Good 40K Novels

[Sanguinary Guardian]

Perturabo - Reduced his Legion to Garrison Duty, and basically forced him to fight every siege.

Perturabo's lot are siege specialists, no? Why would he use any other legion in sieges? Ok, I understand the garrison duty bit, but still, when you have orders, you execute them.

Night Haunter - His choice of tactics caused the Emperor to order his arrest and trial. After he mauled Dorn he had no choice but to turn traitor.

I really don't think that Night Haunter scorned the Emperor as much as the others, but yeah, you are right in this one.

Mortarion - When the Emperor killed Mortarions adoptive father on Barbarus caused Mortarion to develop a grudge as the Emperor prevented Mortarion from fulfilling his oath of killing his father. This led to Mortarion becoming close friends with Horus.

Whinny little spoiled brat...that's how you portray Mortarion in this one. He is a big boy, he should have gone over it.

Angron - By not helping Angron defeat the enemies of his Gladiator army, and instead allowing them to die.

If the Emperor helped him, we would have another Mortarion case. Angron's warrior pride would be sorely hurt with that one.

Magnus - Nikea

Magnus disregarded the Emperor's warning, it wouldn't have gone any other way. Not to mentioned that Magnus ed up the great plan of Big E. And, as I've said in a post above, it was Horus who betrayed Magnus.

Lorgar - By telling him that He is not a God.

He isn't a God, and he had warned Lorgar numerous times before Monarchia. So again, it comes down to Lorgar's stupid stubbornness.

[Ulysses S. Grant]

Perturabo's lot are siege specialists, no? Why would he use any other legion in sieges? Ok, I understand the garrison duty bit, but still, when you have orders, you execute them.

It may be their role as siege masters, but when you split the Legion up till its breaking point, using them to garrison nearly every conquered planet and use them to fight the sieges for every campaign it will have its effect on morale and resolve. And the Iron Warriors had a lot of pride, which led them to scorn the Emperor for taking the glory away from their role.

I really don't think that Night Haunter scorned the Emperor as much as the others, but yeah, you are right in this one.

Night Haunter scorned the Emperor. Konrad Curze did not.

Whinny little spoiled brat...that's how you portray Mortarion in this one. He is a big boy, he should have gone over it.

Before you try to make me seem like the one with this interpretation, it was GW that stated this fact. And its also how THEY portray Mortarion.

If the Emperor helped him, we would have another Mortarion case. Angron's warrior pride would be sorely hurt with that one.

Possibly, but he could have offered his assistance. Even if Angron refused He would have to intervine as he needs Angron alive.

Magnus disregarded the Emperor's warning, it wouldn't have gone any other way. Not to mentioned that Magnus ed up the great plan of Big E. And, as I've said in a post above, it was Horus who betrayed Magnus.

Well if you look at Prospero Burns, the Space Wolves role as the Executioners brings up the question as to whether or not the Emperor actually wanted Magnus dead. It hints that he knew what would happen all along.

He isn't a God, and he had warned Lorgar numerous times before Monarchia. So again, it comes down to Lorgar's stupid stubbornness.

I know he isn't a god. Thats exactly what i said........

[Sanguinary Guardian]

It may be their role as siege masters, but when you split the Legion up till its breaking point, using them to garrison nearly every conquered planet and use them to fight the sieges for every campaign it will have its effect on morale and resolve. And the Iron Warriors had a lot of pride, which led them to scorn the Emperor for taking the glory away from their role.

Orders are orders. Besides, Perturabo would have joined the Warmaster simply out of spite for Dorn.

Night Haunter scorned the Emperor. Konrad Curze did not.

And there lays the greatest tragedy of the Night Lords.

Before you try to make me seem like the one with this interpretation, it was GW that stated this fact. And its also how THEY portray Mortarion.

Nonetheless, Mortarion was saved by the Emperor. That should have counted for something. Never mind that he pledged his service to the Emperor, after that.

Possibly, but he could have offered his assistance. Even if Angron refused He would have to intervine as he needs Angron alive.

Angron is a brute. He would feel offended if anyone came to his aid.

Well if you look at Prospero Burns, the Space Wolves role as the Executioners brings up the question as to whether or not the Emperor actually wanted Magnus dead. It hints that he knew what would happen all along.

Again, Russ' original mission was to apprehend Magnus not kill him. Horus ordered him to kill.

I know he isn't a god. Thats exactly what i said........

So, we come to it again, a defect in Lorgar's character.

[Ulysses S. Grant]

Again, Russ' original mission was to apprehend Magnus not kill him. Horus ordered him to kill.

And once again i will say its not as black and white as it once was. Prospero Burns hints at this...

[Outlawstar15a2]

Orders are orders. Besides, Perturabo would have joined the Warmaster simply out of spite for Dorn.





And there lays the greatest tragedy of the Night Lords.




Nonetheless, Mortarion was saved by the Emperor. That should have counted for something. Never mind that he pledged his service to the Emperor, after that.



Angron is a brute. He would feel offended if anyone came to his aid.




Again, Russ' original mission was to apprehend Magnus not kill him. Horus ordered him to kill.



So, we come to it again, a defect in Lorgar's character.

#1: You could never be a commander because you do not understand the Human side of war.

#2: Isn't Night Haunter and Konrad Curze the same man?

#3: I'm probably one of the few people in existence that would welcome the Emperor with open arms if he pulled that stunt and actually mean the gratitude. Unfortunately for Big E. Mortarion actually loved the man who raised him. Though I don't know why he would join the Emperor my guess it was out of desperation. But clearly he never forgave the Emperor for what he did.

#4: No, if the Emperor had helped Angron to save his army I do not think he would hate the Emperor as he secretly did. In the very least by providing Angron with a choice and a amiable way out of his mess would be enough to secure Angron's love and morale.

#5: The Emperor may not have ordered Magnus's death, but he did nothing to stop Horus. He is just as guilty as he passively wrote off on it with his silence.

#6: Chastising a man because he has faith is one thing, breaking him and his legion in front of his arch nemesis, his enemy's legion, and a entire world's depleted population is another. That's just wrong, and again shows the Big E has no idea how to properly lead his commanders, let alone has no social skills.

I mean let me put it this way, if I was your boss would you really appreciate me disrespecting and embarassing you in front of all your co workers you have quarrels with? Would make you want to hit me as I did so, wouldn't it? In the very least to file a complaint, wouldn't it? Be honest. How do you think Lorgar felt?

[Lord of the Drunk Penguin]

#6: Chastising a man because he has faith is one thing, breaking him and his legion in front of his arch nemesis, his enemy's legion, and a entire world's depleted population is another. That's just wrong, and again shows the Big E has no idea how to properly lead his commanders, let alone has no social skills.

That scene is great in revealing how much of a triumphalist dick the Emperor trully is.
And it's a wonderful triumph of triumphalism .

A Roman Dictator kneeling his Legions by force of thought alone. Doesn't get more grim darkian than this.

I'm still surprized how come people STILL believe the Emperor to be a good guy.
He slaughtered billions upon billions of innocents , he humiliated his children and made a mess of everything, knowing the crisis was imminent he just stood there and acted like bussiness is usual for him,
in the end, he is still being fed billions of innocent psykers so that he can keep the Highway of the Galaxy going.

Hey , compared to a fascist regime that smothers every thought into adulation of a corpse, Chaos sounds exilarating and liberatting. I'd even go for the Tau'va, everything except worshipping a dude who rules at failing...

[Outlawstar15a2]

That scene is great in revealing how much of a triumphalist dick the Emperor trully is.
And it's a wonderful triumph of triumphalism .

A Roman Dictator kneeling his Legions by force of thought alone. Doesn't get more grim darkian than this.

I'm still surprized how come people STILL believe the Emperor to be a good guy.
He slaughtered billions upon billions of innocents , he humiliated his children and made a mess of everything, knowing the crisis was imminent he just stood there and acted like bussiness is usual for him,
in the end, he is still being fed billions of innocent psykers so that he can keep the Highway of the Galaxy going.

Hey , compared to a fascist regime that smothers every thought into adulation of a corpse, Chaos sounds exilarating and liberatting. I'd even go for the Tau'va, everything except worshipping a dude who rules at failing...

You know, we always have room in Chaos if your serious.

[Lord of the Drunk Penguin]

I love how in Oath of Moment, Garro is

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

gathering up a Legion of misfits and turncoats .

In the end, he'll get The Wild Bunch on his side and with the Emperor's decree on their shoulders .

[Derpy Hooves]

I really do need to get Oath of Moment, in fact I think I will order it right now

[Sanguinary Guardian]

#1: You could never be a commander because you do not understand the Human side of war.

War is cruelty, there is no need to reform or change it. The crueler it is, the sooner it is over. There is no human side in war. You get orders, you execute them, and you try to bring your men home alive. That's about it.

#2: Isn't Night Haunter and Konrad Curze the same man?

The one and same. But, in essence the Primarch of the VIII Legion was two souls in one body. Kinda like Batman/Joker in the same body.

#3: I'm probably one of the few people in existence that would welcome the Emperor with open arms if he pulled that stunt and actually mean the gratitude. Unfortunately for Big E. Mortarion actually loved the man who raised him. Though I don't know why he would join the Emperor my guess it was out of desperation. But clearly he never forgave the Emperor for what he did.

Mortarion wanted to kill his adoptive father, for what he did to the villagers below the fog of Barbarus.

#4: No, if the Emperor had helped Angron to save his army I do not think he would hate the Emperor as he secretly did. In the very least by providing Angron with a choice and a amiable way out of his mess would be enough to secure Angron's love and morale.

Angron is the typical honour-bound warrior who would refuse any kind of help, at least from his description up until now.

#5: The Emperor may not have ordered Magnus's death, but he did nothing to stop Horus. He is just as guilty as he passively wrote off on it with his silence.

As the Emperor put it "Loyalty to Horus, is loyalty to the Emperor", so Russ had no reason not to trust Horus.

#6: Chastising a man because he has faith is one thing, breaking him and his legion in front of his arch nemesis, his enemy's legion, and a entire world's depleted population is another. That's just wrong, and again shows the Big E has no idea how to properly lead his commanders, let alone has no social skills.

I mean let me put it this way, if I was your boss would you really appreciate me disrespecting and embarassing you in front of all your co workers you have quarrels with? Would make you want to hit me as I did so, wouldn't it? In the very least to file a complaint, wouldn't it? Be honest. How do you think Lorgar felt?

Somehow, the Emperor should have gotten his message through. It is apparent in "The First Heretic" that the Big E had chastised Lorgar numerous times before, and he always dismissed it. He HAD to get the message through.

[Outlawstar15a2]

@Sanguinary: #1: Again in war things are not so black and white when commanding those below you. Yes, you have to follow orders. But as any good commander will tell you to prevent mutiny and rebellion you need to weigh everyones' personalities and take the Human factor into consideration, any commander who pushes his officers and soldiers around and does not look to their morale and mental condition invites schism. It's as plain and simple as that.

#5: Russ still needs to use common sense, he must have realized something is up and should have checked with the Emperor. He's not stupid so theres no excuse.

[Lord of the Drunk Penguin]

War is cruelty, there is no need to reform or change it. The crueler it is, the sooner it is over. There is no human side in war. You get orders, you execute them, and you try to bring your men home alive. That's about it.

Why make war in the first place? Why make war, instead of love?

When is cruelty necessary? When is genocide a necessary evil ? Are you somehow finding excuses for the Alien Holocausts the Emprah is guilty of ?

Horus Heresy series are great on this particular thing : showing the blood spilled during the Great Crusade, showing what it trully means for a Galaxy to be conquered all over again.

When reading just GW fluff, I found that the history of the Great Crusade was mainly about statistics, now thanks to Aron Dembsky Bowden and James Swallow and McNeill I see the faces of the men, women and children all killed in the name of the Emperor. And I hate him for it.

And nothing you say is going to justify war. War is murder. Plain and simple.

[Outlawstar15a2]

I never thought I'd say this because I feel like a hypocrite but I guess I'm not.

Mr. Sanguinary, I say this with all due respect and I think your a cool guy normally. But your a fethin' monster right now.

[Sanguinary Guardian]

Why make war in the first place? Why make war, instead of love?

When is cruelty necessary? When is genocide a necessary evil ? Are you somehow finding excuses for the Alien Holocausts the Emprah is guilty of ?

Horus Heresy series are great on this particular thing : showing the blood spilled during the Great Crusade, showing what it trully means for a Galaxy to be conquered all over again.

When reading just GW fluff, I found that the history of the Great Crusade was mainly about statistics, now thanks to Aron Dembsky Bowden and James Swallow and McNeill I see the faces of the men, women and children all killed in the name of the Emperor. And I hate him for it.

And nothing you say is going to justify war. War is murder. Plain and simple.

If you had to choose between an Ork life or a human life, would you choose to save the Ork? If you so believe, you deceive yourself. Who cares about the Aliens? They did not care for Humanity, they tried to destroy us. Of course when I can destroy them, I will do so with no second thoughts. We make war because our human nature is such. War is the Galaxy's hygiene.

@Outlaw. Many people have called me monster, I prefer the term cynical. Naturally you need to look to your men, as your sons, but you forget a simple fact. In the Great Crusade, only two Legions were capable of being good garrison units, the IF and the IW. So it was a choice, for the Emperor, and he chose Perturabo's lot. Don't tell me about a joint garrison of IW and IF, because they were fierce rivals.
On the other hand, I have to agree that the Emperor, played favourites, and Dorn was one of his favoured.

[Lord of the Drunk Penguin]

War is the Galaxy's hygiene.

And you're Hitler of 40k .

Man, I bet you proud of being white too.

[Sanguinary Guardian]

Man, I bet you proud of being white too.

Of course that's your assumption, based on having a very fruitful and important conversation about a TT game's sci-fi universe, in which we play battles with little plastic men and dice. WOW!

[Outlawstar15a2]

Of course that's your assumption, base on having a very fruitful and important conversation about a sci-fi universe, in which we play games with little plastic men. WOW!

Yeah, I kinda agree with him LotDP your kinda hitting below the belt now. Keep it clean and honest people.

[Lord of the Drunk Penguin]

Of course that's your assumption, based on having a very fruitful and important conversation about a TT game's sci-fi universe, in which we play battles with little plastic men and dice. WOW!

Yeah man ! You'd be surprised how many inner demons these tiny tiny things pull out of you !

I'm just a good listener that's alll. BUT I don't like what I'm hearing from you.

You fit well into a distopia. Trouble is, you're not living in one. Are you?

[Ulysses S. Grant]

There is no need to get racial LotDP. That Hitler thing is also uncalled for.

This is not the place....

[Sanguinary Guardian]

Yeah man ! You'd be surprised how many inner demons these tiny tiny things pull out of you !

I'm just a good listener that's alll. BUT I don't like what I'm hearing from you.

You fit well into a distopia. Trouble is, you're not living in one. Are you?

We are talking about a miniature wargame, man. You don't like my views on the fluff, then that's your opinion, but you really need to chill out. It's not like I am Sanguinius and you Lorgar or something. All of this is just for fun.