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Thread: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

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    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Have seen too many threads in the technical area dedicated to ask if your pc will run ETW, have decided to create this thread to answer those questions


    -The CPU

    This is the heart of your PC, he commands! And as such we have to choose a good one.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    *If you're buying a laptop don't buy in any case a AMD chipset! if you're buying a desktop choose at will

    What to choose'

    In pc we always try for a one size fits all, but most of you know that doesn't come anywhere near true, since we have such a huge numbers of pcs and as such we have to have some knowledge for us to grab the one we want it.

    The letter/type of chip (order of the list is higher to lower) :
    - i7= holy mother! best processor you can get in laptops, *Strengths: Great performance Weakness: not the most power conscious chip.
    - i5= the most powerful two core processor around,*Strengths: Excellent processing power, great power saver Weakness: none that was shown
    - i3= this is for the wallet conscious, still pack a good power, just like the old core duo
    - Q= means that it's a quad core *Strengths: Great processing power Weakness: Gulp a lot of power
    - T= means a normal core duo *Strengths: Good Performance Weakness: Could be more power conscious
    - P= means a smaller voltage core duo *Strengths: Good performance, sips little power Weakness: not as powerful as the the T line
    - SL/SP/ULV= means ultra low voltage processors *Strengths: People on the go that need more processing power that your netbook can give Weakness: Has a low processing power compared to the others, although it gives double the performance of an Atom


    The i5 and i3 have now some interesting feature, they can transmit hd video wirelessly, what? Yes they use a hdmi connection with a special router to transmit those neat image from your screen to some bigger screen that you like without those cables, very useful if you want to use them as HTPC (home theater pc)




    -Graphics card

    Always buy a pc with DEDICATED graphics, it means a chip dedicated only to do the graphics work, there are two providers of this thing, ATI and NVIDIA. Intel graphics (GMA 4500hd, GMA X3100, GMA 965, or lower are INTEGRATED, FOR PLAYING ANYTHING ELSE THAN YOUTUBE THEY'RE CRAP)

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    Power of the graphics:

    As of any products we have series, versions, etc.. here are some of they (order newer to older):

    Nvidia G 200 = newest of the bunch
    ATI HD 4000 = newest of the bunch
    Nvidia G 100 = rebranding of the 9000 series
    Nvidia 9000 = the most common series of Nvidia
    Nvidia 8000 = old series don't buy at all costs
    ATI HD 3000 = old series don't buy at all costs

    Graphics card have a lot of digits/letters! We can get confused, and as such I have thought a way that might minimize the distress caused by that huge amount of choices.

    1- Let's pay attention to the power of the card!
    2- Let's see what resolution that your monitor have (most notebooks come with a 1280x1024, 1366x768, 1680x1050,1920x1080).

    take a look at this picture (click to expand)


    * Those are the most common graphics are out there, if you don't find it here, don't worry use the common sense, the higher the number the better, and you can also check at :

    http://www.notebookcheck.net/Compari...rds.130.0.html

    * in the Nvidia world there's lots of flavors, and they are showed to us in letters, and now they're here with a ranking order, the usual higher to lower:
    GTX > GTS > GT > GS

    Nvidia has a custom of rebranding things, and that's what she done with the GT 200. What? Yes my boy, every model except the GT 240 are some form of rebranding, are from the old architecture, sometimes higher clocked, with a slight increase in shadders, but essentially the same product. Now the GT 240 uses the "new" GT 200 architecture from pcs, err what do you mean.

    I'm saying that the GTX 280 that your thinking is the same GTX 280 from desktop, uses the G92b architecture, that's the same as the 8800 GT from the desktop world. And getting a GTX 280 sli, gives you the same power as the 8800 GTX from the desktop world. Sad, hum?

    Now the GT 300 line is brand new based in the GT 200 desktop line. Although they offer almost the same performance as the old cards, i.e. the GT 230= GT 330, the variation is minimum. Although we do have to wait for the top of the line models, but it seems that what will save Nvidia in the laptop market is optimus (more on this as soon as it becomes more material).

    So basically here if you want to play empire I would recommend something higher than the HD 4330 from ATI, you can play but with the lowest settings, something along the lines of the HD 4650 should do you fine playing on medium or high even, above that you get great performance

    PS: I will update ATI side of things, as soon as the drivers mature, since the HD 5850 now have the same performance as the HD 4850, sometimes less.


    -Memmory

    It's the courier that your pc uses to fetch some data at high speeds.

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The higher the merrier, as of now most of the notebooks are comming with 2gb, 3gb, 4gb, go for the higher way 4gb, but remember to look at OS (operational system) that you're using!

    32-bit = use only 3gb even if you have more
    64-bit = use up to 128gb

    So, when buying your pc it will probably come with windows, choose, please, the 64-bit version of it, example: windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit. Future proof your system!

    You can upgrade your memory, it's easy, but remember 4g for now is the best for the price.


    -Hard Drive

    He remembers all those movies and photos that you put in your pc!

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 
    The most common ones are the 320gb or the 250gb go for the higher number there are available up to 640gb.
    The speed of the hd is defined by the size of it and the rpm, the higher the better, altough it will consume more power, common speeds are 5400rpm and 7200rpm

    SSDs:

    They're the most novelty of the market, they work like the thumb drive that you and I commonly use, they don't have moveable parts and they're FAST AND EXPENSIVE! if you have the money go get one if not do as I do, wait....


    Other important Stuff!

    Here are some other important stuff that are very worth mentioning!

    Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

    -Screen

    The higher the resolution the better, 1366X768 is becoming common, for me it's great some people would go all the way HD in here, but for some people like me that don't have a 20/20 vision in my case more of a 0/0 the "lower the better". Remember 1366X768 is 16:9 format, you have seen this format in your TV, but the most usual format for now for pcs is 16:10, which is falling down the guts...

    There are some types there, the LCD, the LED, the RGB-LED!??! Simply put the RGB-LED are the best, now they are only available at dell, seconded by the LED.

    Matte screen or glossy? personal taste, I do prefer matte.

    -The Chassis

    The notebook is something that you carry around, or should, and so always verify if it is rugged enough for you, if it isn't most chances are that you end up breaking the plastic of some part of it.

    -The weight

    Go for the one that seens light, seriously go for that one, notebooks are portable things, and altough you think yourself to have some strength, you will add some 2,5kg to 5kg to your backpack which already, if your like me its filled with things, so we are travelling light let's hunt some orcs!


    -Notebooks that I don't recommend

    HP Pavillion line - they're expensive (in my country Brazil), they have serious heat issues, and don't pack power.
    Dell Inspiron line - they're cheap and that's it, your not going to game anything in here

    Here are some good machines at reasonable prices:

    16" to 18"
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834114706
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834101203
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220622
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834114785
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834117947

    15"to 14"
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220605
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834146613
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220634
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834117908

    If I were you I would look at some MSI notebook specially the gt640 which is portable and has some good guts

    Not advertising but from this list I would personally go for the lenovo, good graphics chip, and processor, if the company is not know to you, they bought the pc part of IBM, there's quality and price in there

    =Online Stores per Country=

    I want to add a new section to both guides so people can make more conscious choices and get better prices, along as well better machines.
    This is a part that is going to be constantly update since I'm asking the contribution of all of you people out there!
    This section don't have any intention to advertise, just to make you make better choices, to handle better your precious hard worked money! Here we have some, they're going to be divided by country so take a look around!

    -US-

    Retailers

    www.newegg.com
    www.tigerdirect.com
    www.zipzoomfly.com
    www.microcenter.com

    Manufacturers

    http://www.falcon-nw.com/
    http://www.ibuypower.com/lobby.aspx
    www.cyberpowerpc.com

    -UK-

    http://www.ebuyer.com/

    http://www.overclockers.co.uk/produc...hp?groupid=701

    http://www.scan.co.uk/

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  2. #2

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Intel Core 2 Duo 2.8GHz 6MB Cache
    4 Gig Eam
    Windows 7 64 Bit
    ATI Mobility 4650 1 GB dedicaed card
    Full HD 1920X1080

    Wondering if i can lay at a lower resolution than this and put graphics up high, with good performance, not sure

    WHat do people think, i heard the performance in NTW is better than ETW

  3. #3
    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    haven't you taken a look at the graphics card table, it is right there.

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  4. #4

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Wonderful thread rep+


  5. #5
    Spaxspore's Avatar Campidoctor
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Also beware of cards like 4350 or 9400, 210 etc or some funky stuff like that.

    Companies do that to confuse you, they are work group / media cards that cant game worth a damn. Keep an eye out.

    One last thing, GPU memory isnt the most important thing, the video cards core is where its at.

    Just some helpful tips. To add to MM's great guide.

  6. #6
    kelvintyk's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    I'm intending to custom build a rig and this was what I came up with:

    MSI Pro-E x58 with Core i7 920
    Kingston PC3-10300/1333 2x2GB DDR3
    Western Digital 500GB 32MB Caviar Black SATA2
    Sapphire Raedon HD5770 1GB Vapor-X GDDR5
    LG GH22 22x DVD Writer
    NZXT M59
    SeaSonic M12II-Modular 520W
    LG 21.5" W2261VP-PF Widescreen 2ms 50000:1 HDMI Full HD
    Windows 7 Home Premium 32bit OEM
    Logitech Laser Desktop MK140

    So how well can this machine run NTW? Most if not all settings on ultra? Or just medium? Thanks for any tips given.
    Baird: "Hey! Stop shooting it, you're pissing it off!"

    Cole: "You're telling me what not to shoot in here? Look at this ****!"
    _____________
    Carmine: "Landown? I heard there's a ****load of grubs down there..."

    Marcus: "More like 10 ****loads"
    _____________
    Dom: "Marcus, ya ever seen them feed on imulsion?"

    Marcus: "Hmph, they can eat **** and die for all I care..."

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    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or the will it run thread *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    lets try again in the desktop thread

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  8. #8

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Would I be able to use an ATI Radeon HD 2600 or would I need an upgrade. because I have played Empire and I have heard how awesome Napoleon is supposed to be so I want to get it

  9. #9
    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    meedival the 2600 is pardon my chinese ;akojregn;jrewapgojrea now, if you can play etw than you're going to play ntw, I think if you don't own etw the game would play in the lowest settings as possible. There is no way to upgrade a onboard gpu, which in your case is. And upgrading a notebook gpu is also a great pain in the lower part of my canister

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  10. #10

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Ok. I played ETW at lowest settings but I didn't know whether I needed a better card or not

  11. #11

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Ok, I haven't bought a computer in 5 years... my old one still allows me to play MTW and RTW which I still play .... anyways I am looking at buying a new laptop...

    now I don't need anything super high end as I am only a casual gamer... but I do travel a lot and am away from home a lot as I am in the army; therefore, the portability of a laptop is a must. I have picked out two laptops from a group which I think fit well into my price range and I want to know if I will be able to plat NTW on them as I plan on purchasing the game when I buy the laptop.

    Gateway 15.6"

    processor = intel core i3-330m 2.1 ghz
    HDD = 640gb 5400rpm
    RAM = 4gb DDR3
    Graphics Card = ATI Mobility Radeon HD 5650

    The graphics card says
    Discrete Video MemoryYes
    Expandable Video MemoryYes - Up To 4091MB
    Graphics ChipsetATI Mobility Radeon HD 5650
    Integrated Video MemoryNo
    Native Screen Resolution1600 x 900
    Upgradable Video SystemNo
    Video Memory1024MB


    HP Pavilion 15.6

    Processor = Intel Core i5-430m 2.26ghz with turbo boost
    HDD = 640gb 5400rpm
    RAM = 4gb DDR3
    Graphics Set = Nvidia GeForce 230M

    Discrete Video Memory1GB Dedicated
    Expandable Video MemoryNo
    Graphics ChipsetNvidia GeForce GT 230M
    Integrated Video MemoryNo
    Native Screen Resolution1366 x 768
    Upgradable Video SystemNo
    Video MemoryUp to 2815MB Total Graphics Memory
    The Gateway is Priced at 749$ while the HP pavilion is priced at 1099$ my gut instinct tells me that the better deal is the Gateway but I am wondering if their will be a benefit to going with the more powerful i5 processor

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    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    I would advise to buy neither, I take a look at some for you

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  13. #13

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    That would be great; to be quite honest, I have no idea what a good gaming system would encompass. I have fallen so far behind on hardware lingo and such that I really don't feel comfortable buying a PC...

  14. #14
    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Since there was no budget here are some laptops the usual start with the better getting down performance degrades

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220695
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220700
    http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/sh..._envy15_buynow
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220696
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834146613
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834101222
    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834220706


    I would seriously go for the hp, since I don't like the visuals of the gamers notebook, getting too old for it. And it has a serious weight issue, being he most anorexic notebook of all, and having a fit and finish only compared to one at the top, aside as you see a great performance

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  15. #15

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    Yah, I like what I see from the HP... funky colours of a gamers notebook was cool when I was 15 ... not so much anymore

    Thanks Mr. MM for all the help

  16. #16
    Rotaugen2009's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: Desktop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED CORE I3, I5, ATI NEW CARDS 02/18/10

    I am ordering a gaming laptop (has to be a laptop for lunchtime gaming)

    Toshiba X505-Q880
    18.4" screen at 1920x1080
    6 GB ram
    i7 720 QM processor
    64 GB SSD for operating system (came with stock system)
    500 GB ATA 7200 RPM drive
    NVIDIA GeForce GTS 360M with 1GB video memory

    Does this seem like it should run NTW at 1920x1080 with nearly max settings? Its a huge laptop screen and I hope to get pretty good graphics performance out of this system.


    Dang it, I was switching around and put this in the WRONG area. If a mod sees it, can they please move to the LAPTOP one? How lame of me.
    Don't blame me, I voted for Pedro!

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    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Desktop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED CORE I3, I5, ATI NEW CARDS 02/18/10

    at least you noticed, its a beginning. and probably it will give you headaches since that card... has given people some serious headaches.... although it seems that the latest drivers are a go!

    but that's a great pc

    EDit: so if a mod move the above post move mine also

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  18. #18
    Rotaugen2009's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: Desktop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED CORE I3, I5, ATI NEW CARDS 02/18/10

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr MM View Post
    at least you noticed, its a beginning. and probably it will give you headaches since that card... has given people some serious headaches.... although it seems that the latest drivers are a go!

    but that's a great pc
    I had the same sort of problem about a year ago when I upgraded my desktop. I got two of the fastest newest video cards, and the drivers were not well done. A month later, a driver update solved all my problems. So maybe I got lucky on the timing and the new NVIDIA drivers will prevent a lot of the headaches others have seen. The first thing I do if I get a new computer is remove bloatware, optimize the system, and make sure I have the latest drivers, even though I really want to test games on it. I figure its easiest to do this stuff while the computer doens't have anything else loaded on it so I can better see what any problem areas are.

    This will be my last upgrade for a while, so I was hoping it was a decent choice. I'll probably give my feedback here later in case anyone else is eyeing this particular computer.
    Don't blame me, I voted for Pedro!

  19. #19
    karamazovmm's Avatar スマトラ警備隊
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    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    remember that the gtx 260m is to be replaced by the gtx 260m, that is not an new card, but an old card. I would surely advise you to stay away from it.

    The gtx 260m uses the same core of the 8800 gt from desktop. This is some years old and nvidia still uses it.

    Now the gtx 360 is going to use the gt 200 core, and it would give better performance and a better graphics card.

    the gtx 360 is out there, just take a look around

    The very ugly forgive, but beauty is essential - Vinicius de Moraes

  20. #20

    Default Re: Laptop buying/upgrade guide or THE WILL IT RUN THREAD *UPDATED, CPUs, GPUs, 02/23/10

    just to let the OP know i'm playing with T6600 with ati M4650 and i can play with very high settings no aa, or ssao at 1366x786 NOt medium setting as shown in the graph, maybe 4GB of ram help though

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