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Thread: Ask Your Questions Here!

  1. #1101

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    oh ho ho. Nice distinction.

  2. #1102
    Bull3pr00f de Bodemloze's Avatar Occasio mihi fertur
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    Nobody said there are elven shortbows. There are bows and longbows, with bows being not short, but simply shorter than longbows.
    Aradan has spoken.
    /discussion

  3. #1103

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    I'm not sure why anyone would feel the need to rag on me for mentioning the movies, except maybe as an ingrained reflex reaction.
    I mentioned that ridiculous charge in The Two Towers because it's an extreme and ridiculous worst-case example of how the result flies in the face of any reasonable expectation you might have had after looking at the two forces.

    And such a clash seems likely to happen when the general basis for gameplay (lore) doesn't care too much about realism, but realism is then brought in to fill gaps that aren't covered by lore

    But Aradan cut that discussion short anyways.


  4. #1104
    Blatta Optima Maxima's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Most composite bows were not effective in damp climates, because they didn't have to be. And don't forget the mongols. They invaded pretty damp places and their composite bows never failed them.


    Also, a recurve bow is almost always a composite one, as they stringing would be too strenuous on a simple bow.




    P.S. Hollow steel bows? If middle earth's physics resemble the ones in real life to any length, they are impossible.

  5. #1105

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by Cocroach the great View Post
    P.S. Hollow steel bows? If middle earth's physics resemble the ones in real life to any length, they are impossible.
    Don't look at me, some mentioned it and I just elaborated. I have no idea where they got the idea from, but it could work.

  6. #1106

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Weren't the steel bows used by the numenoreans? Or is my memory deserting me once more in this hour of need.

  7. #1107
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by fireblade View Post
    Weren't the steel bows used by the numenoreans? Or is my memory deserting me once more in this hour of need.
    But there is, was, will, would or should be no such thing.

  8. #1108

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Tolkien mentions them. He also mentions palantiri, rings that can make people invisible, and many other things much less likely to exist than a hollow steel longbow.

  9. #1109

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Will Dunedain actually have hollow steel bows (I'm rooting for it, they seem awesome) or is this purely academical disscussion?

    Also, could someone explain if those bows could be made and what would be their advantage over regular bows?

  10. #1110

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    No, there won't be such bows in the mod, as they were the product of a more advanced civilisation that 4th age Dunedain wouldn't be able to replicate.

  11. #1111

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by Stark1 View Post
    Will Dunedain actually have hollow steel bows (I'm rooting for it, they seem awesome) or is this purely academical disscussion?

    Also, could someone explain if those bows could be made and what would be their advantage over regular bows?
    One could make a hollow steel bow. Not sure why you'd want to. Anyway to make one you'd have to take a sheet of steel and roll it into a bow shape. The only advantage of this would be the resistance of the bow, in turn that would give it a great draw strength. However I've never heard of one ever being made and the strength it would take to use one would be very considerable.

  12. #1112
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by Aradan View Post
    Tolkien mentions them. He also mentions palantiri, rings that can make people invisible, and many other things much less likely to exist than a hollow steel longbow.
    Well, magic rings and skype stones seem much more sensible than hollow steel bows.

  13. #1113

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cocroach the great View Post
    Well, magic rings and skype stones seem much more sensible than hollow steel bows.
    Why? I know a guy that could make a hollow steel bow if he really wanted to, and I paid for it.

    Anyway, I feel like a total n00b here asking this, but do all factions get infantry bodyguards?

  14. #1114

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    No, some factions don't have infantry BGs at all; Harad, Adunabar, Rhun...

  15. #1115
    Thangaror's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Quote Originally Posted by Themea View Post
    One could make a hollow steel bow. Not sure why you'd want to. Anyway to make one you'd have to take a sheet of steel and roll it into a bow shape. The only advantage of this would be the resistance of the bow, in turn that would give it a great draw strength. However I've never heard of one ever being made and the strength it would take to use one would be very considerable.
    Nope, Cocroach is rigth, it doesn't work.
    When a bow is bend, its back gets distended, its belly gets compress. Thus you have two contradicting forces on the same piece of wood/metal.
    As an exampe the yew bow serves best: yew has the extraordinary characteristic that a yew stem consists out of two kinds of wood: the old one in its core is reddish an really really hard. The younger wood on its outside is white, pretty soft and elasitc. A bow out of yew is designed in this fashion: its "belly" is made out of the hard wood, because its resistant to pressure. The back is made out of the young wood, resistant to tension. That is THE reason why yew is such a great material for bows.
    The same principle is used in a composite bow: sinews on its back, wood in the middle, horn on the belly.

    Of course you can make bows out of steel. It was very common for crossbows. But *hollow* steel is impossible. The tension arising between back and belly of the bow will be too great.
    Well, you could make a tube out of hard and soft steel... But this woulda be a really hard and complicated task.

    Quote Originally Posted by Themea
    The draw strength of the bow depends on the elasticity of the material used to make the bow. The reason the short bow is generally thought of as weak is that when made with a pliable wood, such as pine then the bow is weak. However using yew, or ironwood, would give the bow a greater resilience and therefore a greater draw strength. Also it is not possible for the Rhohirrim to have used composite bows unless they had discovered the secret of waterproof glue. Judging by the general level of tech I would say that they had not. I could be wrong.
    You cannot make a bow out of pine or fir. It'll break, no matter what. Never heard of ironwood being used, anyway in Europe the best woods are elm, ash, alder and yew of course.
    Well, the Rohirrim. Actually they are from Rhovanion, and the climate there is already pretty continental. Also Rohan was protected from the sea (and thus rain) by the Ered Nimrais. It is possible that in these places there may have been no problems with their glue. But this is speculation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cocroach the Great
    The galdhrim bows looked like the composite infantry bows, used by the perisans, in the movies.
    Uhm, no. It is pretty clear to see that the Galadhrim bows were solely made out of wood and they are pretty tall. The Persians, as most eastern people, used composite bows.


    Aradan, Rings of Power and such, this is magic! Bows are non-magical, its all physics.


    Well, now I have started a discussion
    I would rather have a memory that is fair but unfinished than one that goes on to a grievous end.

  16. #1116
    Bull3pr00f de Bodemloze's Avatar Occasio mihi fertur
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Aradan, Rings of Power and such, this is magic! Bows are non-magical, its all physics.


    Well, now I have started a discussion
    And those physics belong to a magical world, which means you can't necessarily apply "our" rules to them.
    That's what Aradan meant; it's a fantasy world. Not only the magic is unrealistic, the physics can be as well.

    /discussion

  17. #1117
    Blatta Optima Maxima's Avatar Vicarius Provinciae
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Well, but no physic can contradict themselves. Or else they'd have swords with the properties of rubber.

  18. #1118
    Bull3pr00f de Bodemloze's Avatar Occasio mihi fertur
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    If one aspect of fantasy physics isn't "right", that doesn't mean all of it should be complete fantasy.

    Just don't question fantasy physics. It just leads to discussions like this

  19. #1119
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    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    Where the did you get hollow steel bows from anyway?


    Also: tubes are plastic, not elastic, if not composite.

  20. #1120

    Default Re: Ask Your Questions Here!

    This topic has been drawn out far too much...

    Back to questions about the mod, if you will, please.

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