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Thread: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

  1. #1
    Hengest's Avatar It's a joke
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    Default WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Work in progress

    Whilst researching the Middle Ages we have come across several stages in histroy where nations made special efforts or drives into the conquered territories of other cultures. Many times this was a deliberate and organised atempt by the state to invade, using not only military powers but the population of their own homelands.

    These mass exoduses enabled the nation to use the masses of unemployed and paupers to do their colonisation for them. This also had the benefits that they would take the culture and laws of their homelands into the new regions. The problems with the colonisation of foreigners (as the US have recently found) is imposing your own laws upon them, but by bringing in a new population you had the benefit that they were already familiar with your laws and your feudal traditions.

    The system was not so easy and effective as all that however, since the new and the old populations needed governing and that was no easy job. The settlement of these districts were typically wild frontiers of landscapes that often needed agriculture, forest clearances or urbanisation. This is not even factoring in the need for roads, churches or military infrastructure.

    Colonies are typically limited and slow-growing, militarily vulnerable outposts- BUT our research was telling us that certain factions would still be highly adept at settling certain frontiers, and this would give them huge bonuses in population growth, trade, law and tax benefits. We will use hidden resources to allow the game to sense the availability of different tech tree options via faction.



    The colonisers had numerous ways of solving the problems of slow-growth and resistance, normally unique to each faction. Here are some examples of the systems we are developing and researching.

    Currently the idea is to have a three step tree.
    The first two steps are linear. However, the third opens up three choices and you may only choose one. Each of these choices has different effects on the region.

    ------------------------------------------------------

    SE (Portugal, Aragon, Castilla) RECONQUISTA
    1. Aprissio/ Pressura (land possession)
    2. Fuero (charters)
    3a Concejos (council)
    3b Maestrazgo (military order)
    3c Repartimiento (nobles)

    1. Aprissio/ Pressura
    The Catholics take possession of the land, after conquest from Taifa states and Muslims. They would naturally convert the old inhabitants, but also seek to bring in fresh blood, and their own culture. This phase would normally involve Scalio (cultivation) of the land, irrigation and designation of ownership. There was also the process of Cartae Populationis (censors and charters) which gave land grants to new colonists but also acted as a binding contract with the feudal lords to better facilitate the extraction of taxes.
    Effects: + farming, + law, + tax, + growth

    2. Fuero
    Fuero is related to the Latin word 'forum'. There were a range of fuero, such as fuero militar, a military code of justice or fuero eclesiástico, relating to the Church. These were basically a more well-defined issue of law and charters, calling in the debts of the initial boom of grants. On the other hand, fueros could also be written to entitle the region to keep its old or uniquely regional laws perhaps representing the pecularities of population or customs.
    Effects: + law, + tax, + growth, - happiness (construction 1 turn)

    3a Concejos (council)
    A Concejo is the most direct continuation of the fuero, it is the creation of new municipalities, once given a royal concession by the fueros. The concejos can be created in cities with large Moorish population and will generally be a means to financially maximise the potential of those settlements that have already reached a good population size. Law and Order can be a problem in these settlements however, but normally income is very good.
    Effects: + trade, + tax, - law, - order

    3b Maestrazgo (military order)
    This encourages a military order to take over government of the region. This has several benefits despite giving up much of the land to support the knights and the military, which means a lose of revenue. The knights increase religious conversion and they also enforce laws and taxes, although the money usually pays for their recruitment of new units. A military order offers some of the best military units available and although they can be quite demanding and require the sacrifice of many other potential benefits of crown ownership, they make up for this in self-sufficiency.
    Effects: + law, + order, - health (represents lack of growth due to loss of farmland) allows Order

    3c Repartimiento (nobles)
    By granting land to specific nobles, you increase their power which can be dangerous or beneficial depending on what you have planned for the character. A noble will generally require autonomy which means that you will not have control over recruitment or construction but you can expect that the settlement will be run effiiciently without requiring your intervention, ....that is as long as the noble in question can be kep in check.
    Effects: + law, + tax, - happiness, allows autonomy

    ------------------------------------------------------


    NE (HRE, Denmark) OSTSEIDLUNG
    1 Landesausbau (land consolidation)
    2 Rynek ('market rings')
    3a Hufenverfassung (land division)
    3b Marken (borderlands)
    3c Schroda (new towns)

    1 Landesausbau
    The first wave of settlers allows you to establish law and increase the population, but food can be very scarce and the long journey can have an adverse effect on health. So don't expect many of your new settlers to live long unless you improve other conditions.
    Effects: + growth, + law, - health

    2 Rynek
    Market rings, follows the old Slavic tradition actually inherited from the East Ottonian establishment of market gardens. These markets were placed along specific routes to encourage settlement and trade, but they were normally established outside of the settled areas far from outposts or strongholds. This made them vulnerable to brigands and resistance.
    Effects: - law, + trade, + growth

    3a Hufenverfassung
    The German division of land was similar to the Old English or Nordic system of hideage, the peasants had land distributed amongst them and in return they were 'free' and responsible for governing that small area. The German system of agricultural taxation was quite different to the old Slavic way. Before, the Wends taxed villages on their size- so if a village worked hard or had a good harvest they could make good money on the sale of their surplus certain years. The German system taxed no the village that produced the yield, but the yield itself. This system was much more standardised and cost-efficient but it was unpopular with the natives, however it did encourage German peasants.
    Effects: + food, + growth, + tax, - happiness

    3b Marken
    Borderlands were a means of establishing a Markgraf or Count to rule a region, he would be be granted especial powers but would usually rule with an iron hand in order to govern.
    Effects: + law, + tax, - happiness allows autonomy

    3c Schroda
    Schroda were usually based on the Rynek, but in atual established townships. Suburbanisation usually meant that sexual activities would soar, but health would drop due to the lack of hygiene facilities in the streets and the close-living raised the risk of infectious diseases. Nonetheless, townships drew tradesmen and commerce from affair, also densely populated settlements allowed taxation and government to operate more efficiently.
    Effects: + trade, + law, + tax, + growth, - health

    *We are currently looking at attaching some ability to establish the Teutonic Knights in these settlements.

    ------------------------------------------------------

    EE (Kiev, Novgorod) RUSSIAN SUZERAINTY

    Prior to the Mongol invasion, the Russians were constantly moving eastwards from Europe often using the rivers to colonise lands largely uninhabited and untilled. However, the horse-nomads made settlement difficult and would in many cases create the need for a counter-exodus. This was very much the case during the Mongol invasion when the Russians moved entire states beyond the vast forests seeking refuge. In 1476 the Russian Tsar Ivan III ceased the tribute payments to the Mongols and following this they in fact surrendered without a fight, this turn of events allowed the Russians to freely colonise and subjugate the 'freemen' or Khazaks (Cossacks) of the Steppe.

    1. Setch – settlements
    (+trade, +growth)

    2. Stanitsa – allocation of land by the Ataman
    (+food, + growth, -order)

    3a Yassak – tribute, claiming full dominance
    (+law, +tax, -happiness)

    3b Voisko –host, allowing the free rule of the Steppe tribe
    (-law, +growth, +happiness)

    3c Volost –Duchy under a Knyaz
    (+law, + tax) allows autonomy
    Last edited by Hengest; May 21, 2010 at 02:11 PM.

  2. #2

    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Fine!

  3. #3
    Beorn's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    As good as it could be

  4. #4
    Subuatai de Bodemloze's Avatar No rest for the wicked
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Are you doing this for every faction?

  5. #5
    Horatius Flaccus's Avatar Biarchus
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Great feature!

  6. #6
    Meister Röhrich's Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    So damn cool! This is what I like the most on DotS: the vast amount of possible decisions and following consequences you can choose from. However may I dare to be so nitpicking and draw your attention on a very minor spelling error: the correct german umbrella term imo should be 'Ostsiedlung' instead of 'Ostseidlung'.

  7. #7
    Sanskrit_Bandit's Avatar Wielki Kniaź Wiślański
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    i just thought i'd point out rynek is the polish word for a city's square. it comes from german ring, of similar meaning. i just noticed that it was under germany/denmark and i thought it a bit odd having polish words there. if this was intended my bad!

  8. #8
    Hengest's Avatar It's a joke
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    It's intended, read the description-

  9. #9
    Sanskrit_Bandit's Avatar Wielki Kniaź Wiślański
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    ah makes sense now
    Last edited by Sanskrit_Bandit; March 30, 2010 at 01:06 AM.

  10. #10
    Ace_General's Avatar Praeses
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    What, no Drang nach Osten for the germanic factions

    You do know that the teutonic knights and other germans carved prussia out of slavic lands and established germany supremacy in the baltic that was only stopped by the russians in WW2
    Low speed, High Drag

  11. #11
    Hengest's Avatar It's a joke
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Yepp that is what the above is meant to represent. It allows the Germans to take settlements of another culture (EE) and populate them quickly, make more money than they would otherwise and enforce law more effectively. We will also have the Teutonic Order more easily available in these settlements, which is a bit more Drang.

  12. #12
    Kyrre's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Great stuff man!

    Will you also implement something like this for the Norwegians in Scotland and Ireland, for Sweden in the baltic lands and for Denmark in eastern England? Would be pretty fawking cool!




    Greetings!

  13. #13
    Fire-dweller's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Will there be mass slaughter and deportation?
    Nothing is an absolute reality, everything is permitted. La shay' haqiqah, koulo shay' moumkin.

  14. #14

    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Quote Originally Posted by Fire-dweller View Post
    Will there be mass slaughter and deportation?
    That's already in vanilla actually. Think about the options you have when you take a settlement.
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  15. #15
    Deutschland's Avatar East of Rome Mod Leader
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Hm I think this is a great way to depict cultural colonization. But I'm afraid to tell you that it should be Ostsiedlung, not Ostseidlung ... just a hint

  16. #16

    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Great! Really looking forward to what you will prepare for Bohemia

  17. #17
    Fire-dweller's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Quote Originally Posted by sumskilz View Post
    That's already in vanilla actually. Think about the options you have when you take a settlement.
    Not deportation and forced resettlement.
    Nothing is an absolute reality, everything is permitted. La shay' haqiqah, koulo shay' moumkin.

  18. #18

    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Quote Originally Posted by Fire-dweller View Post
    Not deportation and forced resettlement.
    Yeah, that is true. It would be an interesting feature since taking a city and deporting might cause your enemy’s other cities to be overwhelmed with refugees which could be good or bad for your enemy depending on if their cities infrastructure is capable of handling it. It would be possible with a script, so maybe…
    Quote Originally Posted by Enros View Post
    You don't seem to be familiar with how the burden of proof works in when discussing social justice. It's not like science where it lies on the one making the claim. If someone claims to be oppressed, they don't have to prove it.


  19. #19
    Senator
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    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Same again - excellent ideas and research.
    Last edited by Basil 11; February 26, 2011 at 10:23 AM.

  20. #20

    Default Re: WIP Article 1: Repopulation

    Wow this is great! such a good idea and implementation for the game

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