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Thread: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

  1. #1

    Default Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    As my favorite TT army is the Dark Elves, I wanted to play on a proper map of the Warhammer world where I could cultivate the full might of the 6 cities of Naggaroth and invade all of Ulthuan....while still feature the Old World we all know and love. This has been my first foray into Total War modding and of course I seem to have bitten off more than I can chew. I read some tutorials on map-making but progress has been slow, and I'm unsure if the final product will even been worthwhile.

    Here's what I've done so far:

    Taken this slice of the CGI Warhammer world map as a baseline:

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 


    Shrunk it down and began populating with regions (converted from TGA just for the upload):


    And have been editing a descr_regions file to match (also attached).

    Any suggestions? Am I on the right track? Does the map have too big of an ocean? Am I making the Bretonnian/Imperial provinces too small? Should I have done a terrain map first?


    The end objective is a campaign game where all of the major powers have access to their actual territories, with lore-based economies capable of long-term support for their armies (needless to say the random spawning of entire stacks and the perpetually-bankrupt economies of the stock campaign really irk me). I'd like to see AOR as well, to do things like keep the Elves from recruiting armies from the mainland, for example.

  2. #2
    ~Beren~'s Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    I have been hoping for a larger map that covers a multitude of areas and landscapes other than the Old World.
    I grew tired of playing as Elves in a foreign land, and wished I could fight our main adversaries - the Dark Elves - in Ulthuan. Sure, you could fight them in the current map, but most of the time they're so inactive that they rarely pose that much of a threat. If you were to succeed in making this, it would be one of the best things to have come to CoW.

    The map itself looks great, but here's just one suggestion I can think of:

    - Regarding the size of the ocean, yes, it does seem a bit wide. You should decrease the distance between Ulthuan and the eastern regions

  3. #3

    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    Could also cut down the badlands a bit. The badlands area there seems pretty excessive. If i can do anything to help, let me know. I have all fantasy army books and huge knowledge of non-empire lore. (I too wish to finally conquer ulthuan!) Might be nice to add the rest of the known dwarven fortresses.

    Also, what might be nice is to do a faction that is composed completely of grave guard/skeletons/zombies in lieu of tomb kings in the south deserts. (Shouldnt be too hard, as grave guard are already setup to be generals.)

  4. #4
    Blackomur89's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    I think the team will be interested in this.

    There is a big problem thou, we don't have enough factions for that kind of map. No Lizardmen, Skraven, Tomb knights, ect... Their lands would be bare or lore incorrect. So I think that this map will have to wait until the rest of the factions are finished.
    2D artist for Call of Warhammer TW; 2D artist for Westeros TW; 2D artist and researcher for The Ruins of Arnor TATW sub-mod; 2D artist for Warcraft TW.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    Hi,

    Its great to see this initiative.

    Why not warp the map?

    The seas can be much narrower and be made mostly unpassable, with few channels or paths allowing ships through while increasing the time taken for the ships to pass. That would make it lore accurate and the users won't mind a distortion of the map if the other provinces are given their required care. And could the warp be handled in such a way to exclude (or push to the margin - like with Brettonian provinces in the current campaign) those regions whose factions are incomplete?

    Also would be fun to change the strat models of the Dark elves ships to resemble the black arks and sea monsters and given suitable stats.

    Good luck!

  6. #6
    Scipio praeditus's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    I think that map is perfect, I don't see any problem, there are no lizardmen territories on this map, and the skaven weren't included in the main version, so why should they be now?
    Araby shouldn't be any problem at all, there are plenty of arab units to be found in other mods.
    And as Alphawolf stated the Tomb Kings should be doable, I'd make them a strong non expansionist faction to keep the Arabs in check, who should mostly do naval invasions.

    I would give the Arab corsairs small and cheap boats, and also give them few movement points so they don't venture of too far but mostly infest the local waters.
    The chaos corsairs can keep their normal movement ranges as it is the storm of chaos after all.

    I agree that you could cut of a large part of the Badlands, so you just keep a small piece of land connecting the Old World with the Northern Wastes.
    The sea I wouldn't change, but make two passable sea lanes that are infested with pirates, one along the coast of Araby and the other along the chaos wastes.
    Don't warp the map any further, I believe this one has been warped enough.

    The extensive chaos wastes could perhaps be mostly devoid of settlements or largely filled with impassable terrain in the mid to western regions to stimulate the Chaos factions into invading the Old World.
    A Slaanesh settlement or two above the new world might give the Dark elf player some welcome challenge though.

    I would drop most of the Imperial factions in favour of another (primitive) Orc faction in the new world (and perhaps one in the mountains of Ulthuan) and a human colony faction along the southern coast of the New World, two or three Imperial factions at most should be plenty.


    I must apologise for the fact that I have hardly any modding knowledge and am thus unable to help you.
    I'm also sorry for the large amount of I's in the above text, this concept just got me very excited.

    You should start a thread in the submod section, as that is clearly what this is, the amount of work should not be underestimated.
    Perhaps if you would state in a submod thread what work needs to be done some people with an equal amount of interest as me, but with more modding knowledge, might be able to help you.
    I at least will certainly see what I can do if you will do so.
    "The only question that remained was whether the founders knew the final result of their creation, or if they themselves where the victims of a misunderstanding.
    In the latter case it was the duty of any thinking human, to press himself into the front of this depraved movement, to perhaps still prevent the extreme, in the former case the founders of this peoples disease must have been true devils; for only in the brain of a monster - not of a human - could the plan for an organisation take meaningfull form, whose purpose must lead toward the end result of a collapse of human culture and thus to the desolation of the world.
    In this case only battle remained as a means of final delivery, battle with any weapons that the human mind, intellect and will are able to comprehend, regardless, of whom fate would gift with it's blessing."

  7. #7

    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    This is great idea, and I soooooo wanna see the entire world available in a grand, open-ended, campaign but the current campaign of the mod is still not nearly finished. I think that right now it serves all our interests better to focus our time and energies on the current project, and helping the team making it the best it can be, before we bite off more to chew.

  8. #8
    hick09's Avatar Miles
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    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    I think the team will be interested in this
    fow now this idea will be good as submod. In the provincial campaign we don't plane increase the limits of the map.


  9. #9
    Scipio praeditus's Avatar Decanus
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    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaliaeth Chillblade View Post
    This is great idea, and I soooooo wanna see the entire world available in a grand, open-ended, campaign but the current campaign of the mod is still not nearly finished. I think that right now it serves all our interests better to focus our time and energies on the current project, and helping the team making it the best it can be, before we bite off more to chew.
    As if it would make any difference to make a sub mod, it's not like the mostly non-russian TWC community has much to do with the development of what is essentially a russian mod.

    Bugfixing and the like has to be done by those that know the mod, fans with some modding knowledge making the beginnings of a submod (that could be implemented once the bugs in the main mod have been fixed) will not delay that for even a minute.

    If you think differently I suggest you lead by example and dive into that code to start finding those bugs.
    "The only question that remained was whether the founders knew the final result of their creation, or if they themselves where the victims of a misunderstanding.
    In the latter case it was the duty of any thinking human, to press himself into the front of this depraved movement, to perhaps still prevent the extreme, in the former case the founders of this peoples disease must have been true devils; for only in the brain of a monster - not of a human - could the plan for an organisation take meaningfull form, whose purpose must lead toward the end result of a collapse of human culture and thus to the desolation of the world.
    In this case only battle remained as a means of final delivery, battle with any weapons that the human mind, intellect and will are able to comprehend, regardless, of whom fate would gift with it's blessing."

  10. #10

    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    regarding the ocean size i think it is that wide for a reason and shouldn't been shortened. After all, we don't want to reach The New World in two turns because it lessens the feeling of "expeditionary greatly isolated forces" like Pizarro or other Spaniards when they ran through South America.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Need Help: Building Wider Map with Elven Lands, Araby

    Have a look at the Submods. I'm doing exactly that in Cry Havoc.

    Obviously, the map will be free to those who want to use it, if I ever get my mapper to send it, if you're not keen on what I'm planning on doing.

    The Ocean size can be made smaller. Simply just lessen the speed of the boats in the open ocean.

    If you have the great huge map, then there will be huge pathing issues. From my experiences with mapping myself with a simple "5 Island" one, huge open water spaces do very little to the mods AI.

    Quick question, Noble. Would you care to work along with Cry Havoc, with a free sharing of work involved? I won't be back until Monday, but if you could let me know, that would be fantastic.

    [ Cry Havoc:: ] - [ link ] - [ An Expanded World Submod for Call of Warhammer ]
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