give you free troops and incase of attack scots will help you. Once you land try to find a place to hold on. Even if you don't capture london right away you'll be forcing him to build troop and will keep him busy in his island while bring another army.

[Slaists]

me and my brother has set a house rule. We've recorded the single player victory conditions and once they are completed (X number of predetermined regions) then we could go for capitals or you might wanna try playing france vs russia which seems to be fun. France is busy with hot zone at start and can't touch russia while russia has his own battles with ottomans and have time to build economy.

to answer you question. Try building cheapest ships (few of them) and head towards england. There's a high chance he'll be trading with denmark or such so he'll notice your fleet around Baltic sea coz of the trade rout. Fake going to his northern trade node and draw away his fleet. With a second fleet (prolly 1 ship) bring troop liberate scotland. It will give you free troops and incase of attack scots will help you. Once you land try to find a place to hold on. Even if you don't capture london right away you'll be forcing him to build troop and will keep him busy in his island while bring another army.

Better yet: put some (cheap) troops in that first fleet too. So, he will be even more compelled pursue that fleet since it would appear you're bringing an invasion army. Of course, a wise British player would scout out your fleet with a sloop before committing the full Royal Fleet for attack. If weak ships are discovered, Britain should send the bulk of its fleet to block the channel between Denmark and Sweden (intercepting the second fleet in the process).

As to France vs Russia idea. I am playing as Russia against a French player. Turn 0: he bribed Prussia to attack me. Turn 1: he bribed Ottomans to attack me. Turn 2 or 3: he bribed Sweden to attack me (breaking their alliance with me). Turn 4-5: he bribed Southern Italian states to ally with him (stop their war against France) and attack me. And so on... We are at turn 60 or so now, Russia is dirt poor and at war with almost everyone on the map, fighting International naval invasion armies everywhere. It almost feels like the Revolutionary war of 1917-21. Meanwhile, France is at war with Austria, Britain, and me, of course. He tried to bribe Britain and Austria too, but, I guess, did not have enough cash. Once he actually managed to bribe Austria into breaking alliance with Russia and attacking. I guess, the game script forced Austria to reverse that situation on the next turn...

On top of that dire situation I described above, during 1805, the French player sailed the whole Southern French navy into the Baltic unopposed (the British naval AI, as is common, did not do anything) and landed Napoleon's army in Finland. After capturing the province, French grew wary of the situation home and after a few skirmishes sailed back. I hope my opponent is not reading this. If he turned Napoleon East (from Finland) and marched straight to Moscow, I would have had very little to throw against him then. My forces were too busy in the South fighting the 'international expeditions'.

Now, by the turn 60, things are a bit different though. Prussia still presents grave danger to Russia. However, the French neglect of the AI at the campaign start is starting to tell. France is severely damaged by the British AI. Paris has fallen and the Duke is marching towards Flanders. We'll see how things turn out in the end.

[Dreamw4lk3r]

Slaists, what you said was all true, but as you admitted it's more fun to play as a gentlemen instead of blitzing for the capital, was no critisism intended.

I thought playing as russia could be fun cuz when i was france I had my hands full with slowly conquering prussia & italy & austria (+ the smaller citystates); it was really annoying to be fighting them and have a russian army walk through austrian lines and attack me in italy where one army of mine was bothered already by italian & austrian forces. :s really annoying how they can just trickle in unharmed. I tried using diplomacy but as you said slaists the coallition forces are hardcoded to be enemies with france I suspect and my GB human enemy kept playing with diplomacy against me... maybe if he wasn't GB i'd have more time and freedom to throw at russia...

About the fleets and using one as distraction, it doesnt have to be strong, it doesn't have to be have an army since destroying GB's trade fleets doesn't require a powerful fleet = cheaper = and this allows you to spring into action that much sooner and will force GB to send a strong enough fleet (prolly nelson then) to stop you from either killing his trade fleets which is rather crippling at start or stop your invasion force which should have a higher chance of slipping to scotland.

[[BsA]Dave]

Ok. Basically Britain is the best nation to use on MP campaign. Russia the second worst (after austria) I played as britain vs russia and first thing i did was sack my army and sell gibralter to portugal. Then just built a huge trade fleet and navy and after about 50 turns was makin about 40k per turn with 200k in bank. Even though i only held british isles. Meanwhile russia had invaded whole otto empire and some of austria and germany. But i managed to use my huge income to get any nation worth its salt to attack him and cut off all his trade. He then got completely overrun by austria france and prussia and to add insult to injury i then landed 5 full stack armies in north russia and marched on moscow unnopposed. Basically what im trying to say is, if yr opponenet has half a braincell you're totally screwed. The only way you can become powerful is by increasing yr territory and the more terrirory you have the more options he has as to where to launch a naval invasion. I suppose if you can secure 4 or 5 drydocks you could build a large fleet to take him on but how you will fund this is anyones guess.